Allo Digione

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi Dr. J, it’s 2 batteries in a battery pack from Amazon with a dc plug on the end followed by some converters leading to a USB C plug putting out 7.4 volts in total and that’s going into the Clean Power Signature input. Allo says that’s fine.

 

i’m not Using a voltage regulator on the batteries, but plan to experiment with one, or a cascade, with a couple of iFi iPowers I have spare.

 

The voltages are more or less the same for the Pi and the (Signature) hat, and you need a separate power supply for each.

 

I currently have an iPower or Allo SMPS (according to mood) followed by an iFi DC iPurifier 2 feeding 5v to the Pi, and 2 Samsung 18650 batteries feeding 7.4v to the hat (often referred to as the Dirty and Clean Power inputs respectively on the Digione Signature) which is where you fit both power leads from your 2 power supplies.

 

i have ordered the Allo battery pack which takes 4 18650 batteries and apparently puts out the same kind of voltage as my 2 batteries do currently. That should arrive in a few days time and I’m looking forward to trying that out, along with a regulated iPower.

 

Hope that helps?

[Dr.J]

Yes, RX8R3ROD, this helps, thank you! I have some large 7.4v lipo packs for my rc heli, I may try that approach.

 

How are you corresponding with Allo?

 

 Thanks!

[RX8R3ROD]

Sounds like a plan Dr. J! ?? Allo seem to be on the forums, and are generally v quick to respond to questions. Seem a great bunch of guys to me! ?

[steklo]

Hi RX8R3ROD,

 

that means everytime you want to listen music you push the DC plug into Digione and pull it off when you stop listening, right? And everytime you need to recharge the batteries you have take them out of the battery holder and put them into the charger and put them back again after charging?

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi Steklo ..., sounds pretty sad but that’s precisely what I do.

 

The battery pack from Amazon has a switch, but it’s so rubbish it’s easier to unplug than move the switch and find it doesn’t work (again).

 

When I’ve finally settled on my optimum power solution I’ll put it all in a nice case, with proper vibration management courtesy of Sound Damped Steel, a switch and battery charge protection ... and everything ?

 

But until then it doesn’t see worth the trouble to me.

[steklo]

@allo.com:

Do you have any plans to come up with an automatically recharging battery PSU for the clean side of Digione signature (or other sensitive HATs) to free us from the hazzle RX8R3ROD is describing above? Or will the upcoming Nirvana be your final statement so far for a high end PSU?

[allo.com]

6 minutes ago, steklo said:

@allo.com:

Do you have any plans to come up with an automatically recharging battery PSU for the clean side of Digione signature (or other sensitive HATs) to free us from the hazzle RX8R3ROD is describing above? Or will the upcoming Nirvana be your final statement so far for a high end PSU?

No comments on new products. Sorry

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi, a bit more on power supplies for the Signature.

 

I have tried a 9v iFi iPower, with the dc grounding mod, then regulated the iPower to 5 v and filtered it through some nice Panasonic and WIMA caps. 

 

Seems to beat the Lipo batteries now, in my system at least.

 

So my suggestion would be for 10 minutes work and about £10 (if you just stick it on a breadboard until you’ve done the tests) it’s a potentially simple and cheap upgrade to get even more out of your Signature.

 

My plan is to repeat this for my iPowered MiniDSP room correction device (where the dc grounding mod has already made a significant improvement), my SPDIF iPurifier and the router ... and anything else Audio that’s iFi powered. 

 

Little to lose, everything to gain IMHO ... ?

[Dr.J]

RX8R3ROD, how did you regulate the power supply and is there any information regarding the grounding mod?

 

You are doing us all a great service! Thank you!

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi, Dr. J here’s an example of how to regulate a 9v supply https://www.instructables.com/id/Basic-5-Volt-Power-Supply/

and on a breadboard like the example it’s dead easy to experiment with different capacitor values and types / manufacturers.

 

Ditto if you’re experimenting you might want to start with a regulator like they show in the 3xample before moving to try something like an LT3045?

 

The dc mod is (from memory) from Uptone Audio / John Swenson(?)and it aims to drain ‘reflected’ SMPS noise out of the power supply chain to ground. There are some measurements from an iPower (if memory serves me correct) showing really significant noise reduction which seems worth having. You can certainly hear it IME ??

 

That little thing costs literally about 50p to build. The iPower (or whatever) output goes into the female socket and the male socket goes into the equipment (or another adapter to get it into the Signatures usb c power socket). The wire goes to a suitable ground point. I use a Russ Andrews product for that, but I have in the past just run it to an amplifier (or similar) ground point or to earth via clamping to an earthed radiator, etc (but think very carefully before trying that one at home ?) as I think that may be technically illegal now.

