I have an intent to buy an Oppo-205 - anybody have any thoughts?

[Norton]

2 hours ago, GUTB said:

 

No, but it's widely seen to be inferior by the audiophile community. For example:

 

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/oppo-vs-esoteric

 

"Had a Oppo  and the Esoteric crushed it."

 

"My Ayon Cd5s is several leagues ahead of my Oppo105D - so much so that the Oppo on SACD is far beneath Red book on Ayon. So I use my Oppo to listen to the audio tracks of DVD and Blue Ray movies only."

 

"I then took an Esoteric K 07 for a spin, and that was the end of the Oppo, the baby Esoteric is just in a different league"

 

"I agree with most posters here,having owned several Esoteric now for 8 or 9 years and heard OPPO stock and modified...thers no comparison,none"

 

"OP....I have an Opp 105 which I use as a transport into 2 DACs, the Mytek Manhatten and the Bryston BDA 3.  Both DACs clearly smoke the native Oppo DAC."

 

"each year I compare my  (10 -15 year old) wadia 861se to my oppo 105, and they are not even in the same county."

 

"I have an OPPO 103D and it's a great machine for the money....  but it's no Esoteric...   not even close."

 

"I had a parasound cd1 and it ran circles around any oppo machine. Oppo is good for the price but the other stuff is next level."

 

"However, I put it up against an older Bryston player and it lost, up against the parsasound cd 1 not even close. Luxman d06 not close. Ayon cd2 not close. Solutions 540. Not in the same building!"

 

 

 

 

 

Just to repeat, I own both an Esoteric K07x and an Oppo 105.  The Esoteric is better, but I certainly wouldn't describe the degree of  difference as being anything like on the hyperbolic scale outlined above.  In fact before I owned the current Esoteric I bought an ex Dem example of the earlier k07 unseen and sent it back simply because it didn't offer an all round improvement on the Oppo..

[beerandmusic]

2 minutes ago, Norton said:

 

Just to repeat, I own both an Esoteric K07x and an Oppo 105.  The Esoteric is better, but I certainly wouldn't describe the degree of  difference as being anything like on the hyperbolic scale outlined above.  In fact before I owned the current Esoteric I bought an ex Dem example of the earlier k07 unseen and sent it back simply because it didn't offer an all round improvement on the Oppo..

 

Yea, i think i have been chasing dacs too long....I haven't heard anything revolutionary even over a $300 ifi at any cost....and I actually prefer native dsd over a cheap dac than pcm over a $1500 pcm dac....i think i would be content with native dsd using jriver on an oppo over ethernet.

 

BTW, what is cost difference between an oppo multifunction 105 as compared to the esoteric...

[mav52]

4 hours ago, beerandmusic said:

 

Yea, i think i have been chasing dacs too long....I haven't heard anything revolutionary even over a $300 ifi at any cost....and I actually prefer native dsd over a cheap dac than pcm over a $1500 pcm dac....i think i would be content with native dsd using jriver on an oppo over ethernet.

 

BTW, what is cost difference between an oppo multifunction 105 as compared to the esoteric...

That Esoteric player noted is only $5,999  take your pick https://www.musicdirect.com/equipment/esoteric/?category=Equipment&manufacturer=Esoteric&sort=popularity|DESC&page=1&pagesize=24&c1=tab-products&c2=grid

[GUTB]

The 07X is the bottom of the line — but I’d still expect it to be significantly better than the 205.

 

Also, Esoterics are much cheaper from Japan. The 07X is around $4k.

[mav52]

34 minutes ago, GUTB said:

The 07X is the bottom of the line — but I’d still expect it to be significantly better than the 205.

 

Also, Esoterics are much cheaper from Japan. The 07X is around $4k.

It ought to be since its a dedicated player and not a universal player. A long way from $1,299 to $5,999, the Esoterics are great players I wish I had one, but I will have to stay with my Marantz which I bought used and my OPPO does duty handling HT duties.

 

FYI: A person (me) buying in the US from a direct shipment from Japan on this item which weighs  31 lbs and shipping to my home in FLA.

 

Cost $626.00 to ship it FedEx International, plus an total import duty and fees of $485.00 not counting the cost of the unit which I used your $4,000. . And then trying to get warranty service is almost impossible. 

 

[NOMBEDES]

I have a Yamaha CD S 2000 SACD in daily use.   Very high quality.  I am a big fan of high end Yamaha and other "big name" Japanese  

gear.  Hits all my buttons, esp. price point!

