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HQPlayer Linux Desktop and HQplayer embedded


ted_b

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30 minutes ago, luisma said:

I do have a question though. I have these settings in the configuration and of course I did apply.

image.thumb.png.5d14209c7efa398b9810aeea8aa9b87d.png

 

It is playing PCM 352 as per the main page

 

The Main page shows

image.thumb.png.cecb47ed94fe66cc36df131c3af75af2.png

 

Thought the configuration after applied had preference over the main page?

 

 

You have Auto Rate Family enabled. And 352800 is highest rate below set upper limit of 384000 that is multiple of 44100. So to me it looks like working correctly.

 

Note, since you have fixed volume setting of 0 dBFS you've also got limiter triggered 6 times in your screenshot...

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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4 minutes ago, Miska said:

 

You have Auto Rate Family enabled. And 352800 is highest rate below set upper limit of 384000 that is multiple of 44100. So to me it looks like working correctly.

 

Note, since you have fixed volume setting of 0 dBFS you've also got limiter triggered 6 times in your screenshot...

 

Thanks, that was a very noobish question :) so indeed is good that automatically changes to PCM based on the input content.

Can you please describe what the limiter triggered 6 times is? which would it be the best settings?

 

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33 minutes ago, Miska said:

 

You have Auto Rate Family enabled. And 352800 is highest rate below set upper limit of 384000 that is multiple of 44100. So to me it looks like working correctly.

 

Note, since you have fixed volume setting of 0 dBFS you've also got limiter triggered 6 times in your screenshot...

 

Still confused, does the configuration tab output mode should have preference and overrides the main tab? 

Just removed the auto rate option but keeps playing pcm not sdm with 48 content and Output mode is SDM

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47 minutes ago, luisma said:

Still confused, does the configuration tab output mode should have preference and overrides the main tab? 

Just removed the auto rate option but keeps playing pcm not sdm with 48 content and Output mode is SDM

 

Those configuration things are default values you can override on the main page. Just like in HQPlayer Desktop too, where in Settings dialog you set default values and the actual ones are the ones selected in the main window.

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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57 minutes ago, luisma said:

Thanks, that was a very noobish question :) so indeed is good that automatically changes to PCM based on the input content.

Can you please describe what the limiter triggered 6 times is? which would it be the best settings?

 

Automatically changing to PCM is another thing (Auto mode), sampling rate families and automatically switching between families is another thing.

 

Limiter reduced output volume 6 times because otherwise output would have clipped. When you have fixed volume setting, it is best to get started with -3 dB and keep eye on the "Limited" count on front page during playback that it doesn't increment from 0. For most content -3 dB is enough, but there is some heavily compressed material that will need more attenuation to avoid inter-sample overs.

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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7 hours ago, luisma said:

Figured out the server part, looking to install an NAA, what would it be recommended? Ubuntu Server + Jussi's kernel + NAA client software? 

You can do that or just use the image provided by Miska.  Next time when I need to rebuild my naa I plan to convert to the image.

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  • 2 weeks later...
12 hours ago, Em2016 said:

Anyone tried to run HQP Embedded on a NUC7i7DNHE

 

Quad core  i7-8650U Processor (8M Cache, up to 4.20 GHz)?

 

I wonder if this might be a great HQP Embedded solution for those happy to stick with the 2s versions of all the poly-sinc filters?

 

As long as it can run 2s version of poly-sinc-xtr

 

In a nice fanless case:

 

https://www.quietpc.com/akasa-plato-x7d

 

 

The CPU base clock is not very fast, for the same purpose I've been using i5-7600T (in fanless Streacom case) which has almost 1 GHz faster base clock. You cannot rely much on Turbo Boost with HQPlayer because load is constant and on all cores.

 

But overall that looks like a nice combination.

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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9 hours ago, arglebargle said:

@Miska I see that Ubuntu 18 is now being offered on my 16.04 installation. Let us know when it's time to update :)

 

What I've tried, things should work on Ubuntu 18.04 (based on my testing on Linux Mint 19 Cinnamon), at least if you don't need CUDA support.

 

I'm currently holding my upgrade until Nvidia supports 18.04 for CUDA too.

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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17 hours ago, Miska said:

 

The CPU base clock is not very fast, for the same purpose I've been using i5-7600T (in fanless Streacom case) which has almost 1 GHz faster base clock. You cannot rely much on Turbo Boost with HQPlayer because load is constant and on all cores.

 

But overall that looks like a nice combination.

 

Now that I got Windows NAA to work to the Chord DAC (see other thread) I could test DSD512 with my  NUC7i7DNHE running HQPe image to the Chord DAC.

 

I couldn't get DSD512 to work with any of the filters. DSD256 had stuttering but that could have been the ASIO driver on Windows. The Chord ASIO driver has always a pain in the ass. It works with Roon if I do nothing else - but if I use other programs in Windows, playback stutters.

 

So for DSD256 I tried my USBridge running NAA via DoP to the Chord - and it works with poly-sinc-xtr-lp-2s.

 

I wonder if it actually can do DSD512 so SOME of the poly-sinc-2s filters - I won't know because the Chord only works at DSD512 with Windows.

