bibo01 Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 I would like to kindly ask you to take part to a simple listening test which we have already done in Italy and I would like to extend to you. http://uploading.com/files/ab15emea/test.rar/ At the above address there are 2 files - A and B - 2 minutes each, free samples at 24/96khz. Please listen to them carefully and report here if you hear any difference between them and, eventually, your preference. Thank you How curious are you? Link to comment
esldude Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Quick listen three times each on a secondary system I have, I don't have a preference. Will try tomorrow on my main speakers and see what I think. And always keep in mind: Cognitive biases, like seeing optical illusions are a sign of a normally functioning brain. We all have them, it’s nothing to be ashamed about, but it is something that affects our objective evaluation of reality. Link to comment
crisnee Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 You might add a bit more info as to why you're doing this, what it's about, that sort of thing. Even I don't like to go into anything completely blind--no double blind test pun intended, and I'll try just about anything. Anyway, it might help you get a few more responses, or maybe just criticism. Who knows--actually I do, criticism. However, the odds are that no matter what you do, you won't get many takers, particularly where it comes to folks that can hear everything. -Chris Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 16, 2012 Author Share Posted April 16, 2012 Intentionally I would like not to give to much info on the files. However, it all started on the possibility to discriminate differences in listening tests. To be honest the test I suggested cannot be scientifically rigorous. It is a field test and the more people take part, also non-audiophile, the better. Obviously, at the end the "secret" will be revealed...well, it is not much of a secret but at least it's fun :-) How curious are you? Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 I'm surprised that I do not get much response here, after getting 19 pages of responses and measurements in Italy :-) There is no trick in this test. Please, just play randomly the two files...and make your comments. In the end, I will obviously provide statistical details and abundant measuremnts (even beyond a simple software matching or NTD). Thanks for your support How curious are you? Link to comment
PeterSt Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Hey there ... I'm always in for these kind of things, despite I hate A-B stuff. Anyway, I did it; Listened to both only once upsampled to 768 and to my idea both sound good. I would have said very good if it weren't so that I thought hearing distortion of the snare drums through the basses. This looked more the case in A than in B. Next I played the first 10-15 seconds of both another time, and I did the same while at their native rate (96). In this occasion I thought I heard a differentation in the zoom-zoom-zoom-zoom of the basses on B where the even measure is somewhat higher pitched than the odd ones (so, just a slight movement of the finger on the neck). I didn't notice this on much on A, also not when I played it for the second 10-15 second occasion. If I *had* to chose one I'd chose B for being better. If money were involved I'd rather say they are equal. So, worth nothing much. Btw, I never looked at your Italian website or anywhere, and maybe it would have been better if we don't post about it openly ? well, I guess at least I just did. :-) Regards, Peter Lush^3-e Lush^2 Blaxius^2.5 Ethernet^3 HDMI^2 XLR^2 XXHighEnd (developer) Phasure NOS1 24/768 Async USB DAC (manufacturer) Phasure Mach III Audio PC with Linear PSU (manufacturer) Orelino & Orelo MKII Speakers (designer/supplier) Link to comment
jhwalker Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 I took a listen and at first thought A sounded a bit more "raw" and a bit more ragged at the top. B overall sounds more "solid" and perhaps a bit rolled-off in treble. For general listening, I preferred B, though it almost felt like something were missing in comparison with A. When I did a real ABX on them, though, I couldn't reliably detect a difference so can't truly say I have a preference. So there you have it - will be interested when you post the results and the "secret" John Walker - IT Executive Headphone - SonicTransporter i9 running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable Ethernet > mRendu Roon endpoint > Topping D90 > Topping A90d > Dan Clark Expanse / HiFiMan H6SE v2 / HiFiman Arya Stealth Home Theater / Music -SonicTransporter i9 running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable HDMI > Denon X3700h > Anthem Amp for front channels > Revel F208-based 5.2.4 Atmos speaker system Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 18, 2012 Author Share Posted April 18, 2012 Please specify your selection-preference. If you cannot hear/perceive any difference between the 2 files, they are "I"(identical), otherwise they are "nI" (non-identical) and eventually A or B for personal preference (if you feel like). @esldude can I put you down for "I"? @Peterst you cannot have it both ways. Can I put you down for nI-B ? @jhwalker in your view are they different or not? Can I put you down for nI-B ? Thanks How curious are you? Link to comment
