Schiit Yggdrasil Vs PS Audio Directstream Junior

[Roy724]

 

I'm trying to decide between the Schiit Yggdrasil or the PS Audio Directstream Junior. All that I am concerned with is the sound quality, not the features such as dsd or upgradability and such. I only listen to PCM. My primary interests are the best detail retrieval, best instrument separation, most realistic sounding instrument reproduction and the best ability to replicate the sound of the room the music was recorded in such as the harmonics of Carnegie Hall. Specifically when it comes to detail, I want to hear everything down to the movement of a performers cloths or pinpoint the creak of a specific chair in the orchestra. Which of these two dacs does all of this the best? Also, if the Directstream Junior sounds better is it enough to justify the large price difference between the two? I'd like to hear replies from people who have listened to both dacs or maybe owned both. I've thoroughly searched Google and only found 3 comparisons between these dacs and all 3 people said the Yggdrasil sounds best. However, I'd like to hear more opinions because the Directstream Junior seems to have more advanced technology and I do like the upgradability of its firmware. Yet, as I said, my main concern is sound quality.

[Ralf11]

Don't both co.s have trial periods?

 

I hear that the Yggy does take a long time to break in...

[Nordkapp]

36 minutes ago, Roy724 said:

I'm trying to decide between the Schiit Yggdrasil or the PS Audio Directstream Junior. All that I am concerned with is the sound quality, not the features such as dsd or upgradability and such. I only listen to PCM. My primary interests are the best detail retrieval, best instrument separation, most realistic sounding instrument reproduction and the best ability to replicate the sound of the room the music was recorded in such as the harmonics of Carnegie Hall. Specifically when it comes to detail, I want to hear everything down to the movement of a performers cloths or pinpoint the creak of a specific chair in the orchestra. Which of these two dacs does all of this the best? Also, if the Directstream Junior sounds better is it enough to justify the large price difference between the two? I'd like to hear replies from people who have listened to both dacs or maybe owned both. I've thoroughly searched Google and only found 3 comparisons between these dacs and all 3 people said the Yggdrasil sounds best. However, I'd like to hear more opinions because the Directstream Junior seems to have more advanced technology and I do like the upgradability of its firmware. Yet, as I said, my main concern is sound quality.

Have you looked at the Benchmark DACs? I'm not trying to dissuade you in any way, but if it's ultimate resolution you're seeking, the Benchmarks offer a pretty persuasive argument, all while being feature rich and priced competitively. And they offer a trial period as well to up the ante. 

[diecaster]

I think the current Yggdrasil is better than the PS DirectStream Jr and way better than any of the Benchmark DACs. I like some aspects of the DirectStream “Sr” better than the current Yggdrasil but that is mostly down to features, not performance. Well, I think the DirectStream “Sr” with Redcloud is a bit smoother without sacrificing clarity or detail.

 

You can’t beat Yggdrasil even if you spend twice as much. Heck it is hard to beat spending three times as much. 

[audio.bill]

Since you stated that you only listen to PCM, that should be a significant factor favoring the Yggdrasil over the PS Audio. The Yggy's design supports PCM playback exclusively and is optimized accordingly, while the DS DACs convert PCM into DSD and then decode it from the DSD stream.

[diecaster]

1 minute ago, audio.bill said:

Since you stated that you only listen to PCM, that should be a significant factor favoring the Yggdrasil over the PS Audio. The Yggy's design supports PCM playback exclusively and is optimized accordingly, while the DS DACs convert PCM into DSD and then decode it from the DSD stream.

 

That is really not a significant factor. 99% of what I play is PCM and my DirectStream sounds at least as competent as Yggdrasil playing that content. The DirectStream Jr is not as competent as Yggdrasil. 

[Nordkapp]

10 minutes ago, diecaster said:

The DirectStream Jr is not as competent as Yggdrasil. 

To your ears.......

[diecaster]

39 minutes ago, Nordkapp said:

To your ears.......

 

Someone always needs to play Captain Obvious......

[Roy724]

Diecaster, is the Yggdrasil more detailed than the DS Jr? And how about the Sr? Is the Yggdrasil more detailed than the DS Sr? The most important thing I'm seeking is microscopic detail. Is the Yggdrasil the king of detail in the $6k and under price range?

 

I've read every review I could find for the Yggdrasil and the Directstream and Directstream Junior and the Yggdrasil seems to get more enthusiastic  reviews. Everyone seems to indicate the Yggdrasil is pound of pound the best dac in the world. I just wonder if the DS and DSJ's conversion of PCM to DSD into analog sounds better. Or does it not make much of a difference and does the Yggdrasil still sound superior just converting straight PCM to analog? Or in other words, does the PCM to DSD upsampling sound better?

