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ISO REGEN Listening Impressions (kicked off with some measurements)

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I'm trying to clean up my USB signal. Current chain Alienware R7 (don't laugh) -> Paul Pang V2 USB card with ifi ipower -> Pro iDSD -> McIntosh MHA100 -> Susvara. It seems like adding an iso regen with a LPS is the best next step. I don't want to go too crazy. I was also thinking about microrendu, ultrarendu, SoTM SM200, or get a better USB card like JCAT Femto. I don't want add multiple parts. 

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17 minutes ago, gordec said:

I'm trying to clean up my USB signal. Current chain Alienware R7 (don't laugh) -> Paul Pang V2 USB card with ifi ipower -> Pro iDSD -> McIntosh MHA100 -> Susvara. It seems like adding an iso regen with a LPS is the best next step. I don't want to go too crazy. I was also thinking about microrendu, ultrarendu, SoTM SM200, or get a better USB card like JCAT Femto. I don't want add multiple parts. 

 

  • 1 Signature  SE from Sonore. Yes crazy price 
  • 2 UltraRendu 
  • 3 MicroRendu version 1.4
  • 3 MicroRendu 1.3 with ISO Regen
  • 4 MicroRendu 1.3

All Rendu with LPS-1.2 of cause. 

 

Not 100% sure about 3 vs 4. But according to @Superdad you almost get an UltraRendu with the no 3. Well I think you end up same price as well 😀

 

SoTM is good as well according to reviews.

 

I assume you’re not using Roon. 

The Rendus give you good options of interfaces. 

 

Also using an endpoint will lift you SQ guaranteed. 

Must likely more than only the IR. 

 

And don’t forget to add the USPCB. 

 

 

 

 

 

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45 minutes ago, gordec said:

I'm trying to clean up my USB signal. Current chain Alienware R7

I'm also using a non audio optimized pc in an enviroment with lots of other electronics and the iso regen with lps 1.2 was of a huge benefit to my system, with the addition of the topaz ultra isolator line noise suppressor.  Completely isolating the system this way worked perfectly.  After the iso regen my dac has an amanero usb to i2s board with another isolator on the i2s side, so the board is powered by the lps1.2 as well.

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5 minutes ago, Bdht said:

I'm also using a non audio optimized pc in an enviroment with lots of other electronics and the iso regen with lps 1.2 was of a huge benefit to my system, with the addition of the topaz ultra isolator line noise suppressor.  Completely isolating the system this way worked perfectly.  After the iso regen my dac has an amanero usb to i2s board with another isolator on the i2s side, so the board is powered by the lps1.2 as well.

 

That sounds like a plan. Get an iso regen + LPS. I may be done. The current set up sounds pretty good as is. How do you set up the Topax isolater? Right now I still have like 6 thing all plugged into a surge protector.😅

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2 minutes ago, gordec said:

How do you set up the Topax isolater?

If you get one thats pre wired you just plug everything in nice n n simple.  If you get one with terminals you need to add an input(with fuse if its a smaller unit) and outlet(s).  Wiring 120v in and 120v out is simple though.  You can get affordable used and new smaller units from radwell if you cant find a good one on ebay.  I got a 91092-32 off ebay for my main system for $50 shipped and a 91092-12 off radwell new for $130 shipped for my work system.

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16 minutes ago, gordec said:

The current set up sounds pretty good as is

Phew i can imagine it does with that equipment. xD

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48 minutes ago, Bdht said:

I got a 91092-32 off ebay

Sorry thats 91092-31, one of the units with terminals.

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2 hours ago, gordec said:

I'm trying to clean up my USB signal. Current chain Alienware R7 (don't laugh) -> Paul Pang V2 USB card with ifi ipower -> Pro iDSD -> McIntosh MHA100 -> Susvara. It seems like adding an iso regen with a LPS is the best next step. I don't want to go too crazy. I was also thinking about microrendu, ultrarendu, SoTM SM200, or get a better USB card like JCAT Femto. I don't want add multiple parts. 

