American Hi-Fi: Inferior?

[esldude]

5 minutes ago, sphinxsix said:

 

Yeah, will have to rethink this ..  You think these will do.?

 

(their advantage is they're near my current source)

This looks like a good current source.  Lots of current in the photo.

 

[sphinxsix]

3 minutes ago, esldude said:

This looks like a good current source.  Lots of current in the photo.

 

Currently I'm considering electric current only.

 

But I'm obviously open to new ideas 

[mansr]

4 minutes ago, esldude said:

This looks like a good current source.  Lots of current in the photo.

 

But that's communist current.

[sphinxsix]

4 minutes ago, mansr said:

But that's communist current.

Probably good for communist tubes but I've gone SS 20 years ago.

[mansr]

1 minute ago, sphinxsix said:

Probably good for communist tubes. I've gone SS 20 years ago.

Are you suggesting China isn't a solid state? You even seem to imply it is hollow. How subversive.

[sphinxsix]

14 minutes ago, mansr said:

16 minutes ago, sphinxsix said:

Probably good for communist tubes. I've gone SS 20 years ago.

Are you suggesting China isn't a solid state? You even seem to imply it is hollow. How subversive.

+1

Actually the Zen concept of emptiness derives from China.

 

(trying to cheat, in fact it came to China from India)

[AudioDoctor]

If nothing else, a GUTB thread is unintentionally hilarious, although not of his doing.

[wgscott]

38 minutes ago, AudioDoctor said:

If nothing else, a GUTB thread is unintentionally hilarious, although not of his doing.

 

He's one of the paid CA content-providers, to provide endless amusement and self-parody.  Kind of like an imperial court jester.  

[Ralf11]

He also get George to post things from his long experience.  We all owe GUTB...

[firedog]

4 hours ago, wgscott said:

 

He's one of the paid CA content-providers, to provide endless amusement and self-parody.  Kind of like an imperial court jester.  

I can't figure out if these topics he posts are sincere, or just his idea of fun click-bait and trolling. 

Maybe he is a paid "crisis actor" type ...?

[Ralf11]

maybe.. GUT Bot

[duxservit]

On 8/17/2018 at 7:19 PM, GUTB said:

Compared to all the amazing designs coming out of Europe over the last 10-20 years, what have American manufacturers been doing? Sure, there’s been some great boutique type companies for things like high end cables etc. Sure, Pass is still an institution. Sure you still have the Mark Levinsons. But it seems like year after year at the shows it’s 8 times out of 10 a European company that turns my head.

 

Does anyone else see this trend? Why are so many great designs coming out of these have-nothing Euro countries (not counting UK and Germany obviously)? Why can’t America raise another Nelson Pass? 

 

Let me try giving a more serious (partial) answer:

(a) The market in the US has become small, for the type of gear you are talking about. 

(b) Mobile devices (i.e. mobile phones) are the main consumer platform. 

(c) Demographics and population high mobility (i.e. if you move a lot, less need of large audio gear). 

(d) Expansion of engineering disciplines. 

 

The last one (e) is just my theory. A freshman college engineering student today in the US has a broad range of choices of subjects/topics across the EE/CS spectrum. A student might find solving the self-driving car problems or the Bitcoin/crypto-currency mining problems more rewarding/cool/job-promising than solving a 50-year problem of better audio gear. 

[christopher3393]

On 8/17/2018 at 6:19 PM, GUTB said:

Why can’t America raise another Nelson Pass? 

 

 

JD: I don’t want to open a whole can of worms, but you seem not to be overly concerned about getting very low distortion. For your First Watt amps you have made the point that at the low levels where most listening takes place, the distortion is very low. Yet, at high level peaks (especially with low- to medium-output power amps), distortion does rise considerably. But people like your amps. Does it have to do with the way the distortion rises, or with the spectral make-up of the distortion?

 

NP: The characteristic I get is the result of simple FET circuits running in Class A. This means minimal or no feedback, low-order harmonic characteristic, and monotonic but pedestrian distortion numbers.That approach usually (not always) delivers the sound that I like, and apparently my taste matches up with a portion of the buying public. The only magic involved takes place in the neural networks between our ears. What happens there is still poorly understood and varies between individuals. Whatever the deal is, ultra low distortion doesn’t seem to have much to do with it.

[gmgraves]

On 8/17/2018 at 4:19 PM, GUTB said:

Compared to all the amazing designs coming out of Europe over the last 10-20 years, what have American manufacturers been doing? Sure, there’s been some great boutique type companies for things like high end cables etc. Sure, Pass is still an institution. Sure you still have the Mark Levinsons. But it seems like year after year at the shows it’s 8 times out of 10 a European company that turns my head.

 

Does anyone else see this trend? Why are so many great designs coming out of these have-nothing Euro countries (not counting UK and Germany obviously)? Why can’t America raise another Nelson Pass? 

I consider that I don't have a jingoistic bone in my body, but to me that's probably the most short sighted and inaccurate statement I've heard in a long time. We make what are probably the worlds best speakers: Wilson Audio, Magico, Magnepan, Martin Logan, YG Acoustics, Sound Labs, and probably several dozen more. And we don't just have Nelson Pass's excellent amplifiers, we have Audio Research, we have Krell, Dan D'Agustino's equipment, VTL, Benchmark, Schiit, Parasound, Cary Audio, Conrad Johnston, VPI, Music Hall, SOTA, etc. 

A lot of good stuff does come from Europe (Japan Taiwan, Korea and China too), and I really don't think that there are many "Have-nothing" European countries these days. Many have better and more stable economies than the USA.