esldude Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 @esldude can I put you down for "I"? No, haven't listened on my good rig yet. If you can give this evening, I will see what I think. If you can't wait, then yes, so far I am an "I". And always keep in mind: Cognitive biases, like seeing optical illusions are a sign of a normally functioning brain. We all have them, it’s nothing to be ashamed about, but it is something that affects our objective evaluation of reality. Link to comment
PeterSt Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 @Peterst you cannot have it both ways. Can I put you down for nI-B No you can't. Read jhwalker's response; I almost said the same. And if I didn't say that, I do now. :-) Edit : No, I didn't say that, but I sure thought that something was not right in B either. I forgot why. But it's ok with nI-B. Lush^3-e Lush^2 Blaxius^2.5 Ethernet^3 HDMI^2 XLR^2 XXHighEnd (developer) Phasure NOS1 24/768 Async USB DAC (manufacturer) Phasure Mach III Audio PC with Linear PSU (manufacturer) Orelino & Orelo MKII Speakers (designer/supplier) Link to comment
esldude Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Okay, got a chance to listen on better equipment. There still isn't much between them. I too would choose B. The A file seems to have a hint of low level noise or slight fogginess around things at lower levels. But it is quite minor. Something about it sounds like it was from an analog source. Maybe tape or even an LP with some post processing for noise, pops and such. ni-B is my choice in any case. And always keep in mind: Cognitive biases, like seeing optical illusions are a sign of a normally functioning brain. We all have them, it’s nothing to be ashamed about, but it is something that affects our objective evaluation of reality. Link to comment
wdomeika Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Are there more free downloads? In the USA free is the preferred way to download . Cheers, Bill Mac Mini 2011, 60 gb SSD, 8gb ram; PureMusic & BitPerfect; Wavelength Audio Cosecant V3 DAC; Wireworld Silver Starlight usb interconnect; McIntosh C2200 preamp; pair of McIntosh MC252 SS amps run as monoblocks; vintage MC240 Tube amp and 50th Anniversary MC275 tube amps; Krell LAT-2\'s on Sound Anchors; JL Audio F112 subwoofer; Nirvana SX ltd interconnects and speaker cables and power cords; PS Audio P5 Link to comment
PeterSt Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Something about it sounds like it was from an analog source. Maybe tape or even an LP with some post processing for noise, pops and such. Hey, I didn't think about this. It (analogue source) would explain why I "judge" it as good (which I normally do not from Hires). Especially the noise filter could explain the distortion I perceived from track A (although I didn't perceive any typicle noise reduction anomalies). Lush^3-e Lush^2 Blaxius^2.5 Ethernet^3 HDMI^2 XLR^2 XXHighEnd (developer) Phasure NOS1 24/768 Async USB DAC (manufacturer) Phasure Mach III Audio PC with Linear PSU (manufacturer) Orelino & Orelo MKII Speakers (designer/supplier) Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 19, 2012 Author Share Posted April 19, 2012 @wdomeika what do you mean? It's a free download, perhaps you have to just wait a while. @PeterST Hi, I would appreciate your measurement contribution when the time to reveal the "secret" comes. How curious are you? Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 20, 2012 Author Share Posted April 20, 2012 For now the results are: I : - nIA: - nIB: 3 Not enough yet..please more comments are welcome How curious are you? Link to comment
jhwalker Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 Much as I hate to make a decision given I was unable to ABX the two files on subsequent hearings I have to say my first listen told me B was "better". I still think A may be the more accurate reproduction of the original performance, but B sounded more pleasing to me the first time I played the files. John Walker - IT Executive Headphone - SonicTransporter i9 running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable Ethernet > mRendu Roon endpoint > Topping D90 > Topping A90d > Dan Clark Expanse / HiFiMan H6SE v2 / HiFiman Arya Stealth Home Theater / Music -SonicTransporter i9 running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable HDMI > Denon X3700h > Anthem Amp for front channels > Revel F208-based 5.2.4 Atmos speaker system Link to comment