 

hope that helps?

 

 

[Dr.J]

Excellent, RX8R3ROD &

 

yes, definitely helpful! I will, in time, follow your lead!

 

 Thank you!

[RX8R3ROD]

Hi Dr. J, 

 

Enjoy. ? IMHO this is half the fun of such an excellent product like the Signature; making it sound better and better still for surprisingly small amounts of dosh!

[Dr.J]

RX8R3ROD, I totally agree!

[RX8R3ROD]

just a bit more on power supplies for the Signature... though first to say that it sounds just great with the standard Allo SMPS supply. 

 

But in my experience, with my electricity supply and in my system ... it can sound positively glorious with some further attention to the power supplies.

 

My best results so far have been with:

 

- iFi iPower 9v > Swenson dc grounding mod > iFi DC iPurifier > iFi Nano usb 3.0 into the ‘dirty’ Pi input socket on the Signature 

- iFi iPower 12v > Swenson dc grounding mod > voltage regulator using Panasonic OSCONs and WIMA’s into the clean power input on the Signature 

 

The latter, in my system, clearly bests the 4 LiPo 18650 battery supply, giving even better timing and so much better ‘shape’ and texture to bass notes (no doubt contributing to the sense of improved timing).

 

I have some Supercaps arriving at the weekend along with some 9v regulators, so it’ll be interesting to see where a double-regulated, supercapped supply leaves me. ?

 

of course, it could be up the creek without a paddle, but on the other hand ... ?

[steklo]

Sorry if that question has been answered already before:

 

Which polarity do I have to choose if I use the type C to DC barrel (5.5mm x 2.5mm) adapters I got from Allo to feed Digione signature? Center plus, outside minus? Please confirm!

[ALLOsupport]

15 hours ago, steklo said:

Sorry if that question has been answered already before:

 

Which polarity do I have to choose if I use the type C to DC barrel (5.5mm x 2.5mm) adapters I got from Allo to feed Digione signature? Center plus, outside minus? Please confirm!

Yes , Center is Positive , Out side is minus

 

[RX8R3ROD]

Well, the supercaps arrived yesterday (big thank you to RS and Farnell) and all I can say is they’re not called that for nothing. ??

 

My better half sat down looking somewhat sceptical she could hear the difference a capacitor makes (and who could blame her, frankly?). Immediately her foot started tapping on songs it had not tapped on before. “Gosh”, she says. “Gosh” say I, looking smug ?.

 

Give it the best power you can, and the Allo Signature just keeps getting better and better!

 

i previously owned a Naim NAC 272 with an XPS power supply, which cost north of £5k, and sounded great.

 

Listening to the Allo that I’m hearing now you might think the prices reversed ...

 

All I can say is if you’re experimenting with power solutions to drive your Sig, it would seem very well worthwhile experimenting with different capacitor types. And it won’t cost you that much ... even Supercapacitors from a brand you’ve heard of can be had for £20 or less. 

 

Hope to try dual regulation later later this weekend if I get time ?

 

 

[RX8R3ROD]

Just a bit more on the power supplies on the Signature.

 

So far on the clean side, and after a bit of experimentation, a 12v iPower and single-regulation to 5v including a hulking great supercapacitor plus OSCON and WIMA’s in the regulator is besting the battery supply now (in my system, with my electricity supply, etc.) by quite some margin.

 

Timing, weighting, note-shape and bass weight and power (through Impulse TD712’s with single 4” drivers, ... and the increase in bass goodness is really obvious ?) improve, and much-improved maintenance of low level detail in the face of loud stuff makes previously-difficult transitions between different parts of complex songs so much more meaningful.

 

Plus there’s more depth and width to the sound, and all that good Hi-Fi type stuff as well.

 

On the dirty side, I have a 9v iPower > DC iPurifier 2 > Nano usb 3.0, and that definitely makes its contribution.

 

You can possibly just about make all this out in the attached picture?

 

More experimenting to do  - which is my excuse for there being bits and pieces everywhere for now ? - but paying attention to how you feed the Signature, on both clean and dirty sides, can make a sensational product even more sensational.

 

For the cost and effort involved, IMHO, it seems a bit of a no brainier... but of course YMMV.

 

My thought now is to also see how a supply like this works with the MiniDSP box that applies the DIRAC room correction ?

 

And if the rumoured Nirvana power supply from Allo can improve on this, I absolutely want some!! ??

 

 

[allo.com]

14 hours ago, RX8R3ROD said:

Just a bit more on the power supplies on the Signature.

