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Allo Digione


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20 hours ago, allo.com said:

RPI needs at least 1.8A (a bit more on boot a bit less after that)

 

  We recommend at least 2.5A

I guess the requirements also depend on the interfaces that are actually active. I typically switch off the HDMI output, Bluetooth, CPU frequency scaling and underclock the CPU a bit.  

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I’ve found this a really helpful thread, and it very much encouraged me to try, and then experiment with, the Digione. As a bit of a PRaT fan, I just couldn’t believe how good it was into a Minidsp / DIRAC room correction device, Teac UD501 DAC, Naim 72 with RSL cards, Hicap with Avondale regulators, Witch Hat power amp, and Fujitsu Ten Eclipse TD712Z hair dryers. I found, like many others, it was responsive to power supply changes, and run mine from an iFi ipower into an ifi nano USB 3.0.

 

And I’ve just ordered the Digione Signature.

 

It’s supposed to arrive on Friday; I can’t wait ? 

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6 hours ago, RX8R3ROD said:

And luckily I didn’t have to; it arrived today.

 

Despite it needing to run in, etc ... if your tastes are similar to mine, the you certainly won’t regret it. 

 

Fabulous!

HI, 

Have you compared with the classic Digione? 

Source : QNAP TS-131, LMS 7.9, Player Digione

Amp+Cables+Speakers : FDA V200, Audioprana Ag Cryo 4 brins, Atohm GT2

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I have each on a separate pi 3.

 

The signature IME gives more of what for me made the Digione an improvement over the hifiberry (which is itself a great product).

 

Music becomes more interesting as it just seems to time better. Subtle shifts in rhythm become more apparent, and you can far more readily follow a kick drum or bass through complex passages. This extends up the frequency range. So that, for example, vocal harmonies where the rise and fall of backing voices independent of, but intertwined with, the main singer become clearer and more meaningful, etc.

 

Still got to fiddle around with power options, as I’m currently driving the pi from the Allo SMPS and the Digione Sig from the ifi iPower into Nano USB 3. Yet to try out battery power.

 

For my musical tastes, and in my system, the Signature really is money well spent. IME to get a musical improvement of this sort (as opposed to a cosmetic ‘the treble is smoother’ type change) usually costs at least 4 figures, not just 3.

 

And it’s still running in ? so there’s no doubt more to come ...

 

Bravo Allo

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Any news on the aluminium case case :)
I just ordered an aluminium case for the digione a month ago and it would be kind of sad if I had to order a complete new one for the signature. Is it possible to just replace the medium layer of the case to fit it to the signature?

 

Keep up the great work!

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Quick question, with Digione Signature, is it mandatory to have 2 PSU or is it possible to deliver power into Digione card from the rpi (as it is done with the classic Digione)? 

Source : QNAP TS-131, LMS 7.9, Player Digione

Amp+Cables+Speakers : FDA V200, Audioprana Ag Cryo 4 brins, Atohm GT2

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AFAIK it’s 2 power supplies, as I believe this is one of its key features, that the relatively dirty pi-power is isolated from the Digi Signature.

 

I’m using the Allo SMPS on the Pi, and and an ifi iPower into an ifi Nano USB3.0 (which is supposed to be extremely clean power in combination) to the Signature.

 

Plan to try the batteries over the weekend, into the Signature. If that’s an improvement I’ll put the ifi kit to driving the Pi.

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Well, I tried a Lipo powerbank powering the Signature but that didn’t sound great, losing a lot of the subtlety and drive ... but it turns out the powerbank has a (presumably low quality) SMPS inside it to get 5v to the USB ports. Have ordered a 9v clip to dc plug to try a 9v alkaline battery, and a 5v ifi iPower.

 

The plan is to try the 5v iPower on the Pi, and the battery on the Signature, comparing that to the existing 9v ifi iPower / ifi Nano USB 3.0 5v via the USB port combination on the Signature, which apparently gives 0.5uv noise / super-low ripple in the audio band.

 

Should know by the weekend ?

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Anyone using an iFi SPDIF iPurifier between their DigiOne and DAC?

MacMini Quad i7/Audirvana Studio/USBridge DigiOne Signature Player/Schiit Yggdrasil GS/Aragon Palladium 1 amplifiers/Stacked Energy 22 speakers (Reference Connoisseur on bottom & Pro 22 on top) set tweeter to tweeter/Kimber Monocle XL speaker wires/Straightwire Crescendo & Virtuoso IC/Mordaunt Short 309 subwoofers

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On 8/28/2018 at 9:35 PM, RX8R3ROD said:

Well, I tried a Lipo powerbank powering the Signature but that didn’t sound great, losing a lot of the subtlety and drive ... but it turns out the powerbank has a (presumably low quality) SMPS inside it to get 5v to the USB ports. Have ordered a 9v clip to dc plug to try a 9v alkaline battery, and a 5v ifi iPower.

