Schiit Yggdrasil Vs PS Audio Directstream Junior

[Roy724]

PS Audio had an issue with their accounting office and could not ship my Directstream until the next day. However, because they promised to have it to me by Friday the upgraded my shipping to next day delivery for free. Do you know how much it cost to ship a 30lb package next day delivery? That's expensive. Plus they are sending me a free shirt as a thank you. What an amazing company!

 

The only reason I waited 2 freaking months on the Yggdrasil is because I thought that Schiit must be a good company not to compromise on their parts and use something different. It shows their level of commitment to the quality of their product. Nonetheless, when they informed me it was delayed for a third month until who knows when, that was end of my patience. A good, ethical company would never make a customer wait 3 months or longer for a product that cost thousands of dollars. I don't care how committed they are. That kind of wait time is simply unacceptable. It's bad service, plain and simple. If you went to the best restaurant in the city and they said you had to wait in line 10 hours to get in would that be okay just because they don't compromise on the cooking of the food? That's how I feel about Schiit. I don't care how good the product is when the wait time is this long. It's just not worth the frustration.

 

After I get the Directstream and listen to it for a while I will update everyone with my impressions. Let you know if it was worth the cost. Or if I will send it back.

[diecaster]

I know a lot of people don’t believe in it, but the DirectStream needs several hundred hours of burn-in to sound it’s best. Don’t judge it on how it sounds right out of the box!

[davide256]

11 hours ago, Roy724 said:

PS Audio had an issue with their accounting office and could not ship my Directstream until the next day. However, because they promised to have it to me by Friday the upgraded my shipping to next day delivery for free. Do you know how much it cost to ship a 30lb package next day delivery? That's expensive. Plus they are sending me a free shirt as a thank you. What an amazing company!

 

The only reason I waited 2 freaking months on the Yggdrasil is because I thought that Schiit must be a good company not to compromise on their parts and use something different. It shows their level of commitment to the quality of their product. Nonetheless, when they informed me it was delayed for a third month until who knows when, that was end of my patience. A good, ethical company would never make a customer wait 3 months or longer for a product that cost thousands of dollars. I don't care how committed they are. That kind of wait time is simply unacceptable. It's bad service, plain and simple. If you went to the best restaurant in the city and they said you had to wait in line 10 hours to get in would that be okay just because they don't compromise on the cooking of the food? That's how I feel about Schiit. I don't care how good the product is when the wait time is this long. It's just not worth the frustration.

 

After I get the Directstream and listen to it for a while I will update everyone with my impressions. Let you know if it was worth the cost. Or if I will send it back.

Sh**t happens. I waited 6 months for delivery of my MG 1.7's when they first came out because they had die problems.  Wouldn't surprise me if Schitt

had the better DAC circuit design but PS Audio aced them out because of superior power supply design. I'm just not impressed by what you see

under the hood for power supply layout and components.

[rodrigaj]

12 hours ago, diecaster said:

I know a lot of people don’t believe in it, but the DirectStream needs several hundred hours of burn-in to sound it’s best. Don’t judge it on how it sounds right out of the box!

200 hours burn in for me with most noticeable changes occuring within 100 hours.

 

@Roy724

Let me start by saying that I really, really  like PS Audio as a company. I purchased the PS Audio DirectStream DAC with BridgeII in Dec '17 and in the 80's I owned one of their amplifiers. They are a great USA company.

 

Having said that...

They lack a general up to date understanding of how the PS Audio DSDAC can be used in a modern LAN connected world with renderers, software and the various issues associated with the interoperability of them.

 

If your issues do not pertain specifically to mConnect / BridgeII / PSAudio DSDAC, you are better off seeking help/information here on these forums.

 

I don't wish to dis PS Audio but that has been my experience personally. I saved myself the inconvenience and expense of sending back my DirectStream to the factory for an "evaluation" by reaching out to the good folks at Sonore. As it turned out it was a very simple fix to my playback routine.

 

I'm sure you will not regret your purchase - it is a great DAC.

