High frequency hearing loss and sample rates

[Audiodinosaur]

I first became aware of CA when looking for info on digitizing my vinyl. I know almost nothing about high end digital audio.

 

At age 60, my hearing over 10k hz is shot. My question is, given my high frequency hearing loss, do I get any benefit from high sample rates? The question applies both to digitized vinyl and to digitally sourced material.

 

Thanks

[R1200CL]

I'm definitely not qualified to answer. But as I'm only miss your age by 3 years, I'm quite sure my hearing is not as 30 years ago, and when I could hear the (Norwegian) grasshoppers [emoji3]

 

However you should trust your ears. Quite many of those hifi journalists around wouldn't pass some hearing test. [emoji3]

Nor would they ever tell you if they been to one...

 

And they are your age or older....

 

Actually I know my hearing is not 100%, as I'm not allow to travel offshore without passing the test. (Yes I passed).

 

But I can tell you I can hear differences in hi-end and more reasonably priced equipment. And I can hear changes in my setup. But sometimes I may not get the same results as others describing for a particular piece of tweak, cable, or whatever I try.

 

And I'm sure you can to. So my advice to you would be to trust your ears.

Visit a dealer and verify your "ears". Play some tracks you like and are familiar with.

 

And remember the same equipment will almost always sound different in your home vs the listen room.

 

Or just test Tidal Hifi vs that horrible Spotify, if you can.

 

Enjoy and good luck.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Computer Audiophile

[NOMBEDES]

Actually I know my hearing is not 100%, as I'm not allow to travel offshore without passing the test. (Yes I passed).

 

Ok, I am understanding (1) the European Union will not allow the hard of hearing to travel. (2) You can not enjoy sailing or deep sea fishing with out a hearing test.

 

this is very disturbing.

[R1200CL]

Actually I know my hearing is not 100%, as I'm not allow to travel offshore without passing the test. (Yes I passed).

 

Ok, I am understanding (1) the European Union will not allow the hard of hearing to travel. (2) You can not enjoy sailing or deep sea fishing with out a hearing test.

 

this is very disturbing.

 

Funny man[emoji3]

 

The [emoji1189] offshore oil industry.

 

The test focus on that you can hear people talk as that is a major safety issue.

 

But of cause they test the whole spectrum, so you been told where you have a dip, or where your upper limit is.

[audiventory]

I first became aware of CA when looking for info on digitizing my vinyl. I know almost nothing about high end digital audio.

 

At age 60, my hearing over 10k hz is shot. My question is, given my high frequency hearing loss, do I get any benefit from high sample rates? The question applies both to digitized vinyl and to digitally sourced material.

 

 

High sample rates (above so-called Nyquist 44 kHz for audio) is not matter of playback ultrasound.

 

But it is matter of proper restoring of audio signal with available modern analog low frequency filters.

These filters is very "lazy". And it may lead to additional audible distortions (in range since 0 Hz and above) via intermodulation of inaudible ultrasound.

 

Using high sample rates don't guarantee nothing as itself. But it give abilities for better implementation ADC and DAC for work in audible range.

[Jud]

Actually I know my hearing is not 100%, as I'm not allow to travel offshore without passing the test. (Yes I passed).

 

Funny man[emoji3]

 

The [emoji1189] offshore oil industry.

 

The test focus on that you can hear people talk as that is a major safety issue.

 

But of cause they test the whole spectrum, so you been told where you have a dip, or where your upper limit is.

 

What?

 

[ducks and runs...]

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

[firedog]

I first became aware of CA when looking for info on digitizing my vinyl. I know almost nothing about high end digital audio.

 

At age 60, my hearing over 10k hz is shot. My question is, given my high frequency hearing loss, do I get any benefit from high sample rates? The question applies both to digitized vinyl and to digitally sourced material.

 

Thanks

 

I don't think hearing high frequencies has much to do with it; it has more to do with how the signal is handled during production and then filtered and turned into analog on playback.

 

My hearing is better than yours, but I also can't hear very high frequencies. Nonetheless, I can hear lots of things in recordings that people with less high frequency loss than me can't hear. How? Because we aren't really talking about "hearing", we are talking about listening. Experienced, trained listeners "hear" things that other listeners "can't hear" - the difference is that a trained listener has developed superior skills that enable him to "hear" things that others don't notice - even when they physically "hear" them.

