I have an intent to buy an Oppo-205 - anybody have any thoughts?

[Ralf11]

What are the negative comments in between the lines in that review?

[beerandmusic]

11 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

What are the negative comments in between the lines in that review?

 

"Great value" & "paired with an SOTM", shows improvement possible (wink).

 

I think we should start looking at clocks in next generation future purchases....but currently, i really do not believe the oppo can be beat for the price...same as the reviewer....

 

[semente]

31 minutes ago, Ralf11 said:

What are the negative comments in between the lines in that review?

 

That's a good question... I think the press gave up on that.

 

Nowadays it's all good, someone is bound to like it, there is no benchmark.

[semente]

28 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

"Great value" & "paired with an SOTM", shows improvement possible (wink).

 

I think we should start looking at clocks in next generation future purchases....but currently, i really do not believe the oppo can be beat for the price...same as the reviewer....

 

 

I think that you would make a great reviewer.

Have you thought about applying for a job in the press? 

[beerandmusic]

58 minutes ago, semente said:

 

I think that you would make a great reviewer.

Have you thought about applying for a job in the press? 

 

are you kidding me, i am great whatever i do (wink)

 

I was thinking that would be an ideal job! 

Think of all the new toys....christmas every day.....

 

The hard part though, would be thinking of new ways to make every product sound great without sounding critical, so that they keep sending product.  I was talking to a "recently retired" professional reviewer, and he admittedly stated he feels relief now that he is retired where he can be more "open" with his opinions....

[marce]

16 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

What are the negative comments in between the lines in that review?

Its not a true audiophile device according to some, it is to cheap...

[beerandmusic]

4 hours ago, marce said:

Its not a true audiophile device according to some, it is to cheap...

not cheap, but inexpensive ...most product costing much more are cheaper in quality.. (wink)

 

I think many products won't sound nearly as good costing much more.

[GUTB]

The reviewer specifically mentioned weaknesses in resolution, harmonic structuring, dynamics and a few other areas. Sure, he made sure to couch these observations in qualifiers, but he needed to put them in print anyway. Passing it through the audiophile press positive review filter, it appears to match the general opinion — the Sonica (and by extension the 205) is a mediocre DAC.

 

Is it a real DAC, even if mediocre? Hmmm....yes, I believe it does fall into the real DAC category.

[beerandmusic]

4 minutes ago, GUTB said:

The reviewer specifically mentioned weaknesses in resolution, harmonic structuring, dynamics and a few other areas. Sure, he made sure to couch these observations in qualifiers, but he needed to put them in print anyway. Passing it through the audiophile press positive review filter, it appears to match the general opinion — the Sonica (and by extension the 205) is a mediocre DAC.

 

Is it a real DAC, even if mediocre? Hmmm....yes, I believe it does fall into the real DAC category.

I didn't remember reading that at all, so i went back and searched Resolution, and NOWHERE does it mention a weakness in resolution.  In fact just the opposite, so i will assume the rest of your observation is bogus as well.

 

The only thing even close to being negative about resolution is:

The file player section plays most hi-res files, though not the highest-resolution ones.

 

And i believe it plays up to quad DSD, so maybe it won't do 8x DSD, but it plays higher resolution than most players and MUCH higher than any PCM only dac.

 

Nowhere does it mention a weakness in resolution.....The other instances of the word resolution, all say plays great high resolution music.

 

[Samuel T Cogley]

21 minutes ago, GUTB said:

The reviewer specifically mentioned weaknesses in resolution, harmonic structuring, dynamics and a few other areas. Sure, he made sure to couch these observations in qualifiers, but he needed to put them in print anyway. Passing it through the audiophile press positive review filter, it appears to match the general opinion — the Sonica (and by extension the 205) is a mediocre DAC.

 

Is it a real DAC, even if mediocre? Hmmm....yes, I believe it does fall into the real DAC category.

 

I've had a Sonica since they came out, and I'd characterize it as an $800 DAC that performs like an $800 DAC.  Lots of input features, and sound quality that is rather pedestrian except if you feed it DSD512 (which I presume bypasses all internal upsampling) with HQPlayer.  In that scenario, I'd say it punches into the $1500 range of sound quality.  But I will admit that upsampling to DSD512 is pretty impractical and takes a lot of CPU/GPU.  I would not call the Sonica a "giant killer", but it's a solid DAC with lots of features and is probably worth around its asking price.