[Latenight]

I recently aquirred a direct stream jr and I am totally blown away by it. Full disclosure I was banned by schiit for protesting their ridiculous policy of refusing to talk to customers on the phone and complaining about a product I had issues with that they could not readily reproduce. On the flip side ps audio answers every time I call and has made any issue a non issue. Why would anyone want to do business with a company that is so elitist that they refuse to ever talk on the phone is beyond me. 

[Ralf11]

they may want a record of the interaction

[Cortes]

I don't understand these comments against customer service of Shiit, comparing it with PS Audio. The thing is basics economics. Both sell products (at least their reference DACs) of an equivalent quality, and one charges double than the other, so what company is going to invest more in public relations?. 

 

 

[Latenight]

I understand the logic of what you are saying but in certain situations such as mine i begged them to have

the decency to talk to me on the phone given all i had been thru and they refused. not trying to go off topic but that was/is part of why i like ps audio is their customer service. only after i publicly called out schiit did they offer me a full refund with no restock fee on my defective items. after that they banned me. how can i not let others know about this experience? 

[rrwwss52]

I own a PS DS Jr.  It replaced a Schiit Gungnir MB (Gumby).  I like the Direct Stream Jr better than the Gumby.  I have DSD albums, so that makes a difference for me.  If you are strictly interested in PCM, and don’t need a bridge, the Yggy is a great choice,

 

 

[Blake]

47 minutes ago, Latenight said:

after that they banned me

 

Banned you from what?

[Blake]

sorry, double post

[Latenight]

After having an issue with a schiit product, I was told I would be charged a restocking fee. I complained on another forum and they removed them restock fee and refunded my shipping. After that they told me to take my business elsewhere. I was leery from day one about doing business with a company who refused to talk on the phone , I am old school what can I say. Ps audio customer service was a major contributing factor in my choosing them. 

[rodrigaj]

@Latenight

I'm really curious about your experience with Schiit.

 

You had a defective product which you purchased from them brand new? When you reached out to them they would not talk to you on the phone? They then told you to ship it back, the charge for which they covered? Then they banned you from ever buying another product from them?

 

Huh?? Why didn't they just replace it? Or test it?

 

I don't understand what could be gained by "'banning" you from buying from them again.

 

Maybe, I'm misunderstanding the transaction.

[rrwwss52]

55 minutes ago, Latenight said:

After having an issue with a schiit product, I was told I would be charged a restocking fee. I complained on another forum and they removed them restock fee and refunded my shipping. After that they told me to take my business elsewhere. I was leery from day one about doing business with a company who refused to talk on the phone , I am old school what can I say. Ps audio customer service was a major contributing factor in my choosing them. 

 

Good point.  With respect to Customer service delivery, there is no comparison.  I too had issues with the Schiit email only customer service.  I ended up cancelling a Schiit purchase one time when manufacturing delays were extended repeatedly without warning.  PS Audio on the other hand is far more responsive, by both phone and forum.  If PS Audio is going to take a month to ship, they tell you up front.  Schiit started at 7 days, extended to 14, then to 21 days, and I cancelled after it wasn’t shipped.  No cancellation fee was applied, so I was only out some time and energy.

[Latenight]

13 minutes ago, rodrigaj said:

@Latenight

I'm really curious about your experience with Schiit.

 

You had a defective product which you purchased from them brand new? When you reached out to them they would not talk to you on the phone? They then told you to ship it back, the charge for which they covered? Then they banned you from ever buying another product from them?

I had a defective product that i purchased from them brand new. i paid to ship the item both ways. they looked at the product for no more than 48 hours and could not reproduce the problem. they then concluded there was no problem with the item and  refunded me for the item but did not refund my shipping and charged me a restocking fee. i called them out on this on another forum and they refunded the restocking fees and my shipping. they then banned from ever ordering from them again. 

13 minutes ago, rodrigaj said:

 

Huh?? Why didn't they just replace it? Or test it?

they said they tested it but could  not reproduce my issue. my response was that the problem was intermentant and they had not tested it for long enough, which i stand by. 