 

This was a 20 minute test with DoP256 poly-sinc-xtr-lp-2s. I have no idea how hot the NUC's CPU is getting but I'm sure it's getting a good workout. But I got no stutters during playback.

 

Maybe we're 1 or 2 models away from a NUCi7 that will do DSD512 in a fanless case, at a good total price.

 

This was just something I wanted to try out, out of general interest. Until then, my sonicTransporter i7-7700 running HQPe does a fantastic job.

 

Question @Miska -

 

If I have ipv6 disabled on my router, does ticking the ipv6 box in HQPe have any effect? i.e. can HQPe and NAA still talk to each other via ipv6, even if the router has ipv6 disabled? It reads like a stupid question as I type it but it's too late to go back now ?

 

 

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1 hour ago, Em2016 said:

I couldn't get DSD512 to work with any of the filters. DSD256 had stuttering but that could have been the ASIO driver on Windows. The Chord ASIO driver has always a pain in the ass. It works with Roon if I do nothing else - but if I use other programs in Windows, playback stutters.

 

Does the ASIO driver have adjustable buffer size through it's own control panel? If not, you could try to adjust it from the player. With ASIO it is always better to leave applications at default buffer size and adjust the size from the driver side if it has it's own control panel. While if it doesn't have a control panel, then the buffer size can be possibly adjusted from the application side (log would tell).

 

Maybe we're 1 or 2 models away from a NUCi7 that will do DSD512 in a fanless case, at a good total price.

 

I think stadard mini-ITX or micro-ATX mobo built into fanless case is good option and not much different in terms of price either.

1 hour ago, Em2016 said:


If I have ipv6 disabled on my router, does ticking the ipv6 box in HQPe have any effect? i.e. can HQPe and NAA still talk to each other via ipv6, even if the router has ipv6 disabled?

 

When router is operating as a switch in local network it doesn't care what kind of protocol goes through, IPv4, IPv6 or something else. So IPv6 should work through it just fine even if the router doesn't even know what IPv6 is. HQPlayer or NAA don't need IPv6 internet connectivity, only local network, so there's no need for support from the router side.

 

However, if it has IPv6 support enabled, then both devices should preferably get configured same way so that they land on the same IPv6 subnet. Otherwise the IPv6 functionality between HQPlayer and NAA may not work.

 

In any case, if IPv6 is enabled, HQPlayer and NAA always also support IPv4. So your choice is more like "IPv4 only" vs "IPv4 + IPv6".

 

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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5 minutes ago, Miska said:

Does the ASIO driver have adjustable buffer size through it's own control panel? If not, you could try to adjust it from the player. With ASIO it is always better to leave applications at default buffer size and adjust the size from the driver side if it has it's own control panel. While if it doesn't have a control panel, then the buffer size can be possibly adjusted from the application side (log would tell).

 

Cheers Jussi. Chord don't have a control panel the way i've had with iFi and Pro-Ject. I'll have a look at the log and post.

 

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12 hours ago, Miska said:

Does the ASIO driver have adjustable buffer size through it's own control panel? If not, you could try to adjust it from the player. With ASIO it is always better to leave applications at default buffer size and adjust the size from the driver side if it has it's own control panel. While if it doesn't have a control panel, then the buffer size can be possibly adjusted from the application side (log would tell).

 

I can play poly-sinc-short-mp-2s at DSD512 with a HQPe buffer of 250ms but there's SOME small pops during playback, maybe every 30 seconds, especially as I'm doing other stuff on the Windows PC at the same time. 

 

I wonder if this same NUCi7 would perform ok at DSD512 with most of the 2s filters with a Linux NAA instead. I can test with a  microRendu --> Pro-Ject S2 DAC in a couple weeks and report back.

 

Just to show how crap the ASIO driver is, I switched HQPe output to PCM705/768 output, NS5 and get the classic static... With 0ms buffer and with 250ms buffer.

 

I then switched to USBridge NAA to the Chord and with the same PCM outputs it works perfectly.

 

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5 hours ago, Johnseye said:

Is there a consensus on whether HQPlayer embedded provides better sound quality over HQPlayer desktop?

 

I have not personally compared the two but you can leverage the image provided by Miska to test it out in your own setup.  Just boot from usb flash drive.  My number one requirement was the ability to stream Tidal/Deezer/Qobuz or any other streaming service to UPnP renderer and right now that functionality is only supported under embedded.  If you have Roon and Tidal or your goal is to stream only your music you do not need embedded solution.

 

When you do the compare make sure that you are not dependent on Cuda, since the image provided by Miska does not support that.  You can always roll your own though based on Debian or Ubuntu.

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7 minutes ago, shadowlight said:

 

I have not personally compared the two but you can leverage the image provided by Miska to test it out in your own setup.  Just boot from usb flash drive.  My number one requirement was the ability to stream Tidal/Deezer/Qobuz or any other streaming service to UPnP renderer and right now that functionality is only supported under embedded.  If you have Roon and Tidal or your goal is to stream only your music you do not need embedded solution.