[diecaster]

Nothing beats Yggdrasil for detail. I find the DirectStream “Sr” to be as detailed but smoother and more musical. Yggdrasil is more detailed and, to me, better than the DirectStream Jr. If the DirectStream “Sr” is in your budget, it can’t hurt to check it out. But, you can’t beat Yggdrasil for value. I would be very happy with an Yggdrasil instead of what I have now. 

[Roy724]

Diecaster, do you think that the Directstream Sr. is worth the enormous cost difference over the Yggdrasil? Is it THAT much better? I can afford the Sr. but honestly I feel very uncomfortable spending that much on a dac. For it to be worth it to me, the Sr. would have to be significantly better sounding than the Yggdrasil. If they are close then I would never even consider the Sr. I have to admit, though, that I am very tempted by the DS's upgradability. At this point I'm starting to think that the Jr. is no longer an option compared to the Yggy. Let me know your thoughts.

[TubeLover]

Read Robert Harleys (perhaps the most note audio reviewer of high end audio) review of the Yggdrasil, and decided if you should be looking at any other DAC's. Unless DSD is important to you, nothing can touch the Yggy for anywhere close to the money. And yes, if anything, it should be compared to the DirectStream Sr. and that,a s noted previously, will make it pretty hard to justify nearly double the cost.

 

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/schiit-audio-yggdrasil-dac/

 

 

JC

[diecaster]

26 minutes ago, Roy724 said:

Diecaster, do you think that the Directstream Sr. is worth the enormous cost difference over the Yggdrasil? Is it THAT much better? I can afford the Sr. but honestly I feel very uncomfortable spending that much on a dac. For it to be worth it to me, the Sr. would have to be significantly better sounding than the Yggdrasil. If they are close then I would never even consider the Sr. I have to admit, though, that I am very tempted by the DS's upgradability. At this point I'm starting to think that the Jr. is no longer an option compared to the Yggy. Let me know your thoughts.

 

I bought my DirectStream used (a few months old) for 50% off of retail with a transferable warranty. I would not have purchased it at full retail. In other words, no, I don't think it is worth the cost difference over Yggdrasil. There is so very little between them. The only reason I went looking at the DirectStream is I wanted to futz around with some DSD content and maybe play with some MQA. A friend had one and an Yggdrasil so I knew how it sounded.

 

Some people have such large budgets that the cost difference does not mean that much to them. In that case, the DirectStream is certainly worth a listen. But if the price difference matters and you don't want to play DSD or MQA files, the Yggdrasil is the better choice.

[Hyperion]

It's worth mentioning that the PS Audio DS DAC:s provides a platform under development, where both the software and hardware is constantly improved. Along the way, it will sound better and get additional features through free software upgrades. It's also a streamer (with Roon support etc.), as well as having a volume control with the possibility of driving a power amp directly. Taking all of this into account, the price performance ratio is high for what you're getting.

 

All this being said, if you don't care about future developments (without having to sell your DAC and buy a new one), don't need the streaming or volume control features, there are other options of course that might suit you better.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

[TubeLover]

8 minutes ago, Hyperion said:

It's worth mentioning that the PS Audio DS DAC:s provides a platform under development, where both the software and hardware is constantly improved. Along the way, it will sound better and get additional features through free software upgrades. It's also a streamer (with Roon support etc.), as well as having a volume control with the possibility of driving a power amp directly. Taking all of this into account, the price performance ratio is high for what you're getting.

 

All this being said, if you don't care about future developments (without having to sell your DAC and buy a new one), don't need the streaming or volume control features, there are other options of course that might suit you better.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

PS Audio is to be heartily  commended on offering regular updates for the full blown DirectStream, or DirectStream SR, as people have been referring to it. Almost all of which provide sound improvements, as well as needed or wanted updates.  They also provide exceptional customer service in my experience.

 

However,  to say that those DAC's still "provide a platform under development, where both the software and hardware is constantly improved" may be a stretch at this point in time. They have done that for a number of years now since the DAC was produced, and far longer than one would reasonably expect. It can't go on forever. And word is that they are already well underway in developing a new dac, with a separate power supply, and new technology. I personally wouldn't expect much more in the way of upgrades to the older platforms. 