13 minutes ago, rodrigaj said:

 

I don't understand what could be gained by "'banning" you from buying from them again.

they clearly were not interested in me literally begging them to talk on the phone with them in repeated emails

and the bad press they got on the other forum from me publicly showing their total lack of care or concern for the customer/customer service. 

13 minutes ago, rodrigaj said:

 

Maybe, I'm misunderstanding the transaction.

i hope that clears it up for you. 

[Latenight]

very people in the high end audio world give two cents about their customer or customer service. once you find a company or store that actually cares stick with them. 

[rodrigaj]

2 hours ago, Cortes said:

I don't understand these comments against customer service of Shiit, comparing it with PS Audio. The thing is basics economics. Both sell products (at least their reference DACs) of an equivalent quality, and one charges double than the other, so what company is going to invest more in public relations?. 

 

 

Then why would you bother to open up a brick and mortar store (appropriately called "The Schiiter") if you don't want to talk to your customers?

[rodrigaj]

Also...why in the world would you post your phone number on your contact us web page if you don't want to talk to people.

 

I see they emphasize email, but they certainly don't say flat out, "we don't take phone calls."

[duxservit]

On 8/20/2018 at 12:38 PM, Roy724 said:

I was convinced to buy the Yggdrasil but now I'm having second thoughts. Maybe the Directstream Sr. is worth buying. The main reason why is because of the firmware upgrades. If they do come out with a new dac some of it's technology is probably cross over to the Sr through an update. With another update or two the Sr. may exceed the Yggdrasil. Also, I use an Oppo UPD 203 as my cd player and it has a music only hdmi out which could connect to the Sr.'s I2S connection. Maybe that would sound better than optical? I also like the idea of the bridge. If I'm understanding it correctly, I can connect the Sr. to ethernet then my laptop can wirelessly play music through my router to it. I assume that means I can wirelessly stream Spotify and You Tube music as well. It's very tempting but that cost difference is outrageous and I don't buy used. Which brings me back to the Junior. I wonder how much detail would I lose with Junior over Yggy? Only maybe 10% or would it be much more like 30% or more? This is a tough decision.

 

Subjectively, there is no comparison between DirectStream Snr and Yggdrasil. The DS Snr is a great DAC, and each firmware upgrade pushes the envelope a bit more. If you don’t like a particular upgrade, you can re-install the previous version. But, a new DS Snr is about 3x the price of the Yggdrasil. On the plus side, there are lots of used DS Snr in excellent condition for up to half-price. It’s a well-engineered DAC done by a very knowledgeable engineer (Ted Smith). 

 

FYI here are some measurements of the Yggdrasil:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-schiit-yggdrasil-v2-dac.3607/

 

[Latenight]

32 minutes ago, rodrigaj said:

Also...why in the world would you post your phone number on your contact us web page if you don't want to talk to people.

 

I see they emphasize email, but they certainly don't say flat out, "we don't take phone calls."

They have a phone number but they don't answer it and there's a disclaimer that says that they will not talk about technical problems on the phone only descriptions of products.

[diecaster]

7 minutes ago, duxservit said:

 

Subjectively, there is no comparison between DirectStream Snr and Yggdrasil. The DS Snr is a great DAC, and each firmware upgrade pushes the envelope a bit more. If you don’t like a particular upgrade, you can re-install the previous version. But, a new DS Snr is about 3x the price of the Yggdrasil. On the plus side, there are lots of used DS Snr in excellent condition for up to half-price. It’s a well-engineered DAC done by a very knowledgeable engineer (Ted Smith). 

 

FYI here are some measurements of the Yggdrasil:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/review-and-measurements-of-schiit-yggdrasil-v2-dac.3607/

 

 

 

I have owned both DACs and I don't buy our premise at all. Performance wise there is little between the DACs.

 

Ignore what Amir publishes.....