European companies even make more interesting cars than the USA and some, might even be considered better than those from the US. I don't think anyone would argue that a Porsche handles better than a Mustang or a Camaro or even a 'Vette, but that doesn't mean that these US-built cars aren't good. In the 1970's the Japanese taught the world how to mass produce quality automobiles. 

We live in a global economy and in spite of our "President's" rhetoric to the contrary, one should buy what one wants, irrespective of where it's made and without paying a monetary penalty for buying from overseas.

[gmgraves]

6 hours ago, christopher3393 said:

 

 

JD: I don’t want to open a whole can of worms, but you seem not to be overly concerned about getting very low distortion. For your First Watt amps you have made the point that at the low levels where most listening takes place, the distortion is very low. Yet, at high level peaks (especially with low- to medium-output power amps), distortion does rise considerably. But people like your amps. Does it have to do with the way the distortion rises, or with the spectral make-up of the distortion?

 

NP: The characteristic I get is the result of simple FET circuits running in Class A. This means minimal or no feedback, low-order harmonic characteristic, and monotonic but pedestrian distortion numbers.That approach usually (not always) delivers the sound that I like, and apparently my taste matches up with a portion of the buying public. The only magic involved takes place in the neural networks between our ears. What happens there is still poorly understood and varies between individuals. Whatever the deal is, ultra low distortion doesn’t seem to have much to do with it.

Frank (FAS42) would disagree with NP. His "method" eliminates distortion even from components like amplifiers!

[Ralf11]

10 hours ago, duxservit said:

... A freshman college engineering student today in the US has a broad range of choices of subjects/topics across the EE/CS spectrum. A student might find solving the self-driving car problems or the Bitcoin/crypto-currency mining problems more rewarding/cool/job-promising than solving a 50-year problem of better audio gear. 

 

or they could do something really worthwhile such as flow batteries, perovskite PV cells, carbon capture technologies, etc.

[fas42]

8 hours ago, christopher3393 said:

 

 

NP: The characteristic I get is the result of simple FET circuits running in Class A. This means minimal or no feedback, low-order harmonic characteristic, and monotonic but pedestrian distortion numbers.That approach usually (not always) delivers the sound that I like, and apparently my taste matches up with a portion of the buying public. The only magic involved takes place in the neural networks between our ears. What happens there is still poorly understood and varies between individuals. Whatever the deal is, ultra low distortion doesn’t seem to have much to do with it.

 

Nope, I don't disagree - I've changed the bolding somewhat, in the above - that pretty well nails it.

 

How I would extend the explanation is that our brains can handle certain types of distortion with ease; discard their impact to the point of making them 'invisible' - but other types of anomalies can't be so easily countered in our heads; they irritate, and stay irritating - to the point where we can't stand it any more; or we end up with severe listening fatigue ...

 

Simple circuits, yes. Class A is very helpful for eliminating a lot of the disturbing distortions and noise - but I haven't used that. Low feedback is also helpful - but understanding why normal feedback often fails to do its job well enough allows one to engineer or tweak satisfactory performance from more environmentally friendly circuits.

[R1200CL]

On 8/19/2018 at 1:06 AM, Ralf11 said:

anything under 300 V SUCKS

 

Let's get real 'Murican and JUMP OVER those pesky Euro-peon with 800+ V of pure Tesalation Fast Chargin' Porsche e-tron Power !!

 

 

Then we can run our home HiFi off of our car battry' packs and recharge it all down at the Grange Hall Hoedown

 

 

Actally not a bad idea. But purchase the Elon Musk powerbank instead. 

 

I’m looking forward to the first review of a battery powered stereo ?

[Ralf11]

PowerWall is nice but Pooschey is about to unleash a real High Voltage setup - gotta have the mostest if your plan is to overtake Tesla

 

(before it implodes)

[AudioDoctor]

There is a Powerwall, and then the massive Power Pack, for connecting to grids and such.  Probably run the most power hungry Class A tube system for a week with one of those.

 

https://www.tesla.com/energy

[Ralf11]

I didn't see the voltage on their web site.  BTW, can I give them your phone #??

 

Here is the Pooschey thing... 350 kW

 

https://electrek.co/2018/04/16/porsche-ev-charging-network-north-america-mission-e/

[esldude]

1 hour ago, Ralf11 said:

I didn't see the voltage on their web site.  BTW, can I give them your phone #??

 

Here is the Pooschey thing... 350 kW

 

https://electrek.co/2018/04/16/porsche-ev-charging-network-north-america-mission-e/

So Porsche will use 800 volts.  Is this now American EV charging networks suck?  Tesla Superchargers are only 480 volts.  

 

BTW, I expect this whole EV thing to be a huge boon to audiophile cable companies.  Even a tiny improvement in "smoothing electron flow" or other benefits will be totally worth it when we are talking a few hundred amps at a few hundred volts like with EV fast charging.  So I expect AQ, Nordost et al to be contacted to provide cabling for all these charging stations.  Even then Synergistic Research will still in the immortal words of GUTB................suck!

[firedog]

7 hours ago, gmgraves said:

that's probably the most short sighted and inaccurate statement I've heard in a long time.

Apparently making these kinds of statements  is another of GUTB's hobbies that rivals audiophilia for his attention.

[semente]

On 8/18/2018 at 12:31 AM, Ralf11 said:

 

maybe the US companies are focusing on SQ?

Schiit Quality? ?

[semente]

On 8/18/2018 at 2:46 AM, R1200CL said:

It’s my understanding part of American thinking is extremely conservative, and that can prohibit developing.

Brexit means Brexit. Whatever that means... taking back control perhaps.