ApplePi DAC - Highest Performance Rpi DAC Launched

[orchardaudio]

15 minutes ago, matthias said:

@orchardaudio

It would be nice if you show the THD+N in dB values like the other specs.

The THD+N of your DAC is 106dB, certainly not a top value.

 

Matt

Which DAC are you referring to?

 

[matthias]

16 minutes ago, orchardaudio said:

Which DAC are you referring to?

 

 

The Katana so far is better than 106dB THD+N.

The distortions and noise of your DAC are 22dB higher than the SNR so they might be audible in some cases.

 

Matt

[orchardaudio]

11 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

The Katana so far is better than 106dB THD+N.

 

Matt

 

Like I said in an earlier post, that number is what the DAC chip is capable of, I do not see an actual measured number for full Katana DAC circuit.

[matthias]

1 minute ago, orchardaudio said:

 

Like I said in an earlier post, that number is what the DAC chip is capable of, I do not see an actual measured number for full Katana DAC circuit.

 

Please have a look at the diyaudio link I posted above.

 

Matt

[orchardaudio]

13 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

Please have a look at the diyaudio link I posted above.

 

Matt

I did look and I don't see any mention of measured results.

[opus101]

Post #285 is where there are measured results posted, see if this takes you there : http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/310338-dac-allo-ess9028q2m-rpi-post5401860.html

[orchardaudio]

Like I was saying measured results less than they are advertising. You wonder what else they are hiding. Also their price will be $250 based on some of the other posts.

[orchardaudio]

1 hour ago, opus101 said:

Post #285 is where there are measured results posted, see if this takes you there : http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/vendor-s-bazaar/310338-dac-allo-ess9028q2m-rpi-post5401860.html

Like I was saying measured results less than they are advertising. You wonder what else they are hiding. Also their price will be $250 based on some of the other posts.

[matthias]

3 hours ago, orchardaudio said:

Like I was saying measured results less than they are advertising. You wonder what else they are hiding. Also their price will be $250 based on some of the other posts.

 

No advertising so far.

But if you wonder what they are hiding, I wonder what you are hiding.

The price is for a three board stack.

 

Matt

[orchardaudio]

7 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

No advertising so far.

But if you wonder what they are hiding, I wonder what you are hiding.

The price is for a three board stack.

 

Matt

I would say this constitutes as advertising:

https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/diy-dac/audiophonics-i-sabre-dac-es9028q2m-kali-edition-raspberry-pi-3-2-i2s-p-12212.html

 

You seem to have a vested interest in allo products.

[orchardaudio]

6 hours ago, opus101 said:

 

If the 'softest' it can produce is the noise then no, the FFT plot you shared cannot be used to quantify the noise. That's because the noise depends on the bandwidth its measured in and you've not provided that information. Do you know the effective bin bandwidth? If not then do you know how many FFT points there are in the transform and the sample rate?

 

The FFT is 65,536 points.

[matthias]

26 minutes ago, orchardaudio said:

I would say this constitutes as advertising:

https://www.audiophonics.fr/en/diy-dac/audiophonics-i-sabre-dac-es9028q2m-kali-edition-raspberry-pi-3-2-i2s-p-12212.html

 

You seem to have a vested interest in allo products.

 

I am referring to Allo Katana, not audiophonics.

I have no affiliation to Allo, just like what they are doing.

 

Matt

[orchardaudio]

8 minutes ago, matthias said:

 

I am referring to Allo Katana, not audiophonics.

I have no affiliation to Allo, just like what they are doing.

 

Matt

 

Ok, but I am pretty sure that audiophonics is did not make up specs for an Allo product they are selling.

[orchardaudio]

I am pleased to announce the support of DietPi starting in version 6.5.

 

[matthias]

6 minutes ago, orchardaudio said:

 

Ok, but I am pretty sure that audiophonics is did not make up specs for an Allo product they are selling.

 

Confusing.

The 9028 DAC is an audiophonics design which they combine with an Allo Kali reclocker.

The upcoming Allo Katana DAC is based on the 9038Q2M and not yet launched.

 

Matt

[opus101]

3 hours ago, orchardaudio said:

The FFT is 65,536 points.

