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Roon / HQPlayer Integration


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Is it possible to have an OpenCL implementation of this? If so something you would consider?

 

Does Apple even support OpenCL or just their own API? But no, OpenCL is generally not feasible. CUDA is better suited and much more advanced. I also investigated Cilk+ supported by Intel but it is also rather cumbersome and would need ugly hacks.

 

With Apple hardware the problem is pretty much that you don't have choice what hardware components go into your system. So I would recommend Linux or Windows PC for anybody seeking for offloading capabilities. Even with laptops you have choice of various GeForce/Quadro graphics and CPU combinations.

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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...

Also WRT clarification of item 6, is 127.0.0.1 an acceptable IP address or would system need the actual IP address to function properly?

 

That 127.0.0.1 address is a standard local loop back address, and would work fine, as long as Roon and HQ Player are running from the same machine.

 

Just simply curious if system will be idiosyncratic of acceptance of one specific IP address type over the other, or if it would even care.

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After I played around with filters on HQP by itself I was able to get songs playing VERY well in PCM, upsampled to DSD, and Native DSD.

 

I have a view in Roon which shows all albums EXCEPT DSD. With this view I have HQP set to PCM. This way I do not "accidentally" play a DSD file to PCM - which does not work at this time - fix coming in an update.

 

With HQP in SDM(DSD) mode, I use Roon with no special views (as all songs play).

 

I still have the occasional stoppage but overall a great first release.

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After I played around with filters on HQP by itself I was able to get songs playing VERY well in PCM, upsampled to DSD, and Native DSD.

 

I have a view in Roon which shows all albums EXCEPT DSD. With this view I have HQP set to PCM. This way I do not "accidentally" play a DSD file to PCM - which does not work at this time - fix coming in an update.

 

With HQP in SDM(DSD) mode, I use Roon with no special views (as all songs play).

 

I still have the occasional stoppage but overall a great first release.

 

Quite interesting, that.

 

Have you tried any of the NativeDSD.com 128fs or 256fs test files yet?

 

I have problems with multi-channel 256fs test files, occasionally.

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Just simply curious if system will be idiosyncratic of acceptance of one specific IP address type over the other, or if it would even care.

 

One difference is that when using "localhost" (IOW, 127.0.0.1 in IPv4 and ::1 in IPv6) you don't need to allow external connections to HQPlayer (the right-most button in toolbar). Any other address family is considered external.

 

"localhost" will also exist even if the machine doesn't have any physical network interfaces at all, or if those are disabled/not connected. Depending on the OS the local address doesn't go through the full network stack either, so it is simpler.

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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One difference is that when using "localhost" (IOW, 127.0.0.1 in IPv4 and ::1 in IPv6) you don't need to allow external connections to HQPlayer (the right-most button in toolbar). Any other address family is considered external.

 

"localhost" will also exist even if the machine doesn't have any physical network interfaces at all, or if those are disabled/not connected. Depending on the OS the local address doesn't go through the full network stack either, so it is simpler.

 

 

Thanks for the clarification.

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Quite interesting, that.

 

Have you tried any of the NativeDSD.com 128fs or 256fs test files yet?

 

I have problems with multi-channel 256fs test files, occasionally.

 

No I have not tried those, but do have music from NativeDSD. My DAC only supports up to 2x-DSD and stereo only.

 

Here's all the Native DSD Test files, as I believe I have them all:

 

HQPlayer_File_List.jpg

Each heading indicates which are 2-channel and which are multi-channel

 

The multi-channel 256fs titles I was having problems with, are the Fernando Sor guitar sonatas.

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The procedure is fairly simple.

 

1) Install both software

2) Make sure playback in general (without Roon) works from HQPlayer with intended settings

3) Start both

4) In Roon Settings / Audio, click Add Network Device. Give the new output device a name and if HQPlayer is on same machine use "localhost" as address, otherwise specify host name or IP address of the remote machine where HQPlayer is located.

