Mola Mola Pre/dac review compared to DAVE dac

[barrows]

I am not a multi channel/home theatre guy myself, but it sounds like you have it pretty well sorted out.  You mention the KEF speakers, and Vivid, and I have to agree that both of these are among the very best I have ever heard, so I think you are on the right track!

Bruno Putzeys is to me one of the most interesting designers in audio, with Hypex, Mola Mola, and Kii, he is doing wonderful things.

[Marcel073]

Thanks.

I think Vivid sets an extremely competitive price point as their Kaya 45 retail at EUR 16.400 whereas KEF's Blade Two set you back 21k.

I guess you know that the person behind Vivid used to be involved with B&W.

Though I do like the sound of B&W 800 series I do not like their visual appearance.

Yep, I have a wife that has a say in what will enter our living room ?

And she really likes the looks (and sound) of the Blade and Kaya.

Given the price difference of roughly 4,5k I think I will go for the Kaya 45.

 

Have heard to Kii Three also last week in Germany.

Fantastic sound but I'm just not in the market for active speakers.

 

[toetapaudio]

@Marcel073, thanks for your input. It’s great to hear from people who are liking Mola Mola.

 

Vivid and Mola Mola are a great combination, which I’ve heard. I can also highly recommend the Boenicke speaker range which we demonstrate with the Mola Mola dac and power amps, for really good compatibility.

 

@barrows, great comments and insight.

 

Mola Mola Kaluga’s can be compared with the best Class A designs imo. We know of somebody who has switched from a £50k Swiss made class A design to £10k Kaluga’s and was very happy with his decision.

 

As regards where the Benchmark ABH2 stands when we tried it was on par with the cheaper Nord class D amps, no way as good as the SST Son of Ampzilla 2 and all of them not in the same league as the Mola Mola Kaluga’s.

[Marcel073]

Thanks for your reply. Appreciated.

 

Last week I met Sven Boenicke personally at the German hifi show in Bonn.

Still need to send him a mail for prices.

He demonstrated the W5 system.

Amazing sound for that speaker size.

 

[Hyperion]

We did actually demonstrate Mola Mola and Boenicke earlier this year at the High End Audio Show in Stockholm. A match made in audiophile heaven :).

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

 

[Marcel073]

Nice picture.

Quickly checked your website but it is only in Swedish.

[Hyperion]

6 minutes ago, Marcel073 said:

Nice picture.

Quickly checked your website but it is only in Swedish.

 

Well, there's a reason for that ;). Try Google Translate if you're curious, or ask me anything that might interest you and I'll do my best to help.

[toetapaudio]

@Hyperion, that’s our system right there. Nice photo. 

 

We use the Fidata server and Sablon cables with SteinMusic Harmonizers. Plus a stack of Bybee Signal Enhancers on the mains consumer unit, switch and hub. Calms things down dramatically and makes a HUGH improvement given time. We are going to experiment with other mains calming techniques in the near future which I’m very hopeful about. Attention to mains quality is a whole subject in itself and deserves our utmost attention.

 

@Marcel073 it’s a pleasure dealing well with Sven, really nice guy and he knows his stuff. Same with Bruno Putzeys.

[toetapaudio]

Oh, I forgot to mention we also use toetapaudio custom built isolation furniture which is hung on silk threads. All solid wood construction. 

[rickca]

7 hours ago, Hyperion said:

If you're looking for and value the highest grade of neutrality, transparency and resolution above everything else of potential qualities in a system, the Mola Mola Tambaqui will be very, very hard to beat regardless of price based on my experience.

How would Tambaqui compare to the Ayre QX-5?  Has anyone heard both these units?

I'm currently using a Jeff Rowland Aeris with a Berkeley Alpha USB.  I don't know if you guys are familiar with this DAC.

[toetapaudio]

@rickca, we haven’t tried the Ayre QX-5. We have tried against the Chord Dave and others have commentated that they rate the MM compared to Nagra and dCS. Not sure if that helps? Maybe you could borrow a Tambaqui?

