Trouble with distortion from Dragonfly

[boulderdashcci]

New here, hoping for some advice. I'm having a problem that I think may be rooted with my PC but I'm not 100%. It's driving me nuts and any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

I feel like playback out of my PC is clipping with certain higher frequencies, where for a while I thought the tweeters or x-overs in my speakers might have been on their way out but I don't seem to have the same problem with analog playback.

 

It seems to happen with all file types, regardless of whether they're MP3, FLAC, and sample rate doesn't seem to make a difference, either. It also seems to be there through both the onboard output as well as with an AQ Dragonfly Black, and regardless of the USB port it's plugged into. I hear it more in the left channel, but it happens in both (though swapping L/R on the RCAs does make it more prominent on the right side). My primary player is Winamp, but I also tried Foobar and it's still happening which is making me think it's either how Windows is handling output buffering rather than hardware, or it's some sort of electrical interference within the PC. Would some sort of filter (like a Jitterbug or Wyrd) be worth trying? My whole library has been run through Replaygain so I don't think it's a matter of the files themselves clipping, and again it doesn't seem to be happening with vinyl playback.

 

Things I haven't tried: different minijack to RCA cable (generic monoprice), seeking out some weird room resonance

 

Again, any help would be appreciated.

 

System is an older custom built PC, MSI board, AMD Phenom X4 CPU, 8gb ram, AQ Dragonfly 1.5

Classe CAP-151 integrated

Wharfedale Evo2-10 speakers

REL T5 run off the speakon cable if that matters

[esldude]

First as this appears your first post, welcome to Computer Audiophile forums.

 

Okay sounds like maybe it favors one side, the left.  When you swapped left for right with the RCA's where did you make the swap?  Was it at the input of the Classe?

 

If you simply lower volume does the distortion go away or is it still there at reduced volume?

 

Finally (for now) do you have some headphones to try, and do you hear it in those?

[boulderdashcci]

Yeah, RCAs at the Classe. I don't have any decent headphones to try unfortunately, but I can try with some cheapo earbuds to see if it's there.

 

Lowering volume on the PC end of things didn't do much, neither in Windows nor Winamp. AQ's recommendation when used in a setup like mine is to run full in Windows and Winamp and control volume through the integrated anyway. The distortion is more noticeable at higher volumes but it seems like it's always there. It's subtle, and only at certain frequencies, but it sounds like something is clipped (or something in the speaker blown, but where it goes away on other sources I don't think this is the case). I need to spend some more time listening to my 3rd source (CD player) which should give the best chance of ruling it out of that side of things. 

 

I'm going to order a new RCA just in case it happens to be that, probably from Ghent as I want something prettier anyway. But like I said I have a feeling it's something Windows is doing. 

 

Thanks for helping

[esldude]

That sounds more like the music is either distorted in the files being played or being distorted as it leaves the PC. 

 

Now I can't remember when it changed, but some of the earlier versions of the Dragonfly had a problem in that they distorted when they were set at full volume.  Give me a minute to look up which versions that applied to.

[boulderdashcci]

It seems too common and consistent to be files (my library is ~10k songs, from MP3s to FLAC to WAV, different sample rates etc). Some things do it worse than others, but it would seem odd to me that all of the music I listen to happens to have a hot left channel lol. 

 

Just tried knocking the Dragonfly down to 50%, and tried another RCA cable, no difference. Easily repeatable and definitely following the left channel. 

[esldude]

Mainly the first version had an issue playing at max volume so your version is probably okay in this regard.

 

When using Foobar for playback, are you using WASAPI?  Preferably WASAPI (push). 

 

This means the AQ gets bit perfect digital streams that Windows has not altered in any way.  Essentially reducing the number of places that something could be going wrong.

 

If that doesn't solve the issue, I would next try swapping the speaker leads at the back of the Classe.  See if the hotter channel stays put in the left or follows the speaker.

[boulderdashcci]

I only briefly used Foobar, and haven't messed with WASAPI - I don't fully understand it. I've used Winamp forever so I've stuck with that, other than a quick test. I can mess with it more tomorrow.  

