Schiit Yggdrasil Vs PS Audio Directstream Junior

[diecaster]

@Roy724

 

Don't listen to the salesmen. The DirectStream is indeed more detailed than the DirectStream Jr. but it is not more detailed than the latest Yggdrasil. Yggdrasil is a GREAT DAC!!! It is better than the DirectStream Jr and equal to the DirectStream. Differences between DACs are subtle to begin with. The differences between Yggdrasil and the DirectStream are minute. If you don't need DSD or MQA, and budget is of any concern, Yggdrasil is the obvious choice.

[Milt99]

Roy724, in addition to Robert Harley's purely subjective review, take a look at the Stereophile review of the Schiit w\ measurements & further comments by John Atkinson

yggdrasil

[diecaster]

17 minutes ago, Milt99 said:

Roy724, in addition to Robert Harley's purely subjective review, take a look at the Stereophile review of the Schiit w\ measurements & further comments by John Atkinson

yggdrasil

 

First, that is with the old version of Yggdrasil and the new one measures better. Second, measurements don't mean a whole lot. Subjective reviews from quality reviewers mean more than all the measurements in the world.

[tapatrick]

14 hours ago, Cortes said:

 

I'd love to purchase a PD Directstream, but they are only a sane option  in US, where good deals with warranty transfer are possible.  In Europe, their price is ridiculous. 

In europe you are starting to see PS Audio DACs under £3000. I got a brand new Junior with transferred warranty for £3000 6 months ago...

[Roy724]

For full disclosure, there's another reason why I posted this question. Almost 2 month ago I ordered a Schiit Yggdrasil. They said it was backordered due to a "global parts shortage." I've been waiting nearly 2 months and they keep pushing the backorder date back further and further. Needless to say, I'm furious! They claim they will ship on the 30th this month but my gut tells me they will delay it yet another few weeks or a month or longer because they've been posting and changing the date. PS Audio is not having this problem. They have the DS dacs in stock and I could have one in 2 or 3 days. Yet I'm asking myself, is it worth spending $6,000 on a Directstream out of frustration with Schiit? PS Audio is without a doubt the superior company and they have that tempting firmware update. But that is SO much money. Still, I'm wondering when I will ever get my Yggdrasil? How many months will I have to wait and is it really worth this frustration? I almost feel like there is some b.s. to this "global parts shortage." Why is it not effecting PS Audio? All I know is, I'm very angry with Schiit.

[SuperRoo]

I know your pain. I placed my Yggy upgrade order in March. Currently #50 of 189 on the waiting list. I'm going to be patient because it will be worth it in the long run.

[Cortes]

39 minutes ago, tapatrick said:

In europe you are starting to see PS Audio DACs under £3000. I got a brand new Junior with transferred warranty for £3000 6 months ago...

 

This is what a I call a US deal for DirecStream:

https://www.upscaleaudio.com/collections/dacs/products/ps-audio-directstream-dac-used-1

 

but, the good guys at PS Audio don't know that  outside US people are not allow to bear arms and use  110V.. Unfortunately there is not a clean solution for the voltage/frequency conversion. 

 

 

[Roy724]

SuperRu...you've got to be freakin' kidding me! Please tell me you are exaggerating. You mean to tell me you ordered one in March and your still waiting!!! If that is true, I am very seriously thinking about ordering either the DS Jr. or Sr. Maybe I can live with the Junior? Is the difference between it and the Yggy really THAT big? Or I could just go crazy and get the Sr. but my family members might kick me out if they find out I spent that much. lol How could Schiit be doing this to their customers??? No excuse for this kind of service. None.

[SuperRoo]

Please reread my post. I have a very nice Yggy. Waiting for the upgrade.

[Roy724]

I emailed Schiit and they basically told me they are not likely going to ship by the 30th. They did not get the parts in yet and indicated it could be weeks longer. I almost ordered the used Directstream from the Upscale Audio link above but then I read their return policy. It says all sales are final for used products and if it's DOA they appear to pay for repairs and may or may not offer a refund. That is not a company I want to do business with on a product this expensive. Who knows what could be wrong with it. I don't trust buying used. Quite a few people gave that store poor reviews too. I'm still thinking about buying a Directstream Sr. new. I'm just worried about my family finding out the cost. Very tough decision. Should I just wait several more weeks for the Yggdrasil...or months?