[semente]

13 hours ago, GUTB said:

 

No, but it's widely seen to be inferior by the audiophile community. For example:

 

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/oppo-vs-esoteric

 

"Had a Oppo  and the Esoteric crushed it."

 

"My Ayon Cd5s is several leagues ahead of my Oppo105D - so much so that the Oppo on SACD is far beneath Red book on Ayon. So I use my Oppo to listen to the audio tracks of DVD and Blue Ray movies only."

 

"I then took an Esoteric K 07 for a spin, and that was the end of the Oppo, the baby Esoteric is just in a different league"

 

"I agree with most posters here,having owned several Esoteric now for 8 or 9 years and heard OPPO stock and modified...thers no comparison,none"

 

"OP....I have an Opp 105 which I use as a transport into 2 DACs, the Mytek Manhatten and the Bryston BDA 3.  Both DACs clearly smoke the native Oppo DAC."

 

"each year I compare my  (10 -15 year old) wadia 861se to my oppo 105, and they are not even in the same county."

 

"I have an OPPO 103D and it's a great machine for the money....  but it's no Esoteric...   not even close."

 

"I had a parasound cd1 and it ran circles around any oppo machine. Oppo is good for the price but the other stuff is next level."

 

"However, I put it up against an older Bryston player and it lost, up against the parsasound cd 1 not even close. Luxman d06 not close. Ayon cd2 not close. Solutions 540. Not in the same building!"

 

 

 

 

 

Unfortunately, randomly picked opinions by people we don't know are worth nought.

Just like most magazine reviews.

 

P.S.: even if they happen to be correct.

[Ralf11]

still waiting GUT-B

 

is Stereophile part of the Audiophile Community?

 

or not?  if not, why not?

[robocop]

I've been checking out new Dacs and settled on the 205. It's an excellent DAC in my view certainly a step up from the Benchmark DAC2L which it has replaced. In my system I do watch live concerts BR, DVD, s first followed by music. It runs direct into amplifiers. In the future I may buy another dedicated Dac as technology advances and prices come down. Certainly Chinese dedicated Dac,s are worth watching as they are very good value for money and will get better. In terms of combined video and audio performance it has no competition currently. If you enjoy radio with pictures it's a no brainer but is still great on dedicated music.  

I do run a dedicated stereo only with this machine.

[GUTB]

The 205 is a mediocre DAC at best.

 

BTW, are there any differences between ultra HD Blu-ray players in terms of ultra hd video quality? What I’m reading suggests there is no difference. Does my sub-$200 Phillips play ultra hd Blu-ray material just as well as the 205?

[marce]

On 14/11/2017 at 2:01 PM, GUTB said:

voicing,

If we are going for ultimate fidelity, then where does voicing come in... That implies creating a specific sound which is not true fidelity...

[marce]

I like the Oppo, would be the perfect solution for the living room, all in one solution. For my music room though I am going to audition the Benchmark DAC3.

Looking at the insides of the different devices I don't see £5,000 grands worth of difference between the BOMs, and even with the best layout you will only achieve 21 bit resolution at conversion, why bother with 32 bit, its usually for floating point DSP stuff.

[Ralf11]

11 hours ago, GUTB said:

The 205 is a mediocre DAC at best.

 

BTW, are there any differences between ultra HD Blu-ray players in terms of ultra hd video quality? What I’m reading suggests there is no difference. Does my sub-$200 Phillips play ultra hd Blu-ray material just as well as the 205?

 

 

Still waiting on your views of whether Stereophile is an audiophile publication ???

[GUTB]

Just now, Ralf11 said:

 

 

Still waiting on your views of whether Stereophile is an audiophile publication ???

 

Yes, obviously. But they also have to deal with a lot of politics.

[GUTB]

WELL GUYS,

 

I just read TAS's review of the Sonica in the latest issue. The reviewer put it into a secondary system (his main system has an unnamed $6K DAC).

 

The review boils down to this: the Sonica does everything well, nothing spectacularly, and is a little weak in soundstage, dynamics, resolution and harmonic structuring (but nothing seriously wrong with those areas). So, it's a mediocre DAC. 

[Ralf11]

They rated the old Oppo-105 as Class A.

 

https://www.stereophile.com/content/recommended-components-2017-edition-disc-players-transports-media-players

 

The 205 should have better SQ than the 105.

[beancounter]

3 hours ago, Ralf11 said:

They rated the old Oppo-105 as Class A.

 

https://www.stereophile.com/content/recommended-components-2017-edition-disc-players-transports-media-players

 

The 205 should have better SQ than the 105.

Incremental improvement maybe but nothing much, to my ears. Did they update the audio circuits?