 

Swapping speaker leads is the same as RCAs, it mostly moves into the right, so it's definitely happening within the PC. I also just downloaded a FLAC copy of an album, and it's very pronounced here. Ran Replaygain with no benefit. 

 

On the one hand I'm sort of relieved that my speakers are fine, I was sort of worried I'd be having to replace them a lot sooner than I was hoping (although it would have given me an excuse to pull the trigger on a set of Mani 2s, which I've wanted forever). On the other, this is frustrating as all hell. 

[esldude]

That does sound as if it is coming from the output of the PC.  A bit odd it would do this in the on-board sound and the AQ Dragonfly.  Which sounds like a software problem. 

 

The reason to use WASAPI or Kernal Streaming is you get the bits in the file not altered by anything going on in Windows.  You won't be able to do any Replaygain or anything except play the file directly. 

 

I haven't used Winamp in many years.  If there is a plugin for WASAPI or Kernal Streaming get one of those and use it in Winamp.   That should fix the issue.  If it does then something between Winamp and the digital output to the AQ Dragonfly is set unequally in the channels. 

 

Sorry I couldn't be of more help. 

[boulderdashcci]

Just tried WASAPI. Same results.

Also tried plugging the dragonfly into a cambridge soundworks table radio and the distortion is pretty clearly there as well. I tried switching back to onboard just to make sure I'm not hearing things and while it might be more pronounced with the DF, it's still there. This is driving me nuts.

 

Appreciate the attempt at helping. 

[esldude]

Could you attach to a post a zipped file of one of your smaller MP3s?  Just wondering if something has corrupted your files.  A really long shot possibility, but maybe worth eliminating. 

 

So far it comes from two digital sources, doesn't from your switching inputs and outputs seem to be in the playback system.  Is present in a Cambridge radio, and isn't fixed by a bit perfect transfer via WASAPI.  So quite the puzzle. 

 

Now I don't know, do you have a phone or music player you could drop one of your files in and listen to it?

 

I just plan to look at your MP3 in Audacity and see if it looks like something has caused distortion.  Or if you are familiar with Audacity yourself you could post screenshots of what it shows.

[boulderdashcci]

I've PM'd you with a zip of a flac file. It's pretty prominent in the higher registers of the kick drum if that makes sense. There's a little drum solo in the middle of the song where I can hear it fairly well. I'll try throwing it on my phone and seeing if I hear it there (if I can find my host cable I'll try phone > Dragonfly as well). 

 

I did just try a stereo channel swap with one of the Winamp DSPs, and it cleaned the left up considerably, and doesn't seem to be as prominent in the right as swapping the RCAs, but that could just be the song I'm on maybe?

 

Is there any chance that this is electrical, or does it definitely seem like a processing/hardware issue?

[esldude]

I downloaded the file and have sent a reply.  It does appear at some point this file was clipped.  That is causing the distortion. 

 

Maybe someone else has a better idea.  You could reduce the level by 2 db in the file, and then apply a gentle downward sloping EQ.  It will filter out some of the nasty distortion.  It isn't really repairing the file.  It would just keep it from being so grating to listen to.

[boulderdashcci]

Thanks for taking the time to look. That looks a lot rougher than I would have thought.

 

I did realize something stupid on my part where even though I had replaygain run for the whole library, I didn't know I needed to enable Winamp to read from it, so that's helped to a degree. It seems a lot more tolerable now.

 

Thanks again for trying to help me figure this out. 

[esldude]

21 minutes ago, boulderdashcci said:

Thanks for taking the time to look. That looks a lot rougher than I would have thought.

 

I did realize something stupid on my part where even though I had replaygain run for the whole library, I didn't know I needed to enable Winamp to read from it, so that's helped to a degree. It seems a lot more tolerable now.

 

Thanks again for trying to help me figure this out. 

You are welcome.  Glad to be of help.  I have gotten lots of help here at CA over the last few years. 

[STC]

On 7/14/2017 at 10:57 AM, boulderdashcci said:

My whole library has been run through Replaygain so I don't think it's a matter of the files themselves clipping

 

Disable Replaygain. Replaygain can cause clipping.