5) If HQPlayer is on a remote machine, click the right-most toolbar "Allow control from network" button down in HQPlayer

6) In Roon main window select the newly created network device as output

7) When you click play in Roon, it will contact HQPlayer and start playing.

I'm away so cannot try but have a question: How does HQP know to listen to localhost? Wouldn't you have to tell HQP to do this?

 

Thx.

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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I'm away so cannot try but have a question: How does HQP know to listen to localhost? Wouldn't you have to tell HQP to do this?

 

Thx.

 

HQP doesn' have to "know" to listen to localhost. You are telling Roon that the HQP is installed on localhost - i.e., the same machine as the Roon installation. That way when you playback something in Roon, it knows how/where to send the digital audio signal - to HQP installed on the same machine.

Main listening (small home office):

Main setup: Surge protector +>Isol-8 Mini sub Axis Power Strip/Isolation>QuietPC Low Noise Server>Roon (Audiolense DRC)>Stack Audio Link II>Kii Control>Kii Three (on their own electric circuit) >GIK Room Treatments.

Secondary Path: Server with Audiolense RC>RPi4 or analog>Cayin iDAC6 MKII (tube mode) (XLR)>Kii Three .

Bedroom: SBTouch to Cambridge Soundworks Desktop Setup.
Living Room/Kitchen: Ropieee (RPi3b+ with touchscreen) + Schiit Modi3E to a pair of Morel Hogtalare. 

All absolute statements about audio are false :)

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I'm away so cannot try but have a question: How does HQP know to listen to localhost? Wouldn't you have to tell HQP to do this?

 

It is listening for connections from localhost by default when the toolbar button is up. When the button is down, it is listening for connections from "any" (IOW, 0.0.0.0 for IPv4 and :: for IPv6, which is magical address for "world", including localhost).

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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It is listening for connections from localhost by default when the toolbar button is up. When the button is down, it is listening for connections from "any" (IOW, 0.0.0.0 for IPv4 and :: for IPv6, which is magical address for "world", including localhost).

Ok great, this is what I expected. I read of some disconnection issues where switching tracks in Roon very quickly will break the link. I was wondering if having a mode in HQP where it listens exclusively to a port in localhost or similar would prevent such issues. But of course I don't know any of the root causes.

 

Thx Miska! Happy New Year to you and all!

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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I am running HQP/Roon now, and it works fine, given the expectations that it is very new and buggy. I can live with it so far.

 

I have been dealing with a huge buffering issue in my Synology DS1513+DX513 ever since Thanksgiving time, where it cannot play anything but redbook without huge buffering/pausing. So...currently I run a local USB drive off of my HQP/Roonserver WS21012 R2 AO'd machine (running AO 2.00beta7). It is a Zuma class i7 3770S. The HQP NAA sits on the LAN in a Carbon-class Atom machine (I will also try this with Playpoint as NAA into my exaSounds). Currently Roonserver and HQP 3.12 on R2, NAA on Carbon R1 AO, Roon remote on Android 8.5" tablet, USB into Fore Audio DaisY1 (next review) DAC doing upsampling everything to 11.2Mhz (DSD256). I use either Poly-sinc-mp-2s or lately closed form, ASDM7. Non-2s poly filters don't seem to like this setup.

 

I often need to fix a lost connection or restart the HQP zone in Roon, but expected that. It is a bit frustrating but really nothing in the whole scope of what is trying to be done here. I am finding closed form to be incredibly quiet black background on redbook upsampled, almost startlingly so. Nice!

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Does Apple even support OpenCL or just their own API? But no, OpenCL is generally not feasible. CUDA is better suited and much more advanced. I also investigated Cilk+ supported by Intel but it is also rather cumbersome and would need ugly hacks.

 

With Apple hardware the problem is pretty much that you don't have choice what hardware components go into your system. So I would recommend Linux or Windows PC for anybody seeking for offloading capabilities. Even with laptops you have choice of various GeForce/Quadro graphics and CPU combinations.

Got it. I have a mac pro 2010 (essentially the last of the big boxes with pcie slots. Might get a cheap nvidia and try it out just for laughs. I would have to do NAA as my stereo's machine is a mini.