I had the PPV2 also but now use this setup and highly recommend it (links are USPCBs):

PC->ISO Regen<one LPS 1.2>uRendu!

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1 minute ago, bit01 said:

I had the PPV2 also but now use this setup and highly recommend it:

PC->ISO Regen<LPS 1.2>uRendu!

 

Is the PPV2 unnecessary once you get IR and uRendu? You can run it out of any USB port and get the same result?

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8 minutes ago, gordec said:

 

Is the PPV2 unnecessary once you get IR and uRendu? You can run it out of any USB port and get the same result?

I am not using it anymore - I found using the PC motherboard USB port into the above setup to be better (esp the low end) by a margin! This was further improved (esp. the sound stage resolution) by using the DC Power cable  SUPRA  CAT8 on the uR  and Ugreen flat CAT7 on the IR! USB Links are USPCBs.

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In case I confused some - between the IR and the uR I have an Anker USB/Ethernet adapter. Needless to say, SQ results may be hardware and environment specific - so best to try it out yourself.

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5 minutes ago, bit01 said:

In case I confused some - between the IR and the uR I have an Anker USB/Ethernet adapter. Needless to say, SQ results may be hardware and environment specific - so best to try it out yourself.

 

How do you go PC -> IR -> UR? PC USB to IR. IR only has USB out right, and UR can only accept ethernet?  So you need to go network -> UR -> IR? Sorry this is all new to me.

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2 hours ago, gordec said:

 

How do you go PC -> IR -> UR? PC USB to IR. IR only has USB out right, and UR can only accept ethernet?  So you need to go network -> UR -> IR? Sorry this is all new to me.

 

Correct. If you are using a PC's USB out then UltrRendu does not play a part in this scheme because as you say, it only accepts ethernet traffic via RJ45 connection and serialises the signal into its UCB out. An ISO Regen could go after the UltraRendu but not before.

 

I hope this clarifies.

 

Regards

GG

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9 hours ago, gordec said:

 

How do you go PC -> IR -> UR? PC USB to IR. IR only has USB out right, and UR can only accept ethernet?  So you need to go network -> UR -> IR? Sorry this is all new to me.

uR->IR did not do anything for me. What works for me is to use the IR to clean the PC USB then convert it to ethernet using the Anker (or Apple) USB to Ethernet converter unit. I use the PC in bridged mode (main LAN to secondary ethernet for the uR) . I find it better than the direct ethernet switch to uR connection.

 

LAN switch->PC->IR->Anker (USB to Ethernet)->uR->DAC

 

You may want to have a read through  the thread (esp first few pages):

 

Hope that clarifies it somewhat.

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1 hour ago, johndoe21ro said:

Is there a PS Audio Directstream and ISORegen user around here?

 

There are a whole lot of PSA DS owners using the ISO REGEN--including Bascom King last I checked.  But I don't know if any of them are hanging about here right now.  Maybe you'll get lucky and one of them will see this and pipe up. 9_9

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16 hours ago, johndoe21ro said:

Is there a PS Audio Directstream and ISORegen user around here? :D

If you head over to the PSA Forum you will read Paul's and others experience with the DS.  As a DS owner, it's not needed.  

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31 minutes ago, jtwrace said:

If you head over to the PSA Forum you will read Paul's and others experience with the DS.  As a DS owner, it's not needed.  

 

I think you are a bit of an outlier Jason. x-D

Yes, definitely check out the PSA forum.  However, for some reason virtually all the REGEN-related posts there are with regards to the original USB REGEN—which Paul McGowan himself endorsed in his blog in 2016. Seems that only a couple of active PSA forum members have upgraded to the ISO REGEN, yet in fact there are a great many DS users enjoying the combo.

