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"Audio Without Numbers" by Herb Reichert


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It seems Audiostream is trying to come up with more and more imaginative ways to troll those who they apparently perceive as a threat.  While it appears that you and Herb might share some affinity for "feeling" rather than "knowing", this looks to me like you're trolling this forum on ML's behalf.

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I didn't go past the first little bit of reading it.  Classic straw man argument. 

 

I stopped at the point where he said objectivist trolls haven't heard the hurricane of Soundlab speakers.  Guess what speakers I listen on?  Soundlabs.  

 

I could go further and provide additional reasonable commentary like his different categories of experience and what it means.  No need, its is one big straw man moan. 

 

I will add one more thing.  The hurricane survivor has cogency of a sort.  On the other hand if we wish to build a levee or take other steps to prevent people clinging to the roof tops, it is not those people who can help us accomplish that.  With or without cats. 

And always keep in mind: Cognitive biases, like seeing optical illusions are a sign of a normally functioning brain. We all have them, it’s nothing to be ashamed about, but it is something that affects our objective evaluation of reality. 

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Broadside? Meh. Maybe against Hydrogen Audio thinking - of which there is overlap here at CA. But mostly just another volley in the long-running objectivist-subjectivist divide.

 

I have little respect for Reichert as a reviewer but I found myself agreeing with most of what he wrote, nicely captured here:

Quote

I can hear them now, "All audio cables that measure the same sound the same." To which I always respond, "Just because you can't hear the difference—who says I can't?"

Roon ROCK (Roon 1.7; NUC7i3) > Ayre QB-9 Twenty > Ayre AX-5 Twenty > Thiel CS2.4SE (crossovers rebuilt with Clarity CSA and Multicap RTX caps, Mills MRA-12 resistors; ERSE and Jantzen coils; Cardas binding posts and hookup wire); Cardas and OEM power cables, interconnects, and speaker cables

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26 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

It seems Audiostream is trying to come up with more and more imaginative ways to troll those who they apparently perceive as a threat.  While it appears that you and Herb might share some affinity for "feeling" rather than "knowing", this looks to me like you're trolling this forum on ML's behalf.

 

Not trolling. I'm not sure what to make of this piece yet. My initial response is more critical than appreciative. The invitation at the end to "walk together" seems an odd conciliatory gesture at the end of a broadside. Again, first impulse, some arguments seem weak.

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1 hour ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

It seems Audiostream is trying to come up with more and more imaginative ways to troll those who they apparently perceive as a threat.  While it appears that you and Herb might share some affinity for "feeling" rather than "knowing", this looks to me like you're trolling this forum on ML's behalf.

LOL, - I'd love to see your definition of "knowing." Talk about trolling,...  

anti-audiophiles who come on an Audiophile website and try to "sell" their speculative belief system in order to denigrate and change the minds of audiophiles....

 

Question, (and believe me, I have major criticisms of Audiostream), how can someone troll their own site?

 

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1 hour ago, christopher3393 said:

This little broadside just popped up on Audiostream:

 

https://www.audiostream.com/content/audio-without-numbers

 

I'd love to see intelligent critical responses  rather than angry venting or ridicule.

 

48_1172_365.1_ph_web.thumb.jpg.24cac8e9550661b476049527893b3706.jpg

"" Self-proclaimed audio objectivists, like those that troll audio forums, are not scientists, or audio professionals; they have not directly experienced the giant Sound Lab speakers or the acoustic-wind of a 15A/13A Western Electric horn system. They are pathologically self-centered people who watch the hurricane on TV and then later, tell the hurricane survivor that lost their cat, "That wasn't a hurricane—it was only a tropical storm."  """

 

This is sooooooo true! WOW...

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1 hour ago, christopher3393 said:

 

Not trolling. I'm not sure what to make of this piece yet. My initial response is more critical than appreciative. The invitation at the end to "walk together" seems an odd conciliatory gesture at the end of a broadside. Again, first impulse, some arguments seem weak.