 

So far on the clean side, and after a bit of experimentation, a 12v iPower and single-regulation to 5v including a hulking great supercapacitor plus OSCON and WIMA’s in the regulator is besting the battery supply now (in my system, with my electricity supply, etc.) by quite some margin.

 

Timing, weighting, note-shape and bass weight and power (through Impulse TD712’s with single 4” drivers, ... and the increase in bass goodness is really obvious ?) improve, and much-improved maintenance of low level detail in the face of loud stuff makes previously-difficult transitions between different parts of complex songs so much more meaningful.

 

Plus there’s more depth and width to the sound, and all that good Hi-Fi type stuff as well.

 

On the dirty side, I have a 9v iPower > DC iPurifier 2 > Nano usb 3.0, and that definitely makes its contribution.

 

You can possibly just about make all this out in the attached picture?

 

More experimenting to do  - which is my excuse for there being bits and pieces everywhere for now ? - but paying attention to how you feed the Signature, on both clean and dirty sides, can make a sensational product even more sensational.

 

For the cost and effort involved, IMHO, it seems a bit of a no brainier... but of course YMMV.

 

My thought now is to also see how a supply like this works with the MiniDSP box that applies the DIRAC room correction ?

 

And if the rumoured Nirvana power supply from Allo can improve on this, I absolutely want some!! ??

 

 

This is pretty impressive.. we are also experimenting with supercaps. What values (in F) are you using ? We found that for very high values power supply might trip because the supercap looks like a short. Of course , with an LDO in front your current might be limited (lt3042 has current limiting)

[RX8R3ROD]

Well, it’s a pretty impressive tangle of wires, anyway ... ?

 

I am using 12v (assuming the 12v iPower is fairly well regulated, ... I’ve not torn one open to check what components are used) 1 farad supercap in that picture. I have tried putting lower voltage supercaps in series but so far that hasn’t worked quite so well for me.

 

I’ve (possibly luckily?) not had any power trips as yet (and my mains is quite prone to tripping) and have turned the power to the ISOL8 substation mains distribution box from which the iPower is energised on and off quite a few times. Again, that might make some difference?

 

By the way, there is no predetermined magic in my choice of supercap, the ones I am experimenting with are ones that would seem likely to work, were available, and were physically big enough for me to work with.

 

But the results have been brilliant. ?

 

I plan to try some smaller .33F and (from memory) 0.66F ones in the next few weeks, after my holiday, and see how they sound.

 

I very much look forward to seeing - and trying - the commercial results of your experiments! ??

[Dr.J]

I'm wondering if it's possible to use a sshd with the Alo Digione Signature? if it is possible, how would they interface? I ask because I'm also concerned about a bottleneck or impedance to sound quality. 

 

Ripping my cd's to a hard drive would eliminate the need for a cd transport and increase accessibility, be nearly ideal!

[RX8R3ROD]

Could you not perhaps interface your ssd drive via usb with the Raspberry Pi, to which the Signature is attached (though that may affect your ability to remote control playback)?

 

From my experience with using Macs and DACs, powering the SSD with a separate good quality low noise power supply, and attention to usb cables and filters (Jitterbugs and the like) may help sound quality.

[nbpf]

22 hours ago, Dr.J said:

I'm wondering if it's possible to use a sshd with the Alo Digione Signature? if it is possible, how would they interface? I ask because I'm also concerned about a bottleneck or impedance to sound quality. 

 

Ripping my cd's to a hard drive would eliminate the need for a cd transport and increase accessibility, be nearly ideal!

Sure, I run MinimServer and upmpdcli on the RPi that hosts my DigiOne and keep my music library on a 1TB USB drive attached to one of the 4 USB ports of the RPi. If I had a DigiOne Signature, I would do exactly the same. I have tried stopping the MinimServer instance that runs on the RPi and use the RPi + DigiOne as an Ethernet to SPDIF transport and I cannot hear significant differences in my system. 

[Dr.J]

Thank you, R & N. Now that I know this is doable, my next worry involves the quality of the ripping process. I have Nero 8, a desk and a laptop, but, is there any way to avoid data loss or corruption? I know this is now off topic for this forum, but, I thought I’d ask?

 

 Thank you 

[RX8R3ROD]

Different people seem to treat this as more or less critical than others.

 

I have copied quite a bit of computer data to and from CD in my time, and it’s always been readable.

 

Based on that, I have considered it sufficient to just copy music CD’s and assume that they are accurate copies (I use Magix (formerly Sony) SoundForge, for what it’s worth). But some software will let you check accuracy 100%. My experience of this was that it took ages for little/no benefit, but others mileage has varied, I believe... ?

 

Personally, I’d assume you are good with Nero, but it’ll be interesting to see what others think. ?