The Computer Audiophile Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Hi Guys - I'm a fan of transparency and exposing people who threaten me or CA. What follows is an email exchange between Jeff Dorgay the publisher of TONEAudio and myself. First some background - CA launched a new feature recently that publishes the content of RSS feeds (LINK). If you don't know RSS stands for Really Simple Syndication. We only publish exactly what each website pushes out in its to-be syndicated feed. It's all automated. Some websites only syndicate the title of articles while others syndicate the entire article. It's up to each publisher to syndicate (or not) whatever content it wants. We also provide links to the original article. I think this provides a great centralized place for people to leave comments about articles that come from sites that either don't offer comment sections, have disabled comment sections, or tend to remove comments that don't fit a narrative. Again, we only publish what the publisher has enabled in its syndication feed. Here is the email exchange: _________________________________________________________ Hi The Computer Audiophile, Guest reported a post in a topic titled Tone Audio: A $2,995 Marvel – The EAT E-Glo S Hybrid/Tube Phonostage Hey, this is really NOT COOL. You are reprinting entire reviews of ours without our permission. One line or a paragraph with a link is ok, but this is out of line. You need to stop this now. My reply On Jul 15, 2018, at 3:05 PM, Chris Connaker <[email protected]> wrote: Hi Jeff - Not sure if you sent this or not. What we do is pull in the RSS feeds of sites. It’s all automated. We only publish exactly what’s enabled from the original publisher through its RSS configuration. You guys are allowing everyone to read complete articles via RSS, thus we are able to pull all of this in. We actually prefer to only pull in a small snippet or paragraph and provide a link back to the entire thing. It helps everyone this way. If I were you I’d reconfigure the RSS feeds to be more inline with industry standards. It would benefit us all. Chris Jeff Dorgay's reply On Jul 15, 2018, at 4:27 PM, JeffD <Jeff@ .com> wrote: No you’re using my content without my permission. I’m not going to change how we post our content so it makes it easier for you to steal it. Take it down NOW I want to see every bit of tone content off of your site or the next call is to my attorney. This is way out of line Sent from my iPhone Jeff's follow-up reply On Sun, Jul 15, 2018 at 6:30 PM JeffD <Jeff@ .com> wrote: If I were you I’d un-automate us from your feed. Sent from my iPhone My reply On Jul 15, 2018, at 5:15 PM, Chris Connaker <[email protected]> wrote: Jeff - Feel free to call your attorney. However that sounds pretty strange to me. The better person to call is whoever misconfigured your website to publish complete articles via RSS. You guys are providing this content for syndication (RSS = Really Simple Syndication). We provide our users a cloud based RSS reader. They can do the exact same thing in any local or cloud based RSS reader available online. We only present our users what each publisher has explicitly setup to be syndicated. Our service is 100% legal and far better than what Flipboard is doing to you. If you get your RSS feeds fixed to be inline with almost every other site on the internet then everyone wins. Chris Jeff's reply On Sun, Jul 15, 2018 at 7:33 PM JeffD <Jeff@ .com> wrote: Except Stereophile TAS and all the others aren’t publishing our feed. You’re the only one doing it and we both know it’s a dick move Consider the war on Sent from my iPhone My final reply On Jul 15, 2018, at 5:37 PM, Chris Connaker <[email protected]> wrote: Wow Jeff. I’m speechless. Chris Jeff's final reply On Sun, Jul 15, 2018 at 7:39 PM JeffD <Jeff@ .com> wrote: Don’t be a smug little asshole take it down now Sent from my iPhone _____________________________________________________________________________ Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Popular Post joelha Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 And people wonder why this industry struggles. Yes, two-channel audio has suffered as a result of the technological developments making music playback mobile to be sure. But behavior like Dorgay's doesn't help. A civil phone call to Chris could have (maybe) accomplished so much more. I'm sorry to say that exchange now colors my opinion of TONEAudio. No one is the better for behavior like that. Joel semente, elcorso, sphinxsix and 5 others 5 1 2 Link to comment
Popular Post The Computer Audiophile Posted July 16, 2018 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 Hi Joel - John Darko and I had a disagreement about his RSS feeds being published here. He suggested a phone call to which I agreed. We resolved the situation and remain friends. tmtomh, TAV, mordante and 4 others 4 1 2 Founder of Audiophile Style | My Audio Systems Link to comment
Popular Post plissken Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 I just read a few sentences in and knew, just knew, you were going to be dealing with someone that is wielding technology they don't know how to effectively use. Jud, tmtomh, STC and 1 other 1 3 Link to comment
Popular Post plissken Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 27 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Except Stereophile TAS and all the others aren’t publishing our feed. You’re the only one doing it and we both know it’s a dick move Consider the war on Sent from my iPhone Then Stereophile and TAS are simply using the feed as informational. Really RSS is SYNDICATION. It's purpose is to take publishers that push the content via RSS and allow others to Aggregate it. It's the whole fucking point of it. Jeff want's his cake and eat it too. The Computer Audiophile, MrMoM, tmtomh and 1 other 2 1 1 Link to comment