 

In this case you have an FFT process gain of about 45dB (the precise figure depends on your windowing function too to some degree). Meaning when you see a point on the FFT at -145dB, if that is a flat line across the whole spectrum your integrated (20-22kHz) noise works out at -100dB.

[tubesguy]

So limited to 192k, and no DSD?

[orchardaudio]

39 minutes ago, tubesguy said:

So limited to 192k, and no DSD?

Yes, but you can play higher sample rate files and the raspberry pi will take care of the downsampling.

[orchardaudio]

I am pleased to announce the support of Roon. The ApplePi DAC and Raspberry Pi combo can be turned into a Roon Network Endpoint.

[allo.com]

On 4/15/2018 at 7:12 PM, orchardaudio said:

Like I was saying measured results less than they are advertising. You wonder what else they are hiding. Also their price will be $250 based on some of the other posts.

Hello Orchardaudio

 

  first , welcome to the RPI audio community.

 

Its great to see that our community is growing and customer have more choices.We , at allo.com , think that competition is healthy and necessary to grow.

 

That being said , we don't appreciate innuendo . Let your product speak for itself ..

 

   Yes we have a new DAC  (Katana) coming out with a THD+N (measured on RCA , 1Khz , a-weighted , 0dbfs) at -111.109db(noise floor of our AP) .Based on ess9038q2m ,right now  , its the lowest distortion RPI Dac  ,  at 0.00003%  (no Audiophonic ess9028 DAC is not the Katana , they just use our Kali like you seem to..)

 

However as you are aware , great specs don't necessarily mean great sound. In fact , if you copy the EVM of certain companies you can easily reach -117 THD+N ...still sound is "OK" only.

 

From our experience , more important for sound quality (then THD+N numbers) are choices of opamp , clock jitter (phase noise and rise/fall time) and of course R and C chemistry..(in analog path)

 

Good luck with your product and again , welcome to the RPI audio world.

 

 

 

 

 

[orchardaudio]

54 minutes ago, allo.com said:

Hello Orchardaudio

 

  first , welcome to the RPI audio community.

 

Its great to see that our community is growing and customer have more choices.We , at allo.com , think that competition is healthy and necessary to grow.

 

That being said , we don't appreciate innuendo . Let your product speak for itself ..

 

   Yes we have a new DAC  (Katana) coming out with a THD+N (measured on RCA , 1Khz , a-weighted , 0dbfs) at -111.109db(noise floor of our AP) .Based on ess9038q2m ,right now  , its the lowest distortion RPI Dac  ,  at 0.00003%  (no Audiophonic ess9028 DAC is not the Katana , they just use our Kali like you seem to..)

 

However as you are aware , great specs don't necessarily mean great sound. In fact , if you copy the EVM of certain companies you can easily reach -117 THD+N ...still sound is "OK" only.

 

From our experience , more important for sound quality (then THD+N numbers) are choices of opamp , clock jitter (phase noise and rise/fall time) and of course R and C chemistry..(in analog path)

 

Good luck with your product and again , welcome to the RPI audio world.

 

I went back and reviewed the previous posts more closely, they seemed to indicate that that was your product, not an audiophonics one. Sorry for any confusion.

 

Thank you for your welcome to the community. I wish you luck with your product as well.

 

Also you make a typo 111dB is not 0.00003% it is 0.0003%.

[orchardaudio]

I went back to take a closer look at my test results and at 0dbfs my distortion is also -111dB (0.0003%). (a-weighted @ 1khz). See attached plot.

[allo.com]

15 minutes ago, orchardaudio said:

I went back to take a closer look at my test results and at 0dbfs my distortion is also -111dB (0.0003%). (a-weighted @ 1khz). See attached plot.

Great , you are almost there. :-)

[matthias]

1 hour ago, orchardaudio said:

Also you make a typo 111dB is not 0.00003% it is 0.0003%.

 

You see it makes sense to show the values as dB and no as %. :-)

 

Matt

[orchardaudio]

I will be doing a demo of the ApplePi DAC and the CRISPIN amplifier in Long Island, NY on April 28th, There is room for a few more people. If you would be interested in attending send me a PM to get full info.

 

Here are the links to the ApplePi DAC reviews:

http://theaudiobeatnik.com/applepi-dac-review-theres-art-in-this-dac-and-it-shows/

and

https://volumio.org/forum/orchard-audio-applepi-dac-review-t9633.html