 

When you do the compare make sure that you are not dependent on Cuda, since the image provided by Miska does not support that.

 

Thanks for the info.  If I setup a comparison I'd prefer to keep it apples to apples and run them on the same drive.  In this case it would mean installing embedded HQP to an SSD.  No cuda in my rig.  It will upsample DSD512 fine without it.  I will be running Roon with Tidal to HQP.  Whether I use HQP on the server or install it as an NAA is to be determined.

 

Other than the streaming service direct to renderer functionality, are there any other benefits of the embedded over desktop?

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The OS build for embedded is minimal so there are more resources available for the software.  Couple of other things that will come into play for you that you might want to keep in mind.  If you are currently running Windows based OS and you have already gone through the effort of stripping down / optomizing the OS the difference might not be night and day in resource usage between the two OS.

 

  • Does your DAC support native DSD512 under Linux, if not you will need a Windows based NAA
  • How comfortable are you with Linux?  If you are comfortable you can install both minimal Debian Stretch or Ubuntu Server Xenial 16.04 on the same SSD as your existing Windows.  If you are not that comfortable or concerned about losing your Windows setup if something went wrong during install, install it on a second SSD that is similar.

 

Edit: I am not sure if the input option is only available under embedded or if it is available under desktop version also.  I use the input option to forward input from Chromecast Audio to Mini-DSP USBStream toslink to usb converter so I can stream Deezer HiFi and Spotify.

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7 minutes ago, shadowlight said:

The OS build for embedded is minimal so there are more resources available for the software.  Couple of other things that will come into play for you that you might want to keep in mind.  If you are currently running Windows based OS and you have already gone through the effort of stripping down / optomizing the OS the difference might not be night and day in resource usage between the two OS.

 

  • Does your DAC support native DSD512 under Linux, if not you will need a Windows based NAA
  • How comfortable are you with Linux?  If you are comfortable you can install both minimal Debian Stretch or Ubuntu Server Xenial 16.04 on the same SSD as your existing Windows.  If you are not that comfortable or concerned about losing your Windows setup if something went wrong during install, install it on a second SSD that is similar.

 

Edit: I am not sure if the input option is only available under embedded or if it is available under desktop version also.  I use the input option to forward input from Chromecast Audio to Mini-DSP USBStream toslink to usb converter so I can stream Deezer HiFi and Spotify.

 

My DAC does support DSD512 under Linux.  I've just installed Audiolinux and am comparing the SQ to my previous Windows build.  I am comfortable with Linux, no issue there.

 

Sound quality is my primary concern.  What makes it embedded?  Is it essentially Linux running HQPlayer and nothing else?

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46 minutes ago, Johnseye said:

What makes it embedded?  Is it essentially Linux running HQPlayer and nothing else?

 

Embedded does not have any GUI, so no need for any X-Windows/Window manager related stuff running.  All configuration for HQPe is managed via web interface.  I run my system totally headless and if I need to make configuration change for the OS I just do that via ssh and commandline or edit files.  Hopefully, I am not confusing AudioLinux with something else but that is nice a turn key solution base on ArchLinux which allows you to try both desktop and embedded version under Linux on the same system.  I believe it still runs some kind of Window manager even if you are using it as embedded only solution.

 

With embedded you get the UPnP and input selection (Chromecast) with out losing any of the existing integration with Roon/Tidal provided it meets your sound quality requirement.

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10 minutes ago, shadowlight said:

 

Embedded does not have any GUI, so no need for any X-Windows/Window manager related stuff running.  All configuration for HQPe is managed via web interface.  I run my system totally headless and if I need to make configuration change for the OS I just do that via ssh and commandline or edit files.  Hopefully, I am not confusing AudioLinux with something else but that is nice a turn key solution base on ArchLinux which allows you to try both desktop and embedded version under Linux on the same system.  I believe it still runs some kind of Window manager even if you are using it as embedded only solution.

 

With embedded you get the UPnP and input selection (Chromecast) with out losing any of the existing integration with Roon/Tidal provided it meets your sound quality requirement.

 

Thanks.  You're correct about Audiolinux.

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1 hour ago, shadowlight said:
  • How comfortable are you with Linux?  If you are comfortable you can install both minimal Debian Stretch or Ubuntu Server Xenial 16.04 on the same SSD as your existing Windows.  If you are not that comfortable or concerned about losing your Windows setup if something went wrong during install, install it on a second SSD that is similar.

 

Edit: I am not sure if the input option is only available under embedded or if it is available under desktop version also.  I use the input option to forward input from Chromecast Audio to Mini-DSP USBStream toslink to usb converter so I can stream Deezer HiFi and Spotify.

 

To make such cases easier, I'm also building the full bootable OS image of Embedded. So that getting it up and running would be as easy as possible. OS on that image is optimized for this particular purpose and is very streamlined and minimal. For more flexibility, and possibility for such things as ssh, I recommend building it based on those normal distributions you mentioned. Nowadays, also Fedora is supported for Embedded and it also allows minimal install (smaller than server install).

 

Input and UPnP features are only available on Embedded.

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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