Popular Post rickca Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 Let Jeff waste his time and money with his attorney. Maybe his attorney can educate him about how RSS works. Matias, tmtomh, The Computer Audiophile and 3 others 4 1 1 Pareto Audio AMD 7700 Server --> Berkeley Alpha USB --> Jeff Rowland Aeris --> Jeff Rowland 625 S2 --> Focal Utopia 3 Diablos with 2 x Focal Electra SW 1000 BE subs i7-6700K/Windows 10 --> EVGA Nu Audio Card --> Focal CMS50's Link to comment
Popular Post jhwalker Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 Wow. He (or his tech guy) has misconfigured his RSS feed to publish the whole thing instead of just this headline / summary - and he blames YOU for using standard RSS functionality to aggregate content. I've never been a fan of TONEAudio, in any case, but this little contretemps makes me want NOT to read their content at all going forward. tmtomh, TAV, MrMoM and 1 other 3 1 John Walker - IT Executive Headphone - SonicTransporter i9 running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable Ethernet > mRendu Roon endpoint > Topping D90 > Topping A90d > Dan Clark Expanse / HiFiMan H6SE v2 / HiFiman Arya Stealth Home Theater / Music -SonicTransporter i9 running Roon Server > Netgear Orbi > Blue Jeans Cable HDMI > Denon X3700h > Anthem Amp for front channels > Revel F208-based 5.2.4 Atmos speaker system Link to comment
sandyk Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Hi Chris Publishing email conversations without first seeking the permission of the sender is a very grey area, and possibly not a good move. Perhaps they should be removed and just an overview given ? Jud may be able to assist with some general advice in this area. Kind Regards Alex mordante 1 How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file. PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020 Link to comment
Popular Post tmtomh Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 Of course I am totally with @The Computer Audiophile on this and think Jeff Dorgay's response is way out of line. That said - and I am NOT blaming Chris in any way here - I can see where the exchange went off the rails. Dorgay feels Chris is taking advantage of RSS as a "loophole" and quickly got frustrated at what he probably perceived as Chris' uncollegial refusal to stop publishing TONE Audio's RSS feed. Dorgay's escalation is his own responsibility of course - but I do think it probably could have been headed off if he'd been given a way to acknowledge that TONE's own RSS misconfiguration is the source of the issue, while still saving face. I would guess Dorgay expected Chris to offer to remove TONE's RSS from the Around the Industry feature here at CA until TONE's RSS gets fixed. Of course Dorgay never made it clear that's what he wanted, and I'm just speculating - but that seems to be the subtext. Not saying Chris should have to make such an offer; just offering my $.02 as an observer for how/why Dorgay blew up so quickly (aside from the fact that he is acting like a child). MrMoM and Superdad 1 1 Link to comment
Popular Post plissken Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, sandyk said: Hi Chris Publishing email conversations without first seeking the permission of the sender is a very grey area, and possibly not a good move. Perhaps they should be removed and just an overview given ? Jud may be able to assist with some general advice in this area. Kind Regards Alex Actually this isn't grey at all. Anyone ever just firing off an email has zero expectation to privacy. MrMoM and mourip 1 1 Link to comment
joelha Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 11 minutes ago, The Computer Audiophile said: Hi Joel - John Darko and I had a disagreement about his RSS feeds being published here. He suggested a phone call to which I agreed. We resolved the situation and remain friends. Hey Chris, I've met John Darko and he seemed like a good guy. And I know you're a very good guy. That a phone call resolved everything doesn't surprise me. Another reason to call?: When you e-mail your comments, you document them for others to see. Sometimes, as in this case, not such a good idea. Joel sandyk 1 Link to comment
sandyk Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 1 minute ago, plissken said: Actually this isn't grey at all. Anyone ever just firing off an email has zero expectation to privacy. Yes, Mr. Attorney . How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file. PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020 Link to comment
Popular Post tmtomh Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, plissken said: Actually this isn't grey at all. Anyone ever just firing off an email has zero expectation to privacy. That's true - and Chris has every right to publish that exchange. At the same time, I would guess that publishing that exchange will only redouble Dorgay's rage, because (at least in Dorgay's mind) it's the same type of thing Dorgay was upset about in the first place with the RSS issue. plissken and MrMoM 1 1 Link to comment
Popular Post plissken Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 Just now, sandyk said: Yes, Mr. Attorney . I've actually been in court (I was the plaintiff) and Time Warner Cable was the defendant. I had previously published emails in a dispute with them and they tried arguing that it was protected content, yada yada yada. It may be different in Australia, but here it wasn't a problem. TWC had zero expectation of privacy. Judge almost laughed at that one. They ended up paying me $2700. MrMoM and jventer 1 1 Link to comment