 

The plan is to try the 5v iPower on the Pi, and the battery on the Signature, comparing that to the existing 9v ifi iPower / ifi Nano USB 3.0 5v via the USB port combination on the Signature, which apparently gives 0.5uv noise / super-low ripple in the audio band.

 

Should know by the weekend ?

A french guy has compared Digione classic and Digione Signature with a ifi ipower. Same bad result for him with a lose of rythm and energy. I have noted the same behaviour on a Digione classic powered by an ifi ipower. 

If you are retired and only listen to chamber music or intimate jazz, you should still enjoy. This type of restitution is perfect for the nap.

Source : QNAP TS-131, LMS 7.9, Player Digione

Amp+Cables+Speakers : FDA V200, Audioprana Ag Cryo 4 brins, Atohm GT2

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Yes, between DigiOne Signature and DAC, with a MinDSP 88D running DIRAC doing room correction duties in between.

 

I have a coax connection to the MiniDSP, and both a coax and an optical connection with ifi SPDIF iPurifier on the optical connection to the DAC.

 

To my ears both sound really good, the coax is maybe a bit more ‘direct’ with more drive, the optical with ifi SPDIF iPurifier has perhaps a little bit less of these attributes, but sounds less ‘busy’. I can’t make up my mind which is best, I think they’re just different and each seems to suit some recordings more than others.

 

However, to my ears in my system, without the SPDIF iPurifier, the coax is a clear winner!

 

As for the iPower, I know what r11bordo is getting at. On the Pi in my system the iPower sounds v smooth but perhaps a little laid back, compared to the Allo supply which seems to have more guts and grunt (however, other folks have come up with directly contradictory conclusions to this, so this is seemingly system and / or listener dependent) although somewhat ‘rougher’.

 

My optimum - so far - is the Allo SMPS followed by an ifi DC iPurifier 2 driving the Pi (the DC iPurifier seems to remove the roughness but doesn’t reduce drive and dynamics), with an iFi iPower 9v followed by an iFi Nano USB 3.0 driving the DigiOne Signature.

 

In that latter role to my ears the iPower displays absolutely no lack of drive. However, that may be because the Nano is taking the smoothed, low-noise iPower output then regulating it (which I suspect is the crucial bit) and further filtering it .... and to my ears that combination works really well.

 

Am expecting some of the LiPo batteries Allo recommends tomorrow and it’ll be interesting to see if they can improve on the iPower/Nano when driving the Signature.

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Hey guys, quick question regarding the BNC output of the DigiOne ... Can anyone confirm to me whether the connector is 75 Ohms or 50 Ohms ? I read around that I had to buy my cable accordingly, to avoid potentially sound-degrading side-effects.

Apparently there's a way to tell them apart just by looking at them but I'm (obviously) no expert and just wanted a confirmation ?

Thanks !

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6 hours ago, bbross84 said:

Hey guys, quick question regarding the BNC output of the DigiOne ... Can anyone confirm to me whether the connector is 75 Ohms or 50 Ohms ? I read around that I had to buy my cable accordingly, to avoid potentially sound-degrading side-effects.

Apparently there's a way to tell them apart just by looking at them but I'm (obviously) no expert and just wanted a confirmation ?

Thanks !

You need a 75 Ω cable (for example a wordclock cable)

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2 hours ago, olklei said:

You need a 75 Ω cable (for example a wordclock cable)


Thank you so much for replying quickly.

 

Can you elaborate a bit ? I'm trying to learn at the same time ?


Here is what I can find around the web :

 

1. impedance mismatch will cause reflections in the cable, which will degrade the signal (whether this is audible is controversial)

 

2. Wikipedia image for 50 Ohms v. 75 Ohms :
 BNC_50_75_Ohm.jpg

 

3. The Digione connector and my DAC's connector (Chord 2Qute) :

acrylic-case-for-rpi-digione.jpgChord_2Qute Rear BLK.jpg

Seems to me like on both ends there is that white dielectric that's supposed to indicate that they are 50 ohms connectors rather than 75 ohms ? The pictures don't show that properly, but the white stuff is larger in the 2Qute than in the Digione.

Wikipedia says :

Quote

The 75 ohm types can sometimes be recognized by the reduced or absent dielectric in the mating ends but this is by no means reliable.

 

Then again :

Quote

At frequencies below 10 MHz the impedance mismatch between a 50 ohm connector or cable and a 75 ohm one has negligible effects.


So maybe it doesn't matter at all ?

 

I guess I'm really wondering why the impedance of the BNC connectors never seems to be mentioned anywhere. It's not mentioned on ALLO's website (neither for the digione, nor for the RCA-BNC adapter that they sell). It's not mentioned on Chord's website for their DACs ... Is t because it's implied that it's 75 ohm ? Or is it because no one cares and it doesn't make any difference ?