 

Thx Miska.

NUC10i7 + Roon ROCK > dCS Rossini APEX DAC + dCS Rossini Master Clock 

SME 20/3 + SME V + Dynavector XV-1s or ANUK IO Gold > vdH The Grail or Kondo KSL-SFz + ANK L3 Phono 

Audio Note Kondo Ongaku > Avantgarde Duo Mezzo

Signal cables: Kondo Silver, Crystal Cable phono

Power cables: Kondo, Shunyata, van den Hul

system pics

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Got it. I have a mac pro 2010 (essentially the last of the big boxes with pcie slots. Might get a cheap nvidia and try it out just for laughs. I would have to do NAA as my stereo's machine is a mini.

 

GeForce GTX 960 and Quadro K620 are fairly inexpensive while modern technology and have enough power so that it actually helps, so those are a good starting point.

Signalyst - Developer of HQPlayer

Pulse & Fidelity - Software Defined Amplifiers

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I like the idea of a pretty front end with Roon and using a control point like an ipad or an android tablet, while using a great sound engine with HQPlayer.

 

The problem is that my antique (Gen 4 2012 model) ipad retina won't work with Roon, and only selected android tablets which I also don't own. So apart from the $119/year for Roon, there's also an Ipad air 2 to buy $499 and throw out the old retina ipad which works perfectly fine for everything else.

 

I'll save the $618 for a future computer audio device and continue to enjoy HQPlayer on a VNC basis from the antique retina ipad or MBP.

 

Or if you had an Amazon Fire HD ( say a 3rd generation or later ) laying around you could use that with a few modifications to the Fire HD.

 

I have Roon running on just such as device....maybe you could locate one for under $50 on Ebay?

 

Amazon Kindle Fire HD 3rd Generation 8GB Wi Fi 7in P48WVB4 Tablet | eBay

Silver Circle Audio | Roon | Devialet | Synology | Vivid Audio | Stillpoint Aperture | Auralic | DH Labs

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Jussi, just wanted to say I finally got around to getting Roon, and after a bit of futzing, I have it integrated now w. HQP. Awesome sound and interface now. So firstly, Congrats on you and Roon working together so well!

 

One bit of help? I have my Mac Mini hooked up via hdmi and the response to moving the mouse is immediate. But I rarely use the tv to control this. I use screenshare thru my MBP, and there's about a 2-3 second delay with every mouse movement. Can you suggest any memory usage changes that would help, or is this simply a downside to using screenshare?

 

Thanks

Ryzen 7 2700 PC Server, NUC7CJYH w. 4G Apacer RAM as Renderer/LPS 1.2 - IsoRegen/LPS-1/.2 - Singxer SU-1/LPS1.2 - Holo Spring Level 3 DAC - LTA MicroZOTL MZ2 - Modwright KWA 150 Signature Amp - Tidal Audio Piano's.  

.

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Man, no matter what I do I just can't get Roon and HQP to output to SDM/DSD. I've tried every suggestion here and on the CA site. HQP plays fine with all filters on its own. Roon plays fine. Roon and HQP play fine on any PCM setting in HQP. But when Roon hands off the signal and any DSD path is chosen (just trying the basic poly sync>DSD5>SDM) it shows up in HQP, Roon shows the file (any file) is playing, but I get no sound. I've disabled my DAC in Roon so HQP has total access to it. I'm using Core Audio and my DAC is chosen in HQP. Cannot figure this out. Any suggestions? I am using HQP 3.12 and the latest Roon build.

 

Screen Shot 2016-01-05 at 1.40.09 PM.jpg

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I have a question which does not directly relate to Roon, but that other Roon users may be interested in nethertheless. Since Roon is currently limited in its streaming services (no radio, for example), and is not a "all in one" solution for me, is it possible to send streams to HQ Player from other applications in addition to Roon ? This would avoid have to use multiple sources in my system.