cpvniii Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Quote This really shocks me. It sounds as if Jeff is under some pressure. When I had my shop open as an audio shop I interacted with Jeff when he was just getting started. He was extremely professional and a fun guy to interact with. He added many features to my ads gratis as cash flow was very minimal in the early days. He even took some photos for me to enhance my ad. I hope you fellows can work this out. No one needs any extra stress in these days and times. Blessings to you all. Paul MacPro 24 GB/8TB / A+ and Pure Music / LAMPIZATOR B7 as Dac and Pre w/volume control / Regen /Intona USB Iso/curious USB / Emotive Audio Sira / PASS Aleph P / D-Sonic M3 600 mono's / MIT / Shunyata Alpha HC, Alpha Digital, Alpha Analogue, Weizhi PR-6 / Exact Power XP15a-4 balanced power distributor / FOCAL Maestro UTOPIA III's in red/black "In life's final analysis, one's relationship with his Maker is all that really matters." Link to comment
plissken Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Just now, tmtomh said: That's true - and Chris has every right to publish that exchange. At the same time, I would guess that publishing that exchange will only redouble Dorgay's rage, because (at least in Dorgay's mind) it's the same type of thing Dorgay was upset about in the first place with the RSS issue. I find idiots are generally idiots all the way through. It's their unerring ability to keep operating in the same manner but expecting different results. MrMoM 1 Link to comment
cpvniii Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Quote This really shocks me. It sounds as if MacPro 24 GB/8TB / A+ and Pure Music / LAMPIZATOR B7 as Dac and Pre w/volume control / Regen /Intona USB Iso/curious USB / Emotive Audio Sira / PASS Aleph P / D-Sonic M3 600 mono's / MIT / Shunyata Alpha HC, Alpha Digital, Alpha Analogue, Weizhi PR-6 / Exact Power XP15a-4 balanced power distributor / FOCAL Maestro UTOPIA III's in red/black "In life's final analysis, one's relationship with his Maker is all that really matters." Link to comment
Cary Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, plissken said: Actually this isn't grey at all. Anyone ever just firing off an email has zero expectation to privacy. We have a winner. Unless the email was correspondence solely with counsel or sent with the expectation of privacy and protected under a right of privacy (i.e. personal financial information), it is generally not considered priveledged. STC 1 Link to comment
Popular Post Jud Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 26 minutes ago, jhwalker said: Wow. He (or his tech guy) has misconfigured his RSS feed to publish the whole thing instead of just this headline / summary - and he blames YOU for using standard RSS functionality to aggregate content. I've never been a fan of TONEAudio, in any case, but this little contretemps makes me want NOT to read their content at all going forward. Sounds to me as if Mr. Dorgay has accomplished what he wanted - no one reading his content on CA. TAV, STC, Hugo9000 and 9 others 9 2 1 One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Popular Post Ralf11 Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 25 minutes ago, plissken said: Actually this isn't grey at all. Anyone ever just firing off an email has zero expectation to privacy. I In the US it is not a problem - with a few exceptions: national security, you signed a NDA, public disclosure of private facts (https://injury.findlaw.com/torts-and-personal-injuries/invasion-of-privacy--public-disclosure-of-private-facts.html), copyright protected info... I may have missed one, but no problem here AFAIK. It will be fun to hear from his atty MrMoM and jtwrace 1 1 Link to comment
Jud Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 5 minutes ago, Cary said: We have a winner. Unless the email was correspondence solely with counsel or sent with the expectation of privacy and protected under a right of privacy (i.e. personal financial information), it is generally not considered priveledged. Well, despite mixing up concepts of privilege, confidentiality of correspondence, and privacy of personal financial information, the conclusion remains correct. No right not to have your correspondent pass along this information. One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature. Link to comment
Ralf11 Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 the other question is where is that guy's analog web site? Link to comment
james45974 Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 Does Daily Audiophile work with RSS also? TONEaudio content is there too, does Jeff not have a problem with that? beetlemania 1 Jim Link to comment
Popular Post wgscott Posted July 16, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted July 16, 2018 There is something about this hobby that sure brings out the psychos in whole herds and droves. You might want to pass those missives along to the EFF. https://www.eff.org mav52 and Jud 1 1 Link to comment
sandyk Posted July 16, 2018 Share Posted July 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, Jud said: Well, despite mixing up concepts of privilege, confidentiality of correspondence, and privacy of personal financial information, the conclusion remains correct. No right not to have your correspondent pass along this information. Jud As tmtomh said : Quote At the same time, I would guess that publishing that exchange will only redouble Dorgay's rage, because (at least in Dorgay's mind) it's the same type of thing Dorgay was upset about in the first place with the RSS issue. How a Digital Audio file sounds, or a Digital Video file looks, is governed to a large extent by the Power Supply area. All that Identical Checksums gives is the possibility of REGENERATING the file to close to that of the original file. PROFILE UPDATED 13-11-2020 Link to comment
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