 

Lots of younger people tell me that they can't tell the difference between mp3 and Redbook. Until I point out the differences - then all of a sudden they start to hear them. They were always there, but they hadn't developed awareness of them. Once the differences are pointed out to them, they start to hear them, even under blind listening conditions.

 

The same thing happens with painitng and photography. An experienced or trained viewer will pick up on all sorts of details and aspects of a painting or a picture that your untrained eye doesn't. It's a matter of training yourself to hear/see all the detail, not a matter of the physical prowess of your senses.

[Jud]

I first became aware of CA when looking for info on digitizing my vinyl. I know almost nothing about high end digital audio.

 

At age 60, my hearing over 10k hz is shot. My question is, given my high frequency hearing loss, do I get any benefit from high sample rates? The question applies both to digitized vinyl and to digitally sourced material.

 

Thanks

 

Nearly all DACs internally process the signal first to 352.8 or 384KHz, then to 2.8MHz or higher, before finally converting to analog music. This isn't because you have a prayer of hearing anything at those frequencies.

 

And the reverse happens at the recording end - MHz to higher KHz to 44.1KHz for CD.

 

This is all done by filters. The closer the frequencies get to twice the audible range, the more difficult the filters' job is.

 

If stuff is left at higher frequencies (high sample rates), it makes it easier for the filters to do a good job, i.e., remove the frequencies they are supposed to remove without causing distortion.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Computer Audiophile

[Ralf11]

I have a notch hearing loss at 4 kHz (lightning strikes). Unfortunately, I have found that partial hear loss does NOT prevent you form hearing the difference between a $10,000 stereo and a $50,000 stereo...

 

you will want to visit some stores and see how much of a difference it makes to you.

[gmgraves]

High sample rates (above so-called Nyquist 44 kHz for audio) is not matter of playback ultrasound.

 

But it is matter of proper restoring of audio signal with available modern analog low frequency filters.

These filters is very "lazy". And it may lead to additional audible distortions (in range since 0 Hz and above) via intermodulation of inaudible ultrasound.

 

Using high sample rates don't guarantee nothing as itself. But it give abilities for better implementation ADC and DAC for work in audible range.

 

+1. You do not have to have the hearing of a 12-year old girl to enjoy the obvious benefits of higher sampling rates and 24-bits (or more). The music just sounds "more musical". I can hear the difference between RedBook and either SACD or Hi-Res LPCM quite easily and I'm sure that I can't hear much above about 13KHz.

[astrotoy]

The new generation of hiqh quality hearing aids are quite good. They can be tailored to many people's hearing loss problems and get you back to hearing above 10K, if not to when you were 20 yo. It has really helped me (and I am quite a bit older than 60). Larry

[NOMBEDES]

I have a notch hearing loss at 4 kHz (lightning strikes). Unfortunately, I have found that partial hear loss does NOT prevent you form hearing the difference between a $10,000 stereo and a $50,000 stereo...

 

 

Agree 100 per cent! A poorly recorded source will sound much worse on the $50K rig. I heard a bad recording on a +$150K Rockport / dCS set up once, it was bad, very bad.

 

On the other hand an exceptional recording demands the best you can afford.

[crenca]

....Lots of younger people tell me that they can't tell the difference between mp3 and Redbook. Until I point out the differences - then all of a sudden they start to hear them. They were always there, but they hadn't developed awareness of them....The same thing happens with painitng and photography.

 

I see dead people...nobody believes me but I have a training program in mind that will get the rest of you guys up to speed...

[adamdea]

I first became aware of CA when looking for info on digitizing my vinyl. I know almost nothing about high end digital audio.

 

At age 60, my hearing over 10k hz is shot. My question is, given my high frequency hearing loss, do I get any benefit from high sample rates? The question applies both to digitized vinyl and to digitally sourced material.

 

Thanks

The short answer is no.

The long answer is that if you really want to persuade yourself you need more, then you will succeed.

[d_elm]

Along with the higher sample rate of D/A is a low pass filter with a relaxed slope at a hgher frequency. Low pass filters cause phase shifting at frequencies we can hear. I suggest you digitize vinyl at 96k or higher if coral works.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Computer Audiophile