[GUTB]

“The soundstage was not defined with pinpoint accuracy,”

 

“It tracked the changing dynamic level quite well, if not as precisely as some much more expensive DACs.”

 

”my larger system...portrays the instruments with more texture and detail, more accurately rendered harmonic structures, and a more precise soundstage....Sometimes you do get what you pay for.”

 

“There was an ever-so-slight hardness to the main choral group’s sound.”

 

The online article is missing the highlight panel, I’ll get those later.

 

[marce]

It's to cheep to be a real audiophile product...

Discounting the fancy cases, there is not a lot of difference in BOM's between the very expensive DACs and the DACs similar to the Oppo, though the Oppo is likely to use real components rather than audiophile components and be engineered NOT voiced.

[Ralf11]

2 hours ago, GUTB said:

“The soundstage was not defined with pinpoint accuracy,”

 

“It tracked the changing dynamic level quite well, if not as precisely as some much more expensive DACs.”

 

”my larger system...portrays the instruments with more texture and detail, more accurately rendered harmonic structures, and a more precise soundstage....Sometimes you do get what you pay for.”

 

“There was an ever-so-slight hardness to the main choral group’s sound.”

 

The online article is missing the highlight panel, I’ll get those later.

 

 

of course his larger system is completely different, not just the Oppo

[beancounter]

1 hour ago, marce said:

 the Oppo is likely to use real components rather than audiophile components and be engineered NOT voiced.

 

I'll disagree here, I find most mid-fi AV gear to be deliberately voiced for the AV experience. Which is fine, that's the market it is aiming for.  Clarity and timbre aren't the AV end goal. In fact the target user likely would find that "dull" and "lifeless". 

[tmtomh]

1 hour ago, beancounter said:

 

I'll disagree here, I find most mid-fi AV gear to be deliberately voiced for the AV experience. Which is fine, that's the market it is aiming for.  Clarity and timbre aren't the AV end goal. In fact the target user likely would find that "dull" and "lifeless". 

 

AV speakers certainly tend to be voiced for the AV experience, and many AV receivers/amps tend not to be amazing at 2-channel stereo because of cost-cutting required to provide 6, 8, or more channels of surround-sound amplification.

 

But Oppo's universal players are in no way "voiced for AV," nor are they especially colored in any particular manner. And their 95, 105, and 205 machines are notable for being designed with an emphasis on audio performance separate from the AV features.

[beancounter]

Well, to each his own. Oppo just doesn't cut it for me.  Wish it did. 

[Ralf11]

I'd be glad to hear your listening impressions, comparison tests or whatever...

[sandyk]

4 minutes ago, beancounter said:

Well, to each his own. Oppo just doesn't cut it for me.  Wish it did. 

 

You can always feed it into a higher quality DAC

[beerandmusic]

22 minutes ago, beancounter said:

Well, to each his own. Oppo just doesn't cut it for me.  Wish it did. 

 

Did you do a/b comparison testing for Native DSD over ethernet, because if you did, i would love to hear more about your comparison....or are you a pcm guy?

[beancounter]

26 minutes ago, sandyk said:

 

You can always feed it into a higher quality DAC

 

I need a good DSD capable DAC, I already have a good SACD spinner. Which I will likely dump when I start ripping my SACDs.  Don't 'need' video or multichannel 

 

11 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

Did you do a/b comparison testing for Native DSD over ethernet, because if you did, i would love to hear more about your comparison....or are you a pcm guy?

 

Love me some DSD. Not sure I have specifically heard the Oppo via Ethernet connection. But the simple fact that the ModWright updates fix it leads me to beleive the  issues are analog circuit and power supply. Modified it is competitive at its price. 

[beerandmusic]

20 minutes ago, beancounter said:

 

I need a good DSD capable DAC, I already have a good SACD spinner. Which I will likely dump when I start ripping my SACDs.  Don't 'need' video or multichannel 

 

Love me some DSD. Not sure I have specifically heard the Oppo via Ethernet connection. But the simple fact that the ModWright updates fix it leads me to beleive the  issues are analog circuit and power supply. Modified it is competitive at its price. 

 

Anyone can modify any DAC and improve it's SQ...so based on that, based on your logicc ALL dacs or hifi gear have issues that need to be fixed.  OPPO Modwright updates cost over $2K...

 

There is nothing competitive inre the OPPO 205...nothing offers more for less, not even close.