[Roy724]

I feel sick to my stomach with what I'm about to write. I love PS Audio and I think they are an excellent company. Before I bought the Directstream this week my old dac is a Cambridge Audio Dacmagic Plus. The Dacmagic is a $350 dac, the Directstream is a $6,000 dac. Today when I got the Directstream, I turned it on and let it warm up for an hour before listening. When I listened, my first impression was shock...it sounds identical to the Dacmagic! I spend several hours listening and all the reviews are b.s. This dac is has no more detail, resolution or transparency than the Dacmagic to my ears. The soundstage is the same, imaging the same, separation of instruments the same, timber and tonal characteristics the same, everything is the same. I tried out all of the inputs with different sources and a variety of files, streaming and CD with different genres of music. I used Elac Uni Fi UF5 tower speakers with an Onkyo TX-NR676 receiver connected to the Directstream with analog RCA cables. Also I used my Sennheiser HD800 headphones with a Schiit Lyr 2 headphone amp connected with RCA.

 

After hearing no difference I decided to A/B the Dacmagic with the Directstream. The only difference I can hear is that ironically the Dacmagic sounds louder and punchier; it actually sounds better to me than the Directstream. And yes, I have the volume on the Directstream turned up to 100. The Directstream sounds softer. Other than those differences, though, they sound the same. I am so upset and confused.

 

Are all the reviewers paid to write a bunch of exaggeration and fluff? Why do some owners think this dac sounds so great? I know someone is going to reply and tell me about hundreds of hours of burn it. Seriously, if I pay $6,000 for a dac it should sound good right out of the box. Maybe make some subtle improvements over time but it should sound better than this.

 

I expected this dac to sound night and day different and better than the Dacmagic. The salespeople indicated that it would. Well, it does not. I feel like I got suckered. It's a beautiful, well built dac and I really love how it looks. But if it don't sound right then what's the point. Does anyone have any input for me? Why does a $6,000 dac sound like a $350 dac? What is the problem? Do I have it hooked up wrong or something? I'm pretty sure it's connected right.

 

I have no idea what to say. I spent months obsessing over a new dac and doing hundreds of hours of research. Does the Yggdrasil sound different and better? From what people say the Directstream and Yggdrasil basically sound the same so that means that the Yggdrasil also sounds like a $350 dac. I just don't get it. Can someone help me out?

 

All I do know is, if anyone reading this is thinking about buying a high end dac you might want to think twice. I'm not the type to believe that all dacs sound the same because my Schiit Modi dac sounds nothing at all like the Dacmagic. The Dacmagic sound totally different and better than the Modi. Yet the Directstream disappoints me. I expected the moon for that kind of money. Are differences between dacs simply THAT subtle? If they are, then WHY in the world would someone spend $6,000 on one. I did because I expected it to totally obliterate the Dacmagic in sound quality. Boy was I wrong. Hopefully my experience can help others out there. If you want a great dac, just buy a Cambridge Audio Dacmagic Plus. Honestly, it sounds almost exactly the same as the Direcstream and maybe the same as the Yggdrasil too I suppose.

[diecaster]

It doesn’t sound good out of the box. You need to get a couple of hundred hours on it. Just give it some time.  Be patient. 

[rayl1234]

So just return it... psa is great about returns and even pays for shipping.  https://www.psaudio.com/audition/

 

 

[audio.bill]

Many DSD users have reported similar initial impressions, only to then be thrilled after allowing several hundred hours of burn in. I know it sounds ridiculous to most of us and we'd all like our gear to sound ideal right out of the box with a bit of warm up time, but this piece in particular is known to have a long break in period. As long as you purchased it direct from PS Audio with their 30 day return privilege you have nothing much to lose by giving it a shot to reach its potential before returning it and never really knowing for sure if it would have improved. You don't need to listen to it all that time, just have it locked to an active digital signal and connected to your amp's input, you can even leave the amp (or volume) off. Let it run like that locked to a digital signal 24 hours a day, that's my suggestion. Patience is a virtue, but most audiophiles (myself included) want instant gratification with their system.