 

I referred to the review earlier  without comment. Yes, if you need an all in one machine, there is none better. 

 

As a DAC, meh. It's just not very good, there is better for less. 

[Kal Rubinson]

11 hours ago, beancounter said:

 

As a DAC, meh. It's just not very good, there is better for less. 

In stereo, perhaps.  For multichannel, there is no better, cheaper DAC.

[beancounter]

8 minutes ago, Kal Rubinson said:

In stereo, perhaps.  For multichannel, there is no better, cheaper DAC.

Agreed. 

 

But I would rather have good stereo than mediocre multichannel.  Others may have a different perspective tho. 

[beerandmusic]

The sonica, which has same dac circuitry as the DAC stereo circuitry of the 205 just got reviewed by the absolute sound!

 

"an easy recommendation" !!

If the Sonica were just a DAC, it would still be a deal, but it’s also a versatile streaming file player.

 

Paired with the SOtM sMS-200 streaming music player, another high-value component, the Sonica’s DAC was even more spectacular playing the highest-resolution files commercially available. In short, the Oppo Digital Sonica sounded and looked great, and was a super deal for $799

 

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/oppo-digital-sonica-network-dac/?page=4

 

 

[beancounter]

On ‎11‎/‎18‎/‎2017 at 3:35 PM, GUTB said:

WELL GUYS,

 

I just read TAS's review of the Sonica in the latest issue. The reviewer put it into a secondary system (his main system has an unnamed $6K DAC).

 

The review boils down to this: the Sonica does everything well, nothing spectacularly, and is a little weak in soundstage, dynamics, resolution and harmonic structuring (but nothing seriously wrong with those areas). So, it's a mediocre DAC. 

 

1 hour ago, beerandmusic said:

The sonica, which has same dac circuitry as the DAC stereo circuitry of the 205 just got reviewed by the absolute sound!

 

"an easy recommendation" !!

If the Sonica were just a DAC, it would still be a deal, but it’s also a versatile streaming file player.

 

Paired with the SOtM sMS-200 streaming music player, another high-value component, the Sonica’s DAC was even more spectacular playing the highest-resolution files commercially available. In short, the Oppo Digital Sonica sounded and looked great, and was a super deal for $799

 

http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/oppo-digital-sonica-network-dac/?page=4

 

 

 

Well, that settles it then

[beerandmusic]

6 minutes ago, beancounter said:

Well, that settles it then

 

YES, I think so....GREAT VALUE!  But I already knew that....glad you agree (smile)

 

Just offering other opinions by professional reviewers, who's thoughts may be different than those that bad mouth stuff without ever even trying it.

 

 

[GUTB]

4 minutes ago, beerandmusic said:

 

YES, I think so....GREAT VALUE!  But I already knew that....glad you agree (smile)

 

Just offering other opinions by professional reviewers, who's thoughts may be different than those that bad mouth stuff without ever even trying it.

 

 

 

Are you new to audiophile press reviews? Everything they review is good, you have to read in between the lines and pick out the negative comments no matter how much they get buried in qualifiers and value arguments. Not that it matters anyway, you've attached your ego to the Oppo and that's that.

[beerandmusic]

4 minutes ago, GUTB said:

 

Are you new to audiophile press reviews? Everything they review is good, you have to read in between the lines and pick out the negative comments no matter how much they get buried in qualifiers and value arguments. Not that it matters anyway, you've attached your ego to the Oppo and that's that.

 

I have seen bad reviews, but agree that they are rare, but then again, there really isn't that much difference to discern.

At the price point, i think anyone would be a fool to talk down the oppo.... I would even go as far as saying I would guess that playing an SACD of steely Dan Gaucho on it will sound BETTER, than a ripped dsf file of same, then hardware upsampled by a $2K usb PCM only dac (using same speakers and amp).

 

[GUTB]

1 minute ago, beerandmusic said:

 

I have seen bad reviews, but agree that they are rare, but then again, there really isn't that much difference to discern.

At the price point, i think anyone would be a fool to talk down the oppo.... I would even go as far as saying I would guess that playing an SACD of steely Dan Gaucho on it will sound BETTER, than a ripped dsf file of same, then hardware upsampled by a $2K usb PCM only dac.

 

 

This is not a guarantee by any means.

 

It's true that DSD is better than PCM. It's true that the ES9038 is a native-DSD chip -- well not really it still pads the DSD stream with extra bits but according to Miska this is still lossless. But the quality difference between DSD and PCM isn't so great that a PCM-only DAC can't beat it as long as it has a superior output stage and better power system.