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Man, no matter what I do I just can't get Roon and HQP to output to SDM/DSD. I've tried every suggestion here and on the CA site. HQP plays fine with all filters on its own. Roon plays fine. Roon and HQP play fine on any PCM setting in HQP. But when Roon hands off the signal and any DSD path is chosen (just trying the basic poly sync>DSD5>SDM) it shows up in HQP, Roon shows the file (any file) is playing, but I get no sound. I've disabled my DAC in Roon so HQP has total access to it. I'm using Core Audio and my DAC is chosen in HQP. Cannot figure this out. Any suggestions? I am using HQP 3.12 and the latest Roon build.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]23149[/ATTACH]

 

I just got Roon and HQP setup today; And had the same problem. All looked great with no sound. Not sure what worked, but I deleted Roon's libraries, shut all apps, rebooted my Mac Mini and imported the library again. Works perfect now. Perhaps?

Ryzen 7 2700 PC Server, NUC7CJYH w. 4G Apacer RAM as Renderer/LPS 1.2 - IsoRegen/LPS-1/.2 - Singxer SU-1/LPS1.2 - Holo Spring Level 3 DAC - LTA MicroZOTL MZ2 - Modwright KWA 150 Signature Amp - Tidal Audio Piano's.  

.

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Man, no matter what I do I just can't get Roon and HQP to output to SDM/DSD. I've tried every suggestion here and on the CA site. HQP plays fine with all filters on its own. Roon plays fine. Roon and HQP play fine on any PCM setting in HQP.

 

Do you have other audio outputs with exclusive access set up in Roon? If so, try disabling them and see if that makes a difference.

 

I'm assuming you're using your MacBook Pro to run both apps. What processor does it have and how much RAM? Have you looked at what's going on in Activity Monitor when you try to run Roon and HQP together? What's the situation with CPU and memory usage?

 

Maybe posting screen shots of your HQP prefs and DSDIFF/DSF settings would help with a diagnosis?

 

If you can get the two applications working together, you're in for a treat, so don't give up just yet.

 

--David

Listening Room: Mac mini (Roon Core) > iMac (HQP) > exaSound PlayPoint (as NAA) > exaSound e32 > W4S STP-SE > Benchmark AHB2 > Wilson Sophia Series 2 (Details)

Office: Mac Pro >  AudioQuest DragonFly Red > JBL LSR305

Mobile: iPhone 6S > AudioQuest DragonFly Black > JH Audio JH5

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Do you have other audio outputs with exclusive access set up in Roon? If so, try disabling them and see that if that makes a difference.

 

I'm assuming you're using your MacBook Pro to run both apps. What processor does it have and how much RAM? Have you looked at what's going on in Activity Monitor when you try to run Roon and HQP together? What's the situation with CPU and memory usage?

 

If you can get the two applications working together, you're in for a treat, so don't give up just yet.

 

--David

Orgel, thank you for the reply and suggestions. Over on the Roon forum Jussi and Gianluca helped me figure out that my SDM output was incorrect and that it needed to be set to 282240. For whatever reason, that seemed to work and Roon and HQP are playing together. Just so you know, I did let go of the DAC so HQP could have exclusive access and I'm on an iMac mid 2015 with a 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5 and 8gb gb of RAM.

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Over on the Roon forum Jussi and Gianluca helped me figure out that my SDM output was incorrect and that it needed to be set to 282240. For whatever reason, that seemed to work and Roon and HQP are playing together.

 

Interesting. Your MBP specs are very similar to my mini's, and I can't seem to do better than DSD64 either. (I think I should be able to do DSD128 with the Mytek.) Can you point me to the thread on the Roon forum?

 

Glad you got it working, though.

 

--David

 

Edit: Found the Roon thread. Please let me know if you get DSD128 to work.

Listening Room: Mac mini (Roon Core) > iMac (HQP) > exaSound PlayPoint (as NAA) > exaSound e32 > W4S STP-SE > Benchmark AHB2 > Wilson Sophia Series 2 (Details)

Office: Mac Pro >  AudioQuest DragonFly Red > JBL LSR305

Mobile: iPhone 6S > AudioQuest DragonFly Black > JH Audio JH5

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