[Roy724]

Okay, before I order the Directstream Sr I want a definitive answer. On a quiet recording, will I be able to hear the movement of a performer's clothing? Some reviews of the Yggdrasil claim this mythic level of detail. Like you can hear the fingernails of a pianist brushing against the keys. I'm the type of audiophile who is more into "sounds" rather than music. I'm an ASMR fanatic. Yggdrasil reviews claim levels of sound that seem almost unrealistic. Yet if true, can the DS Sr. also produce that level of sound. That's the main thing I want out of my dac: I want to hear subtle sounds I've never heard before more than the music itself.

[Ralf11]

Spandex or Woolen Tweeds?

[tapatrick]

7 hours ago, Cortes said:

 

This is what a I call a US deal for DirecStream:

https://www.upscaleaudio.com/collections/dacs/products/ps-audio-directstream-dac-used-1

 

but, the good guys at PS Audio don't know that  outside US people are not allow to bear arms and use  110V.. Unfortunately there is not a clean solution for the voltage/frequency conversion. 

 

 

If the price is right, it's worth asking PS Audio if they will convert the voltage. I had mine done for $70 plus shipping as I bought it from a US citizen when was moving to europe...

[Cortes]

3 hours ago, tapatrick said:

If the price is right, it's worth asking PS Audio if they will convert the voltage. I had mine done for $70 plus shipping as I bought it from a US citizen when was moving to europe...

 

I didn't know it was possible. That's very good. I'll contact PS, and they accept and try to catch some opportunity during some travel to the states. 

 

Thanks. 

[rickca]

8 hours ago, Roy724 said:

I want to hear subtle sounds I've never heard before more than the music itself.

I'm sure you know that system performance depends on much more than just the DAC.  If you buy new from PS Audio, they have a 30-day hassle free return policy according to their website.  You can buy a lot of things with the price difference between Yggdrasil and Directstream.  Both units have very enthusiastic owners.

[tapatrick]

2 hours ago, Cortes said:

 

I didn't know it was possible. That's very good. I'll contact PS, and they accept and try to catch some opportunity during some travel to the states. 

 

Thanks. 

PS audio are very helpful. Good luck!

[Hyperion]

On 8/20/2018 at 8:29 AM, TubeLover said:

However,  to say that those DAC's still "provide a platform under development, where both the software and hardware is constantly improved" may be a stretch at this point in time. They have done that for a number of years now since the DAC was produced, and far longer than one would reasonably expect. It can't go on forever. And word is that they are already well underway in developing a new dac, with a separate power supply, and new technology. I personally wouldn't expect much more in the way of upgrades to the older platforms. 

 

 

JC 

 

PS Audio have provided their owners with continuous updates since the PerfectWave DAC was introduced almost ten years ago (which is now the DirectStream DAC - to which you can upgrade from your PW DAC). There's nothing that indicates that PS Audio won't be able to keep the current DS DAC up to date for years to come.

 

The new DAC that you're referring too (which hasn't been officially confirmed) will be a new SOTA model above the current DirectStream in the hierarchy.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

 

[Hyperion]

15 hours ago, Cortes said:

 

This is what a I call a US deal for DirecStream:

https://www.upscaleaudio.com/collections/dacs/products/ps-audio-directstream-dac-used-1

 

but, the good guys at PS Audio don't know that  outside US people are not allow to bear arms and use  110V.. Unfortunately there is not a clean solution for the voltage/frequency conversion. 

 

 

 

You need to add local European VAT (usually 20-25% in Europe) + the cost of shipping and insurance to the price as well. Then there's the voltage issue + the lower second hand value of an imported unit + the potential hassle of service and warranty issues...