 

Our products are sold with a 30-day, money-back guarantee (with no restock fee), so there is no risk in trying it. :)

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4 minutes ago, Superdad said:

 

I think you are a bit of an outlier Jason. x-D

Yes, definitely check out the PSA forum.  However, for some reason virtually all the REGEN-related posts there are with regards to the original USB REGEN—which Paul McGowan himself endorsed in his blog in 2016. Seems that only a couple of active PSA forum members have upgraded to the ISO REGEN, yet in fact there are a great many DS users enjoying the combo.

 

Our products are sold with a 30-day, money-back guarantee (with no restock fee), so there is no risk in trying it. :)

Paul & Ted must have done some objective testing then as his recent comments are against them.

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14 minutes ago, jtwrace said:

Paul & Ted must have done some objective testing then as his recent comments are against them.

 

No, I think they must have based their comments on theory and not actual testing since, AFAIK neither of them has ever tried the ISO REGEN.

I can’t seem to find any recent comments from either of them with regards the REGEN.  How about you sent me some links in a PM?

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So gents, first off, I apologise if this issue has been discussed. This thread is now 38 pages and I have trouble sifting through to get the answers.

 

Basically, I received my ISO Regen a couple months back. Plugged it in, not realising the GI was in the disable position. Been using it lightly since I was just also assigned on a major project at work. At that time, I noted that the USB connection will disconnect after an  hour or so of playing music and sometime, not connecting at all.

 

I had not time to investigate until last week. First I took the LPS1.2 out of the equation and power direct via JS2. Same thing, disconnected after an hour. Then I realised the GI was switched off. Switching it on, I notice clicks and pops during passage of the music.

 

I could be wrong, but I doubt it is a grounding issue. My equipment as below :

 

Preamp : Accupahse C2850

DAC DC37

Server : DIY server powered by JS2

All power cords are Ansuz US plugs connected to Accuphase power regenerator

Power amp : Accuphase A45

Power regenerator and power amp connected to Ansuz powerboard.

 

Any help will be much appreciated as I am on the verge of giving up soon.

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8 hours ago, coeuslee said:

So gents, first off, I apologise if this issue has been discussed. This thread is now 38 pages and I have trouble sifting through to get the answers.

 

Basically, I received my ISO Regen a couple months back. Plugged it in, not realising the GI was in the disable position. Been using it lightly since I was just also assigned on a major project at work. At that time, I noted that the USB connection will disconnect after an  hour or so of playing music and sometime, not connecting at all.

 

I had not time to investigate until last week. First I took the LPS1.2 out of the equation and power direct via JS2. Same thing, disconnected after an hour. Then I realised the GI was switched off. Switching it on, I notice clicks and pops during passage of the music.

 

I could be wrong, but I doubt it is a grounding issue. My equipment as below :

 

Preamp : Accupahse C2850

DAC DC37

Server : DIY server powered by JS2

All power cords are Ansuz US plugs connected to Accuphase power regenerator

Power amp : Accuphase A45

Power regenerator and power amp connected to Ansuz powerboard.

 

Any help will be much appreciated as I am on the verge of giving up soon.

 

Hi:

A couple of thoughts and questions for you, but we can assist you better if you contact us directly.  

 

You mention that your ISO REGEN had the switch set with galvanic isolation defeated (the up, "ON" position).  The way you said it implied that it came to you that way.  But since we NEVER ship them with the switch up--it is always down with GI enabled--I made me wonder if your ISO REGEN is a second-hand unit, which means it is possible that it is very early one.  Would be good to know that.

 

What USB cable are you using between your music server and the ISO REGEN?  The Silanna galvanic isolator chip at the input of the ISO REGEN is not very tolerant of out-of-spec USB cables on its input side (the ISO REGEN output can drive any cable), and a fair number of "audiophile" USB cables fall into that category.  You can test that by trying the 6-inch generic cable we ship with the ISO REGEN or some other generic USB printer cable--from the computer to the ISO REGEN.