 

Like someone said upstream, it's just more of the same of the objectivist/subjectivist divide.  I find Herb's "poetic" thinking out of place, given what we know about even the subjectivist side of audio (the personal, "sounds like" aspect that is very real) to say nothing of all the rest around electronics, engineering, digital, repoduction/waveform, etc.  etc.

 

On the other hand is it not just people who tend to get writing/reviewing jobs?  He (and the rest of the "old guard") have overplayed their hand/position/understanding and are fighting mad and fighting back now that there are other voices now (i.e. forums such as this one) giving another perspective...

Hey MQA, if it is not all $voodoo$, show us the math!

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45 minutes ago, Albrecht said:

LOL, - I'd love to see your definition of "knowing." Talk about trolling,...  

anti-audiophiles who come on an Audiophile website and try to "sell" their speculative belief system in order to denigrate and change the minds of audiophiles....

 

Question, (and believe me, I have major criticisms of Audiostream), how can someone troll their own site?

 

 

There's copious back and forth in the forum about "feeling" vs. "knowing" (notice the scare quotes).  I encourage you to seek that out if you're genuinely curious.

 

ML isn't trolling Audiostream, he's trolling all those mean objectivists that gave him sads.

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27 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

The validation that piece has given to the faithful there is palpable.  Just read the comments section.

 

That is all he has left as he has banned anyone who does not already agree with them.  It is probably not an accident that Herb has published this piece at audio stream instead of stereophile because JA to his credit would allow an opposing viewpoint.

Hey MQA, if it is not all $voodoo$, show us the math!

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34 minutes ago, Samuel T Cogley said:

 

There's copious back and forth in the forum about "feeling" vs. "knowing" (notice the scare quotes).  I encourage you to seek that out if you're genuinely curious.

 

ML isn't trolling Audiostream, he's trolling all those mean objectivists that gave him sads.

"There's copious back and forth in the forum about "feeling" vs. "knowing" (notice the scare quotes)"

 

It looks like I mis-interpreted your meaning there: sorry about that.

 

""ML isn't trolling Audiostream, he's trolling all those mean objectivists that gave him sads.""

Got it, - I don't disagree that ML gets "triggered" pretty quickly and easily, and has a tendency to be a bit preachy.

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2 minutes ago, crenca said:

 

That is all he has left as he has banned anyone who does not already agree with them.  It is probably not an accident that Herb has published this piece at audio stream instead of stereophile because JA to his credit would allow an opposing viewpoint.

 

audio fascism ??

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1 minute ago, crenca said:

 

That is all he has left as he has banned anyone who does not already agree with them.  It is probably not an accident that Herb has published this piece at audio stream instead of stereophile because JA to his credit would allow an opposing viewpoint.

I haven't seen any evidence that ML has banned people that for an opposing viewpoint. I have seen evidence that he's banned people for being rude & disrespectful.

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That article is an amazing condensation of ignorance.  Leaving the strawman argument aside, he cannot get very far without making errors, for example,  meteorologists are not scientists at all - they have an undergraduate degree (sometimes less) and then get certified by the American Meteorological Society then get a job (often on TV) where they give weather forecasts (on TV, it is just based on NWS forecasts with some fun graphics).  He may be "cornfusing" that with Climatologists (who are scientists, with PhDs + a post-doc usually who study mechanisms causing climate, past records, effects, etc.

 

Then there is the mis-description of science... he obviously does not know what an experiment is, and then makes a claim of equivalence that no scientist would make.

 

The FDA "demand(s) illusionist parlor tricks like blind "testing"" of drugs and medical devices.  I wonder how many drugs he is on?
 

 

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Hurricanes?  I lost my house to Hurricane Harvey flooding.  It was quite a shock to come home and see furniture tossed everywhere, fridge at a 45 degree angle, audio gear and LP's ruined along with everything else in the house.  Is there some reason why we have to listen at rock concert volume levels driven by super efficient speakers?  Only if you want to.

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4 minutes ago, Albrecht said:

I haven't seen any evidence that ML has banned people that for an opposing viewpoint. I have seen evidence that he's banned people for being rude & disrespectful.

ML is pompous. Gotta be one of the worst audio snobs going imo. Hate to say such things but he makes no apologies.

 

 

 

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