 

 

JC 

[Cortes]

microscopic 

4 hours ago, Roy724 said:

Diecaster, is the Yggdrasil more detailed than the DS Jr? And how about the Sr? Is the Yggdrasil more detailed than the DS Sr? The most important thing I'm seeking is microscopic detail. Is the Yggdrasil the king of detail in the $6k and under price range?

 

 

 

If that's your preference  and price range I'd look at the Mytek Manhattan II. Difficult to beat in that regard  a modern sabre chip with a state of the art implementation. Maybe more knowledgeable people here can advise you as well on other arquitectures, such as R2R.  

[Cortes]

43 minutes ago, Hyperion said:

It's worth mentioning that the PS Audio DS DAC:s provides a platform under development, where both the software and hardware is constantly improved. Along the way, it will sound better and get additional features through free software upgrades. It's also a streamer (with Roon support etc.), as well as having a volume control with the possibility of driving a power amp directly. Taking all of this into account, the price performance ratio is high for what you're getting.

 

 

I'd love to purchase a PD Directstream, but they are only a sane option  in US, where good deals with warranty transfer are possible.  In Europe, their price is ridiculous. 

[hurka]

Buy better source,dac don't matter a lot

[diecaster]

1 hour ago, TubeLover said:

PS Audio is to be heartily  commended on offering regular updates for the full blown DirectStream, or DirectStream SR, as people have been referring to it. Almost all of which provide sound improvements, as well as needed or wanted updates.  They also provide exceptional customer service in my experience.

 

However,  to say that those DAC's still "provide a platform under development, where both the software and hardware is constantly improved" may be a stretch at this point in time. They have done that for a number of years now since the DAC was produced, and far longer than one would reasonably expect. It can't go on forever. And word is that they are already well underway in developing a new dac, with a separate power supply, and new technology. I personally wouldn't expect much more in the way of upgrades to the older platforms. 

 

The DirectStream Jr gets FPGA updates every time the DirectStream Sr does. They are the same is this regard. PS Audio has also offered DAC hardware upgrades in the past. Specifically from the PerfectWave DAC to the DirectStream DAC.

 

Yes, PS Audio is developing a new high end DAC. That DAC will not replace the DirectStream which will continue to be developed. In fact, the creator of the DirectStream DAC has said than many of the FPGA code developments planned for the new high end DAC will show up in the DirectStream family.

 

 

[diecaster]

4 minutes ago, hurka said:

Buy better source,dac don't matter a lot

 

The DAC is a source and it does indeed matter!! 

[Roy724]

I was convinced to buy the Yggdrasil but now I'm having second thoughts. Maybe the Directstream Sr. is worth buying. The main reason why is because of the firmware upgrades. If they do come out with a new dac some of it's technology is probably cross over to the Sr through an update. With another update or two the Sr. may exceed the Yggdrasil. Also, I use an Oppo UPD 203 as my cd player and it has a music only hdmi out which could connect to the Sr.'s I2S connection. Maybe that would sound better than optical? I also like the idea of the bridge. If I'm understanding it correctly, I can connect the Sr. to ethernet then my laptop can wirelessly play music through my router to it. I assume that means I can wirelessly stream Spotify and You Tube music as well. It's very tempting but that cost difference is outrageous and I don't buy used. Which brings me back to the Junior. I wonder how much detail would I lose with Junior over Yggy? Only maybe 10% or would it be much more like 30% or more? This is a tough decision.

[firedog]

You do realize the Jr comes with the bridge functionality built in?

[Roy724]

I've been talking with the salesmen at PS Audio and 2 of them tell me the Junior is_significantly_more detailed and better sounding than the Yggdrasil. And that the Sr. is 20% better than the Jr. Of course, they are selling them. Yet the comparison reviews I read and input in this forum says the Yggdrasil is more detailed than Jr. and equal to Sr. I wish that I could get more opinions. Those salesmen at PS Audio are very convincing because they said that they heard the Yggdrasil and only think it's "good." But of course...they are selling their products. I can't audition both because my credit card has a limit and Schiit has a 15% restocking fee and I have to pay shipping both ways so the cost would be hundreds for a rental.

[Ralf11]

ok, then - buy the Yggy - wait a few months, then audition the Sr.

[Blake]

OP: I am not aware of anyone who has more experience buying, trying and comparing DAC's than Torq.  Torq buys this stuff and doesn't receive any freebies, etc.  Of course this is not gospel, but it is another very good, independent source of info.  Some of the DAC's mentioned are uber expensive as well.  Go to page 1 and start reading:

 

https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/life-after-yggdrasil-watering-the-ash.4036/page-45