 

The JS-2 "floats" its DC outputs (no connection to mains ground except for chassis and transformer for safety), so with it powering your DIY server your source does not have much in the way of true ground connection (except perhaps though other devices you have hooked to the server).  In some cases the ISO REGEN really prefers to have the USB input side well grounded (again the not-effect Silanna isolator chip), so you might want to read this post:

https://www.computeraudiophile.com/forums/topic/31877-iso-regen-listening-impressions-kicked-off-with-some-measurements/?page=24&amp;tab=comments#comment-714912

 

Based on what you reported, I would certainly start with changing the USB cable between your server and the ISO REGEN.

 

Have a great weekend,

--Alex C.

 

P.S.  My apologies.  I just noticed that one of the e-mails awaiting my reply was from you from yesterday.  We can pick up the troubleshooting off-line there. :) 

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Another thing to try would be to connect whatever is directly downstream to your ISO REGEN (the DC37?) directly to a grounded outlet. Going through a power conditioner could adversely affect the grounding.

 

It may sound strange, but that's exactly what happened in my case. My ISO REGEN was feeding my Chord DAVE which happened to be connected to ground through a Supra mains block using one of the filtered sockets. When I switched to an unfiltered socket on the same mains block the problem disappeared. Somehow the more direct connection to ground solved the issue.

 

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First of all, I must admit a couple of elementary mistakes here.... embarassing facts actually....

 

As Alex pointed out, the unit did come with the GI switched at down on at "I" position. I had assumed the "on" position means GI is on.

 

Secondly, while fiddling yesterday, I noticed that the "red light" at the back was not lighted when I lose connection, which suggested to me there is some power issue. I suspect that the Oyaide plugs does not connect well on the Regen power input due to the weight of the plug (by the way, should it be a 2.1mm or 2.5mm input plug?). I have since added extra Silicon rings to support the connection. So far no drop outs this morning (fingers crossed).

 

I will report back after the next few days to confirm this finding.

 

Also to clarify, the ticks happened when the GI switched off. With the GI on, music flows beautiful. I understand that my DAC has GI on the USB input side, but even this, I found some improvement with the Regen. Volume seemed abit attenuated but I am also hearing better separation and imaging. 

 

Once again, apologies for raising the alarm bell and for the embarrassing nature of the user error. Really appreciate this community support.

 

PS : I use Acoustic Revive USB cable.

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10 minutes ago, coeuslee said:

First of all, I must admit a couple of elementary mistakes here.... embarassing facts actually....

 

As Alex pointed out, the unit did come with the GI switched at down on at "I" position. I had assumed the "on" position means GI is on.

 

Secondly, while fiddling yesterday, I noticed that the "red light" at the back was not lighted when I lose connection, which suggested to me there is some power issue. I suspect that the Oyaide plugs does not connect well on the Regen power input due to the weight of the plug (by the way, should it be a 2.1mm or 2.5mm input plug?). I have since added extra Silicon rings to support the connection. So far no drop outs this morning (fingers crossed).

 

Wow, thanks for your report about it.  Very interesting.  The DC jack of the ISO REGEN (and the UltraCap LPS-1.2) is 5.5mm x 2.1mm.

 

10 minutes ago, coeuslee said:

Also to clarify, the ticks happened when the GI switched off.

 

Well that's slightly odd, yet it clearly indicates that the GI is helpful and that the ticks are not due to the ISO REGEN or some grounding issue.

 

10 minutes ago, coeuslee said:

With the GI on, music flows beautiful. I understand that my DAC has GI on the USB input side, but even this, I found some improvement with the Regen. Volume seemed abit attenuated but I am also hearing better separation and imaging.

 

Nice to hear--and not surprising.  :D Enjoy!

 

10 minutes ago, coeuslee said:

Once again, apologies for raising the alarm bell and for the embarrassing nature of the user error. Really appreciate this community support.

 

Of course!!

 

10 minutes ago, coeuslee said:

PS : I use Acoustic Revive USB cable.

 

I have heard very nice things about that cable.

Best,

--Alex C.

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