 

The only reason some equipment MAKE ANY SENSE for doing a $2K update on them is because they ARE brilliantly designed with lots of features.  AYRE even makes a $20K version of an OPPO.

 

More manufacturers should take note of OPPOS success....the boutique shops won't even come close to being able to compete (they would go out of businesses trying to match their quality at their price point)...the only reason OPPO can do it is because of sales volume (based on best bang for the buck)

[beerandmusic]

27 minutes ago, beancounter said:

Love me some DSD. Not sure I have specifically heard the Oppo via Ethernet connection.

 

I suggest you use a quality native DSD as your source refernce and play that song over and over until you are very familiar with it.

Then play if over ethernet via an oppo.

Then rip it, or obtain same dff file and play it to say a $1500 PCM only DAC.  Of course it would have to be downsampled by the player to even be compatible with other dac.  Then the DAC would hardware upsample same song to a lower resolution than the native DSD dff file.

Compare them....I am relatively certain you would agree the OPPO playing the native DSD file over ethernet will sound better than any PCM only dac you can throw it at....(provided the only thing that is changed is the oppo vs your flavor dac).

[GUTB]

7 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

Anyone can modify any DAC and improve it's SQ...so based on that, based on your logicc ALL dacs or hifi gear have issues that need to be fixed.  OPPO Modwright updates cost over $2K...

 

There is nothing competitive inre the OPPO 205...nothing offers more for less, not even close.

 

The only reason some equipment MAKE ANY SENSE for doing a $2K update on them is because they ARE brilliantly designed with lots of features.  AYRE even makes a $20K version of an OPPO.

 

More manufacturers should take note of OPPOS success....the boutique shops won't even come close to being able to compete (they would go out of businesses trying to match their quality at their price point)...the only reason OPPO can do it is because of sales volume (based on best bang for the buck)

 

Rather, the Oppo has a mediocre output stage that benefits from upgrading. The Modwright setup appears to add a much better output stage using high end audiophile capacitors and circuitry. I'm not a giant fan of the tube-rectified transformer option, but it's certainly better than the pedestrian consumer grade power supply stock. Actually, there was someone in the Buy/Sell forum last week that posted as ad for high-quality power supply replacement for the 205.

 

 

 

[beerandmusic]

6 minutes ago, GUTB said:

 

Rather, the Oppo has a mediocre output stage that benefits from upgrading. The Modwright setup appears to add a much better output stage using high end audiophile capacitors and circuitry. I'm not a giant fan of the tube-rectified transformer option, but it's certainly better than the pedestrian consumer grade power supply stock. Actually, there was someone in the Buy/Sell forum last week that posted as ad for high-quality power supply replacement for the 205.

 

 

 

 

Your post just confirms what I was saying.

 

Again, you can add a "better" ps to any piece of equipment...that doesn't mean something needs fixing...

You can add a better PS to a SOTM Ultra...does that mean the ULTRA needs fixing?  It just costs more money.

You can add a better PS to a $2K dac and make it better, right??....and you improve the PS probably for 10 times the money too....this does not diminish anything from the OPPO being a great product for the money....and probably one of the BEST for the money!

 

Name something better for less, and please don't mention any PCM only dacs....I have already disproven them to myself that they can be beat very cheaply with my native DSD reference files.  Name any that you think will be better for less and I will certainly try it.  NOTE: if it doesn't have an ethernet interface and support DSD, it likely WILL NOT.

 

[GUTB]

17 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

Your post just confirms what I was saying.

 

Again, you can add a "better" ps to any piece of equipment...that doesn't mean something needs fixing...

You can add a better PS to a SOTM Ultra...does that mean the ULTRA needs fixing?  It just costs more money.

You can add a better PS to a $2K dac and make it better, right??....and you improve the PS probably for 10 times the money too....this does not diminish anything from the OPPO being a great product for the money....and probably one of the BEST for the money!

 

Name something better for less, and please don't mention any PCM only dacs....I have already disproven them to myself that they can be beat very cheaply with my native DSD reference files.  Name any that you think will be better for less and I will certainly try it.  NOTE: if it doesn't have an ethernet interface and support DSD, it likely WILL NOT.

 

 

I believe I've already mentioned the better DACs for less: Gustard X20 Pro and A20H. And as I recall, you simply didn't care.

 

There's little value in trying to spend a fortune in trying to upgrade already highly performing gear. The value proposition comes into play when you get a low-cost, pedestrian-performing DAC like the Oppo and spend a reasonable amount to greatly improve it.