 

In the end, for my own knowledge, which one have you implemented on the ALLO ?

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Hi Dr. J, I’m using Samsung 18650 3000maH, but I suspect the main thing is just to get a reputable brand from a reliable supplier so you don’t end up burning the house down, as unfortunately happened to a friend of mine using Li-Ion batteries.

 

As to whether it’s worth the hassle compared to mains power, that’s a really good question ... and difficult to answer.

 

Personally I’d say yes (though I’m yet to find how long these batteries last, I have used battery-powered equipment fairly extensively, so am used to the hassle of recharging) because it sounds so damn good, and fixes sound quality for things that really bother me.

 

But they might, or might not, bother you quite so much, and I might just be an idiot for letting some aspects of music reproduction bother me that much.

 

One other avenue I plan to explore is to use a spare 9 or 12v iFi iPower and then further regulate and filter it’s output, and see how that sounds. Might be the best of all worlds, perhaps? Until the Nirvana comes along ...?

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21 hours ago, bbross84 said:


Thank you so much for replying quickly.

 

Can you elaborate a bit ? I'm trying to learn at the same time ?


Here is what I can find around the web :

 

1. impedance mismatch will cause reflections in the cable, which will degrade the signal (whether this is audible is controversial)

 

2. Wikipedia image for 50 Ohms v. 75 Ohms :
 

 

3. The Digione connector and my DAC's connector (Chord 2Qute) :



Seems to me like on both ends there is that white dielectric that's supposed to indicate that they are 50 ohms connectors rather than 75 ohms ? The pictures don't show that properly, but the white stuff is larger in the 2Qute than in the Digione.

Wikipedia says :

 

Then again :


So maybe it doesn't matter at all ?

 

I guess I'm really wondering why the impedance of the BNC connectors never seems to be mentioned anywhere. It's not mentioned on ALLO's website (neither for the digione, nor for the RCA-BNC adapter that they sell). It's not mentioned on Chord's website for their DACs ... Is t because it's implied that it's 75 ohm ? Or is it because no one cares and it doesn't make any difference ?

 

In the end, for my own knowledge, which one have you implemented on the ALLO ?

 

First things first:
Does it even matter?
Probably not.
The Sony-Philips-Digital-Inferface (S/PDIF) is standardized in IEC 60958-3. There you'll find the requirement for a 75 Ohm cable for electrical connections using S/PDIF.
Impedance changes lead to reflections but as you already mentioned this only becomes a problem for very high frequencies (like the ones used in video-transmission).
The best thing is to match the impedance of the input/output to the impedance of the cable. However, it is geometrically not possible to make an rca-plug with 75 Ohm impedance. Nevertheless most even high-endish manufactures use rca plugs as s/pdif outputs in their products. I assume, you want to connect your digione to a DAC with a BNC input? According to the spdif specification your DAC will expect a 75 Ohm cable on this input. The best thing you can do is to give it a 75 Ohm cable with 75 Ohm bnc connectors. I'm not a fan of BNC/RCA adaptors because they will introduce an impedance mismatch in themselves. You better just use the rca output of the digione  then. I don't know why the BNC plugs on your chord look like 50 Ohm. There is no valid reason to use 50 Ohm plugs on an output that requires 75 Ohm cables (apart from that you most likely will not notice the difference).
Hope that helps.

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8 minutes ago, olklei said:

 

First things first:
Does it even matter?
Probably not.
The Sony-Philips-Digital-Inferface (S/PDIF) is standardized in IEC 60958-3. There you'll find the requirement for a 75 Ohm cable for electrical connections using S/PDIF.
Impedance changes lead to reflections but as you already mentioned this only becomes a problem for very high frequencies (like the ones used in video-transmission).
The best thing is to match the impedance of the input/output to the impedance of the cable. However, it is geometrically not possible to make an rca-plug with 75 Ohm impedance. Nevertheless most even high-endish manufactures use rca plugs as s/pdif outputs in their products. I assume, you want to connect your digione to a DAC with a BNC input? According to the spdif specification your DAC will expect a 75 Ohm cable on this input. The best thing you can do is to give it a 75 Ohm cable with 75 Ohm bnc connectors. I'm not a fan of BNC/RCA adaptors because they will introduce an impedance mismatch in themselves. You better just use the rca output of the digione  then. I don't know why the BNC plugs on your chord look like 50 Ohm. There is no valid reason to use 50 Ohm plugs on an output that requires 75 Ohm cables (apart from that you most likely will not notice the difference).
Hope that helps.

 

Hi @olklei, @allo.com thanks a lot for taking the time to indulge my curiosity. This does help tremendously (especially with my being insecure about all this ^^)

For the record, in the mean time I've had a clear-cut answer from Chord's support confirming that the BNC input on the 2Qute is also 75 Ohms. I guess I'll start looking for a  BNC/BNC cable ;-)

 

Thank you guys !

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