Magnepan 1.7 (or any large speaker) in a small room-why not?

[Ke]

There has been a lot of discussion about what size room different speakers need etc. I have a small room (around 8x14 feet) where I demoed MG12's which sounded great.

 

I also demoed MG 1.7's which are new, not properly broken in yet.

 

I also compared both at the local store with my amp, and while both sounded great, the 1.7 was just better in all areas.

 

Now the question: the better fit to my small room, based on advice I have seen, would be MG12, but what actually would make the 1.7's sound worse than 12's in this small room? I fully understand that I will not get the fullest potential out of 1.7's, and maybe not added value for the extra cost compared to 12's. But why wouldn't the 1.7 still sound somewhat better? will there simply be some physical measures that would make them sound worse, e.g. not being able to take them enough forward from the front wall would cause unwanted issues etc.

 

Any inputs will be greatly appreciated.

 

Ke

 

[SteveChicago]

You should arrange to demo both speakers at your home with your gear. That's the only way you will be able to tell.

 

FYI, I auditioned the 1.7s at home and I've ordered them. The 12s need a sub IMO.

 

As far as room size, again you'll need to listen at home and play around with positioning. All Maggies benefit from 3+ feet from the rear wall.

 

Steve

 

[Part-Time Audiophile]

It seems a truism, matching small to small. But there is method to the madness -- the larger the transducer (or the more of them there are, in a linear series or array), the harder it is for it to sound coherent in the nearfield. Put another way, you need some distance from some of these big guys for them to sound their best.

 

This is not a great thing for Maggies in small rooms, as a bipole tends to do well only if they're far enough away from a rear reflecting surface to have that back-wave not interfere with the front wave.

 

Now, here's the BS fuzzy math part (everyone, feel free to correct me here). The propagation rate of sound is about 1'/ms. IIRC, you want whatever echo you're going to have to be arriving at the listening position later than 5ms after the direct wave in order to avoid sonic smear. Therefore, you want to be 3' off the wall, or else kill the back wave entirely through dampening. Which would be a shame as that "bi-pole" sound is part of the charm.

 

[sfdoddsy]

The original rule about small speakers for a small room was because of bass modes.

 

The smaller the room, the higher and trickier these modes. So the convention was to use speakers with such anaemic bass that they didn't excite the modes.

 

This theory is somewhat less popular due to the advent of sub/sat systems and room EQ.

 

If you can EQ your bass, you can use any size speaker.

 

Maggies, however, are IMHO easier to place. As dipoles, they radiate less from the sides than normal speakers. So they can be placed closer to side walls.

 

Contrary to popular belief, this does not mean that they should be placed further from a rear wall than regular speakers. All speakers should be 3-4 from the back unless designed otherwise.

 

As to your specific question about the MG12 versus the 1.7, the 1.7 should be better in all areas. I would be amazed if the MG12 sounded better in any size room, let alone yours.

 

Whatever position sounds best with the MG12s should be fine for the 1.7s. As mentioned above, dipoles are more room friendly than other types of speakers in the bass, and room-wise that is the biggest difference between the two.

 

This is also why the propagation rate mentioned above does not apply. Regular speakers have multiple drivers. Each driver is a point source of sound, and you can get comb filtering and other nasties from a badly designed one. Although that's very rare these days.

 

Maggies, however, do not have separate vertical drive units. They have one tall driver, with an equally tall ribbon. So they act as line sources and are inherently coherent. This means they can, and perhaps should be, listened to closer than some other types.

 

The only real no-no is to have your ears too high. If they are not below the top of the speaker you'll lose your treble.

 

I've owned numerous dipole speakers in all sorts of rooms. All have been easier to place than their monopole brethren.

 

All have sounded better too.

 

 

http://doddsy.net/steve6_009.htm

 

[Ke]

Thanks everyone. I manage to arrange a direct comparison btw 12 and 1.7 and will let you know how they compare.

 

I can get 3 ft from back wall for listening. Maggies are easy to move around, which makes it easier in the smaller room. I can push them farther back, and bring forward for real listening. They will be very close to side walls, but that does not seem to give any trouble.

 

Ke

 

[mwheelerk]

The Maggies really do need to have room to breathe. I have owned the smaller MMG and had them in a room I considered small. I think they truly require a minimum of 3 feet from any rear wall and at least 1.5 feet from any side wall as an absolute minimum.