LPSU For a stock HP 'all in one computer'

[Confused]

I currently using a reasonably new Windows 10 Intel i5 HP 'all in one' type computer, which is basically lap top spec components shoved behind a rather nice 24" screen.  OK, not the best machine for computer audio by a very long way, but for a variety of reasons it is what I will need to use for a while.  The PC is used to run Roon core, streaming via hard wired Ethernet to a microRendu / Mutec MC3+USB. 

 

The PC has an external power supply 'brick' that delivers DV voltage to the PC.  So it would be very easy to replace the supplied power supply with a decent quality LPSU.

 

My question is would adding an LPSU afford any benefits, or would it basically be a waste of time with such a machine?

 

 

[Confused]

OK, it was boring question I know, but it does look like Rupert Sheldrake is attracting more interest than LPSU's on CA today......

[Elberoth]

If you are streaming over the ethernet, that is a waste of money IMO. I just don't see how it can improve system performance. 

 

I would rather get the UpTone Audio LPS-1 supercapacitor PSU (plus iFi iPower to power it) if you don't already have one, as mR is very sensitive to PSU quality and can reward you with big gains. 

 

Then, I would look into things like the upcoming UpTone Audio ISO Regen.

[Confused]

I am happy to advise that the mR is indeed powered by an LPS-1.  This is powered by the supplied Meanwall wall wart, although I still have the iFi power supply that came with the mR, it is unused currently.

[ElviaCaprice]

Yes and no, to the original ops question.  Until a motherboard is designed without switching voltage regulators and hidden clocks, regardless of power supply your going to end up with noisy electrical functioning.  Does it help to feed clean power, yes.  How much one is willing to spend for that improvement is a personal decision. 

[Elberoth]

1 hour ago, Confused said:

I am happy to advise that the mR is indeed powered by an LPS-1.  This is powered by the supplied Meanwall wall wart, although I still have the iFi power supply that came with the mR, it is unused currently.

 

You may want to try the iFi iPower. According to my measurements, the Meanwell SMPS generates as much as 5x more AC noise than the iFi iPower:

 

 

I have posted more details in this THIS thread.

 

I was able to further improve the performance of mR by adding Intona USB isolator past the mR and Wyred 4 Sound Recovery USB reclocking device. But since the ISO Regen is almost out, which has both USB isolation and regeneration in a single box, I would wait and try this one first.

[Elberoth]

1 hour ago, ElviaCaprice said:

Yes and no, to the original ops question.  Until a motherboard is designed without switching voltage regulators and hidden clocks, regardless of power supply your going to end up with noisy electrical functioning.  Does it help to feed clean power, yes.  How much one is willing to spend for that improvement is a personal decision. 

 

Well, If he was using his server in a similar way as you are using yours and I'm using mine (connected via USB to the DAC) then I would say yes. I would even suggest some more tweaks he could try. However, since he is streaming music via the Ethernet to the mR, I don't see how noise from server could enter the mR and then the DAC. Ethernet has galvanic isolation by design and if you are paranoid - you can get Ethernet isolator.

[ElviaCaprice]

3 minutes ago, Elberoth said:

 

Well, If he was using his server in a similar way as you are using yours and I'm using mine (connected via USB to the DAC) then I would say yes. I would even suggest some more tweaks he could try. However, since he is streaming music via the Ethernet to the mR, I don't see how noise from server could enter the mR and then the DAC. Ethernet has galvanic isolation by design and if you are paranoid - you can get Ethernet isolator.

Yes, I'm sure that Ethernet galvanic isolation helps mitigate the problem with a noisy server.  Unfortunately, as has been found in this thread, it doesn't alleviate the issue entirely and in fact Ethernet has it's own inherent problems.  I recommend the op read thru that thread for further discoveries.

[Elberoth]

If he was chasing the last 1-2%, they I would partialy agree. He would have to take care of the router as well. Or go with fiber optic. However, I feel there is still much more performance to be discovered by exploring the Isolation between the uR and his Mutec. And when he gets there ... he may discover that additional isolation on the Ethernet side of things does not bring further benefits.

[ElviaCaprice]

5 minutes ago, Elberoth said:

If he was chasing the last 1-2%, they I would partialy agree. He would have to take care of the router as well. Or go with fiber optic. However, I feel there is still much more performance to be discovered by exploring the Isolation between the uR and his Mutec. And when he gets there ... he may discover that additional isolation on the Ethernet side of things does not bring further benefits.

How can you conclude it's only 1-2% if you don't know what or how much better it can be?  I know I don't know the answer of where it ends.  Yes, stop me if you've heard this song before. 

Personally I think Ethernet is a detour that will end up subpar to USB direct or Fiber/USB direct both in SQ and software applications/format abilities.

[Confused]

Thanks for the comments so far.  It is interesting that this thread has very quickly gone off topic, but in a good way, because it has drifted into exactly the area I have been thinking about recently.  I think we can conclude that an LPSU for the PC might offer a very small improvement, maybe not.  Any improvement would be small versus cost, so up to me if I want to potentially waste (invest) cash like that!

 

To provide a bit more information as to where I am with the rest of the 'front end'.  I am essentially happy with the microRendu / Mutec setup.  In terms of functionality it is good, and the sound quality is excellent also.  So I am hunting those last few % of improvement, however many %'s there may be to go! 

 

I have indeed been following the 'direct connection' thread with great interest.  As it happens, for a variety of reasons I need to keep to the 'traditional' route of running the mR from an Ethernet switch, but I am interested in the other ideas for optimising.  Most recently I have tried the AQVOX switch.  This may have offered some tiny improvements, but I was not 100% convinced it was, and indeed in rapid A/B testing with my 'cheapo' TP Link switch, I did on occasion find myself wondering if the AQVOX was having a very, very, slight negative impact. In all cases it was hard to discern what was real improvement or imagined.  Either way, it's going back under the 30 day return policy, I could not say it was worth Euro 400 for me.

 

I am also taking an interest in products like the Iso Regen and SOtM tX-USBultra.  To be honest, I am struggling to work out how these can help between a microRendu and a Mutec.  Consider that the Mutec is reclocking and provides isolation at the USB input, what exactly can these products offer?  To be clear, I am not saying that they will not or cannot work, I am just struggling to rationalise why they might work.  So for now I am waiting for a few more user reports, gathering more information myself, before deciding on this one.  However, if anyone has any clear insight into how these might help between mR and Mutec, I am interested.

 

I also have half an eye towards the new sMS-200ultra and a replacement for the mR, again I am waiting to see how this one develops once more people have them.

 

Another thought I have had is to take USB out of my chain entirely with something like the dCS Network Bridge.  Here I am lucky in that I have a reasonably nearby dealer who can lend me one.  The only problem with this one is I think my very next move will be to try HQPlayer, rather than running Roon RAAT.  If HQPlayer offers some of the last % magic I am looking for then the dCS Network Bridge is struck off the try list, it does not support NAA.

 

Anyway, if anyone has any thoughts and comments here, I am all ears!