 

It's basically not worth it.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

[Hyperion]

11 hours ago, Roy724 said:

Okay, before I order the Directstream Sr I want a definitive answer. On a quiet recording, will I be able to hear the movement of a performer's clothing? Some reviews of the Yggdrasil claim this mythic level of detail. Like you can hear the fingernails of a pianist brushing against the keys. I'm the type of audiophile who is more into "sounds" rather than music. I'm an ASMR fanatic. Yggdrasil reviews claim levels of sound that seem almost unrealistic. Yet if true, can the DS Sr. also produce that level of sound. That's the main thing I want out of my dac: I want to hear subtle sounds I've never heard before more than the music itself.

 

Are you really more interested in "sound" and detailing (resolution and transparency) specifically than all other qualities of the reproduction that creates a believable sense of music being played in your room...? Just curious.

[Cortes]

2 hours ago, Hyperion said:

 

You need to add local European VAT (usually 20-25% in Europe) + the cost of shipping and insurance to the price as well. Then there's the voltage issue + the lower second hand value of an imported unit + the potential hassle of service and warranty issues...

 

It's basically not worth it.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

 

I think that's very case dependent. Excepting the taxes and to some extension the voltage, most of the issues you mention are artificially created by the brands.  For  some expensive gear you can fly to US bring it home, pay the flight, and save money. 

[Roy724]

What a wonderful company! I just ordered the PS Audio Directstream. I've been talking to their staff over the past several days and they are golden. SO informative and helpful. I even got a long, detailed message from Ted Smith himself comparing the Yggdrasil to the Directstream going over the differences in the dac chips. And best of all, they are shipping it out today. I'll have it by the end of the week. Phenomenal customer service!!! This is worth the extra cost.

 

Rather, Schiit audio is BY FAR_the_worst company I've ever dealt with in my life. I also talked to their customer service quite a bit and they give me the impression that they just don't care; they were short and totally unhelpful in my experience and always making excuses. They sent me stock replies about this so called "global parts shortage." They've made me wait almost 2 months and still no Yggdrasil. Schiit audio SUCKS!!!! in my opinion. I don't know if their dac is better, but honestly who cares when a company is THIS bad. Is there even a global parts shortage for real??? Like I said previously, no other company is having this problem that I've looked into.

 

Hopefully I made the right decision. If not, unlike Schiit, PS Audio offers free shipping both ways and no questions asked full returns. Schiit has a 15% restocking fee and makes you may enormous shipping both ways. What a massive difference in companies.

[Roy724]

To the guys who requested a copy of Ted Smith's email I'm really sorry but I deleted it. Besides, it was so technical and complex that you'd need a Ph.D to understand it. That guy really is a genius.

[Roy724]

Good news guys, I found the email! Didn't delete it after all. Here is Ted Smith's explanation of the Yggdrasil's dac chip vs the Directstream FPGA chip: 

 

 Content removed at request of Ted Smith - CC

 

I think that he is saying the Directstream sounds much better than the Yggdrasil but honestly I don't fully understand it.

[AmosM]

4 hours ago, Roy724 said:

 

Rather, Schiit audio is BY FAR_the_worst company I've ever dealt with in my life. I also talked to their customer service quite a bit and they give me the impression that they just don't care; they were short and totally unhelpful in my experience and always making excuses. They sent me stock replies about this so called "global parts shortage." They've made me wait almost 2 months and still no Yggdrasil. Schiit audio SUCKS!!!! in my opinion. I don't know if their dac is better, but honestly who cares when a company is THIS bad. Is there even a global parts shortage for real??? Like I said previously, no other company is having this problem that I've looked into.

 

Is it possible the two DACs use different parts? I don’t know how a company withholding sales on account of parts shortages would indicate a lack of honesty or integrity. Quite the opposite; it suggests they’re unwilling to compromise on their chosen components and sound quality. I’m positive they could find substitute parts and continue racking up sales if they were actually unscrupulous.

 

In any case, good luck with the new DAC! 

[mrvco]

22 hours ago, AmosM said:

 

Is it possible the two DACs use different parts? I don’t know how a company withholding sales on account of parts shortages would indicate a lack of honesty or integrity. Quite the opposite; it suggests they’re unwilling to compromise on their chosen components and sound quality. I’m positive they could find substitute parts and continue racking up sales if they were actually unscrupulous.

 

In any case, good luck with the new DAC! 

 

Agreed.  The Bifrost seems to have the same delay as well.  Popular Schiit indeed.