[rickca]

7 minutes ago, toetapaudio said:

Maybe you could borrow a Tambaqui?

I'll have to see if I can arrange a home audition through the USA distributor.

[toetapaudio]

@rickca, I believe they have lent out before. Let us know how it goes.

[Hyperion]

I've had the Chord DAVE here (briefly) as well as the Jeff Rowland Aeries earlier. The DAVE is great if you want "excitement" with a high level of drive, energy and resolution. The Aeries is a very nicely built unit as well, but rather dated within this relatively fast moving segment being >6 years old. It's also PCM only if that matters.

 

The Ayre QX-5 is a permanent part of our collection, and one of my personal all-in-one digital units on the market right now. It's much more than a DAC though, and should be judged as such.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

[rickca]

@Hyperion your comments about the Aeris and QX-5 are accurate, but I'd appreciate your assessment of the sound quality of the Tambaqui vs these units.  I understand the differences in functionality.

 

Jeff Rowland has an excellent supercapacitor PSU for the Aeris.  It's an obvious potential upgrade path for me.  I'm just not sure I want to invest that much more money in the Aeris given its somewhat dated design.   That PSU alone costs almost as much as the other DACs.

[Hyperion]

3 hours ago, rickca said:

@Hyperion your comments about the Aeris and QX-5 are accurate, but I'd appreciate your assessment of the sound quality of the Tambaqui vs these units.  I understand the differences in functionality.

 

Jeff Rowland has an excellent supercapacitor PSU for the Aeris.  It's an obvious potential upgrade path for me.  I'm just not sure I want to invest that much more money in the Aeris given its somewhat dated design.   That PSU alone costs almost as much as the other DACs.

 

I'm still awaiting the Mola Mola Tambaqui, which hasn't yet been officially released (at least it's not shipping).

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

 

[Marcel073]

Hi all,

 

Has anyone heard the Merging+NADAC (Network Attached DAC) with "normal" speakers?

 

A few weeks ago I visited the XFi event in Veldhoven, the Netherlands.

 

I heard it being used when teamed up with Daudio dipole speakers, a Dutch speaker brand.

 

Though it sounded fantastic, especially with live recordings of classical concerts, this type of speaker cannot be fitted easily into my 22m2 room.

 

Since most of the items in this particular thread are about Chord Dave and Mola-Mola Tambaqui DAC (or Makua pre-amp).

I'm curious if anyone has (or knows of) an A/B comparison of the M-M or Dave and the NADAC.

 

Merging (A Swiss company apparently well-known in the studio world (*)) also has a Roon-ready player known as Merging+Player that supposedly has the same hardware as the standalone NADAC.

(*) I guess that is also the reason why their products support the Ravenna (AES67) networking protocol.

 

That is even more advantageous as neither a Tambaqui nor a Makua can be used as such, at least to my understanding.

 

Thanks and cheers,

Marcel

 

 

[Marcel073]

Oh, one more thing (Apple ...?)

 

As stated before I'm also into multi channel audio / HT / Surround.

 

And the Merging+NADAC as well as Player are available in 2 and in 8 channel versions.

 

 

 

 

[Hyperion]

1 minute ago, Marcel073 said:

Oh, one more thing (Apple ...?)

 

As stated before I'm also into multi channel audio / HT / Surround.

 

And the Merging+NADAC as well as Player are available in 2 and in 8 channel versions.

 

 

If you're looking for a multichannel processor, you can exclude all other options discussed - yes :). I've heard good things about the Merging units, but never experienced them first hand myself.

 

/ Marcus, www.perfect-sense.se

 

 

[barrows]

7 minutes ago, Marcel073 said:

Hi all,

 

Has anyone heard the Merging+NADAC (Network Attached DAC) with "normal" speakers?

 

A few weeks ago I visited the XFi event in Veldhoven, the Netherlands.

 

I heard it being used when teamed up with Daudio dipole speakers, a Dutch speaker brand.

 

Though it sounded fantastic, especially with live recordings of classical concerts, this type of speaker cannot be fitted easily into my 22m2 room.