ringenesherre Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Tried on my notebook speakers (obviously nothing to hear), my home setup (DacMagic, Genelec monitors, at different volume levels, no differences), and on my work setup (Focusrite Scarlett, headphones, nothing here, too). Both fast switching and listening the full two minutes. So count me as definitely considering them to sound equal. After listening I also took a look at the files (even wrote some quick analysis script counting and quantifying the differences). I won't share my insights prematurely here, though Cheers, Peter Home: Apple Macbook Pro 17" --Mini-Toslink--> Cambridge Audio DacMagic --XLR--> 2x Genelec 8020B Work: Apple Macbook Pro 15" --USB--> Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 --1/4\"--> Superlux HD668B / 2x Genelec 6010A Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 22, 2012 Author Share Posted April 22, 2012 ...After listening I also took a look at the files (even wrote some quick analysis script counting and quantifying the differences). I won't share my insights prematurely here, though Cheers, Peter Thanks, also for remaining quiet for influencing others. Now it is: I: 1 nIA: - nIB: 3 How curious are you? Link to comment
Brian A Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 I find listening tests interesting and challenging, however I am bowing out of this one for technical reasons. After spending 30 minutes downloading, virus scanning and downloading the software to try to open the files, I just gave up. Simpler access to the files would have kept me playing along. Peachtree Audio DAC-iT, Dynaco Stereo 70 Amp w/ Curcio triode cascode conversion, MCM Systems .7 Monitors Link to comment
ringenesherre Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Simpler access to the files would have kept me playing along. Simpler than a RAR archive of two WAV files??? Not sure I get you ... Cheers, Peter Home: Apple Macbook Pro 17" --Mini-Toslink--> Cambridge Audio DacMagic --XLR--> 2x Genelec 8020B Work: Apple Macbook Pro 15" --USB--> Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 --1/4\"--> Superlux HD668B / 2x Genelec 6010A Link to comment
ecwl Posted April 22, 2012 Share Posted April 22, 2012 Not sure why. But I choose nI-B, on my Benchmark DAC1 and Sennheiser HD650. I do get what Brain A is saying though. It was a hassle to try this out. First, the download site has so many places to click on, it's confusing how to download the file for free. Second, the download speed is on the slower end. After all, we are downloading 24/96 WAV. Third, it's in RAR so I had to download and install Razilla Free UnRAR before I can unzip the files. Finally, 99% of my music collection is classical music and I'm not a big fan of the performance here. That makes listening back and forth painful. But it's nice to try these things out and learn about my own subjective biases. I'm sure the results will be interesting. Link to comment
bibo01 Posted April 22, 2012 Author Share Posted April 22, 2012 Now it is: I: 1 nIA: - nIB: 4 How curious are you? Link to comment
cradman Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 I would like to kindly ask you to take part to a simple listening test which we have already done in Italy and I would like to extend to you. http://uploading.com/files/ab15emea/test.rar/ At the above address there are 2 files - A and B - 2 minutes each, free samples at 24/96khz. Please listen to them carefully and report here if you hear any difference between them and, eventually, your preference. Thank you I tried to download the files, did that and couldn't open them. Also, many people are reluctant to open files because of fear of viruses. That may be part of the reason you are not getting much response. Best regards, Conrad Casser Link to comment
PeterSt Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 Finally, 99% of my music collection is classical music and I'm not a big fan of the performance here. That makes listening back and forth painful. I don't get it. So, this *is* classical I'd say, and it even sounds very nice (to me). First, the download site has so many places to click on, it's confusing how to download the file for free. But maybe you ended up with some Black Sabbath ? Lush^3-e Lush^2 Blaxius^2.5 Ethernet^3 HDMI^2 XLR^2 XXHighEnd (developer) Phasure NOS1 24/768 Async USB DAC (manufacturer) Phasure Mach III Audio PC with Linear PSU (manufacturer) Orelino & Orelo MKII Speakers (designer/supplier) Link to comment
ringenesherre Posted April 23, 2012 Share Posted April 23, 2012 Hoping I don't breach any laws: http://lynx.imada.sdu.dk/~petersk/A.wav http://lynx.imada.sdu.dk/~petersk/B.wav They are 100% clean WAV files, no malicious code, nothing to unpack Cheers, Peter Home: Apple Macbook Pro 17" --Mini-Toslink--> Cambridge Audio DacMagic --XLR--> 2x Genelec 8020B Work: Apple Macbook Pro 15" --USB--> Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 --1/4\"--> Superlux HD668B / 2x Genelec 6010A Link to comment
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