 

Since most of the items in this particular thread are about Chord Dave and Mola-Mola Tambaqui DAC (or Makua pre-amp).

I'm curious if anyone has (or knows of) an A/B comparison of the M-M or Dave and the NADAC.

 

Merging (A Swiss company apparently well-known in the studio world (*)) also has a Roon-ready player known as Merging+Player that supposedly has the same hardware as the standalone NADAC.

(*) I guess that is also the reason why their products support the Ravenna (AES67) networking protocol.

 

That is even more advantageous as neither a Tambaqui nor a Makua can be used as such, at least to my understanding.

 

Thanks and cheers,

Marcel

 

 

The Tambaqui DAC has Ethernet input, and my understanding is that Mola Mola is working with ROON to get it "ROON certified" as a ROON RAAT endpoint.

[Marcel073]

Thanks barrows.

Good to know, I'll check with the NL distributor.

 

Though you would still need a computer that runs Roon Core.

The Merging+Player does that internally.

So you only need a phone or tablet and are good to go, I think.

 

See https://nadac.merging.com/product/merging-player for more info.

 

 

[jtwrace]

On 10/5/2018 at 2:16 PM, barrows said:

The Tambaqui DAC has Ethernet input, and my understanding is that Mola Mola is working with ROON to get it "ROON certified" as a ROON RAAT endpoint.

This is 100% true.  Hopefully by years end!  ?

[Marcel073]

Thanks for confirming.

 

I'm new to the streaming business ... so let me double check with you guys to see if I understand correctly.

 

The chain likely to be put in place is as I described before in this thread: M-M Tambaqui DAC into M-M Kaluga mono blocks into Vivid Kaya 45 speakers.

The pre-amp we skip for the moment as that will likely be some HT unit.

 

So, now we focus on the source that has to feed the Tambaqui.

I remember from very long time ago classes that there is something known as system theory which states "garbage in, garbage out". So, the source better be good (clean?) for otherwise the expensive gear further in the chain cannot get back what was not fed into it. Correct?

 

Having browsed the web the last days I read that tons of people are happy with streaming from a pimped Raspberry Pi 3 whereas others swear by dedicated streamers from a multitude of brands.

 

Given that I will be having a superb DAC I clearly need a streamer that does not have a DAC inside it and if it has it should be possible to bypass it. The most common reason I found for the dedicated equipment is mainly due to "secondary" but apparently extremely important parts such as the power supply, etc. So as to prevent "computer related noise" to enter the digital data stream that contains our music and should arrive clean into the DAC.

 

Most of the brands have systems that have a DAC and/or internal harddisk inside.

The following brands I found have systems excluding a DAC and are "reasonably priced":

 

- Aries G2 (from Chinese brand Auralic), sold in NL for roughly EURO 4.000

- The Bridge (from UK brand dCS), sold in NL for roughly EURO 4.000

- Moon MiND 2 (from Canada brand Simaudio), sold in NL for roughly EURO 2.000

 

I assume that I would store owned files on a NAS, so a built-in harddrive is not necessary. Even if it does not make noise due to fanless cooling.

 

Questions:

1) Is it really necessary to spend 2 to 4k for a dedicated system or can we stay well below 1k with using a pimped Raspberry Pi or Apple Mac Mini etc.?

2) If it should be dedicated, anyone have experience with the three systems mentioned or alternatives?

3) Or is all this not necessary because Mola-Mola will come up with something around the year end?

 

The latter question obviously in relation to your comments that M-M are working on something. Does that make a physical streaming device in my rack obsolete? (which I cannot believe as then my question is: what is the source?, straight from the NAS into the Tambaqui DAC?)

 

As always, your comments, thoughts, critics, are highly welcomed!!

 

Thanks and cheers,

Marcel

 

[yyz]

I use the Sonare microRendu to stream from my work (noisy internals) computer to my USB DAC via Ethernet-to-USB microRendu. This is a very high end device and I would thing it would be hard to tell if the streamers you have listed are better than the noisy computer to microRendu I have suggested.  Saying all of this I am interested in the Mola Mola DAC's direct Ethernet stream option from a network connected (noisy) computer. The benefit to this is that you remove the microRendu from the equation. Not sure how that will compare to the microRendu setup.

 

If the Mola Mola DAC supports ROON RATT (I think) and becomes a ROON end point you can use a Roon client device, computer, tablet, phone, to play the music files saved on the network (or Tidal stream) directly to the DAC.

 

Edit. I found this old conversation I had with the USA distributor of Mola Mola:

 

"Thanks for your interest in the Tambaqui.  The price is $11,900 and yes it allows streaming from Roon directly to the DAC."
 

[barrows]

1 hour ago, Marcel073 said:

Thanks for confirming.

 

I'm new to the streaming business ... so let me double check with you guys to see if I understand correctly.

 

The chain likely to be put in place is as I described before in this thread: M-M Tambaqui DAC into M-M Kaluga mono blocks into Vivid Kaya 45 speakers.

The pre-amp we skip for the moment as that will likely be some HT unit.

 

So, now we focus on the source that has to feed the Tambaqui.

I remember from very long time ago classes that there is something known as system theory which states "garbage in, garbage out". So, the source better be good (clean?) for otherwise the expensive gear further in the chain cannot get back what was not fed into it. Correct?

 

Having browsed the web the last days I read that tons of people are happy with streaming from a pimped Raspberry Pi 3 whereas others swear by dedicated streamers from a multitude of brands.

 

Given that I will be having a superb DAC I clearly need a streamer that does not have a DAC inside it and if it has it should be possible to bypass it. The most common reason I found for the dedicated equipment is mainly due to "secondary" but apparently extremely important parts such as the power supply, etc. So as to prevent "computer related noise" to enter the digital data stream that contains our music and should arrive clean into the DAC.

 

Most of the brands have systems that have a DAC and/or internal harddisk inside.

The following brands I found have systems excluding a DAC and are "reasonably priced":

 

- Aries G2 (from Chinese brand Auralic), sold in NL for roughly EURO 4.000

- The Bridge (from UK brand dCS), sold in NL for roughly EURO 4.000

- Moon MiND 2 (from Canada brand Simaudio), sold in NL for roughly EURO 2.000

 

I assume that I would store owned files on a NAS, so a built-in harddrive is not necessary. Even if it does not make noise due to fanless cooling.

 

Questions:

1) Is it really necessary to spend 2 to 4k for a dedicated system or can we stay well below 1k with using a pimped Raspberry Pi or Apple Mac Mini etc.?

2) If it should be dedicated, anyone have experience with the three systems mentioned or alternatives?

3) Or is all this not necessary because Mola-Mola will come up with something around the year end?

 

The latter question obviously in relation to your comments that M-M are working on something. Does that make a physical streaming device in my rack obsolete? (which I cannot believe as then my question is: what is the source?, straight from the NAS into the Tambaqui DAC?)

 

As always, your comments, thoughts, critics, are highly welcomed!!

 

Thanks and cheers,

Marcel

 

Marcel, the Tambaqui has an Ethernet input, so you do not "need" a separate Ethernet Renderer (I prefer to use the word Renderer, as "streaming" can mean many things).  Although, depending on the efficacy of the built in Ethernet renderer, you may find better performance using an external Renderer.  You have mentioned some brands above, but left out the Sonore products (disclaimer, I work with Sonore).  Sonore makes some of the absolute best performing Renderers, with no DAC inside and no hard disc inside, just a straight renderer (like the microRendu mentioned above).  Sonore offers three levels of price performances nd the products are not from an Asian based company (US company).

In any case, ethernet works very well to isolate noise from the storage device (whether it be NAS or computer, or both) as ethernet uses no ground connection, and transformer coupling at each end.  So you do not really have to worry about noise coming over Ethernet (or to be exact, you do not have to worry as much as you do for USB connections, Ethernet can still allow some noise to pass, but most of it cannot).

There are ways to to further maximize the isolation with Ethernet, but we are now talking about very small gains here (but perhaps worthwhile).