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I2S Computer Build


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Not always.

The Wyred4Sound DAC has the clock in the same place no matter what input you use so this is a mute point. Same goes for the PS Audio DS. These devices ignore the master clock you send to them. The on board master clock is high quality and as close to the DAC as possible.

The Rendu has a hybrid clocking scheme where the high quality clocks on the output board reclock the source board and sends the clock to the devices that will use it. For example, my personal DAC will use the master clock and so will a PS Audio PWD MI and MKII. On these devices at least the source and the DAC use the same high quality master clock.

If the external master clock from the source is used on the standard i2s devices that is the way the designer intended it to work. The better the source the better the device will sound.

 

 

Funny how the DIY parts have this.

 

 

Let's not forget to reclock the USB input, isolation and all with-in a few mm;) The disadvantage here is that you are stuck with a fixed solution.

 

 

What ever the reason....the advantage goes to i2s.

 

No argument from me on any of your well-reasoned points my friend. :)

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The trouble with external I2S (even the LVDS variety) and S/PDIF (although it has a host of other implementation issues of its own) is that the clocking is virtually always in the wrong place. The best DACs always have one (pair of) master clock that everything is slaved to--otherwise they use some form of ASRC. But with external USB (or Ethernet)>I2S interfaces, the clock is in the box and gets sent TO the DAC. Almost nobody runs a clock line FROM the DAC to the interface.

Heck, even a lot of the available USB>I2S don't have a clock input line (though the Amanero, WaveIO, and JLSounds boards all now do allow it--but with some weakness in the area of isolators).

 

Anyway, I2S/DSD is obviously an end goal into the DAC chip, but I think the interface from the computer (for USB, Ethernet, etc.) to I2S belongs inside the DAC for ultimate performance.

 

That is not meant to take anything away from some of the very fine D-D converter boxes out there. Just recognize that they sound good because they may sound better than the DAC's other input implementations.

 

I have had the pleasure of hearing the Pink Faun PCI to I2S Bridge do it's sound quality magic on play back several times. I am pleased to report that the Pink Faun OCXO module on the motherboard lifted the quality of the playback with the bridge to new levels. The guys at Pink Faun had never heard their system sing so beautifully.

 

This was the Sound Galleries Munich 2015 mobo fitted with the first Pink Faun OCXO module on PCB, which by the way sounded better than the bread board 2 weeks earlier. The SG mobo was also fitted with the Pink Faun I2S Bridge in the PCI slot. A HDMI cable was connected to Pink Faun's top of the line DAC, which has no less than 32 DAC chips ! We were using HQ Player to upsample 16/44 to 24/192 using HQ Player (TPDF filter) The crowd sound and whistling on Hotel California was amazing, certainly one of the best I have ever heard. It was a very happy moment for all of us in the room, another sound quality glass ceiling shattered. The guys at Pink Faun are not done yet, they have ideas and components which they are going to try out of the coming weeks and I am confident there will be improvements.

 

However despite what I have heard, my recommendation to Sound Galleries is not to go down the PCI to I2S Bridge at the present time as much as the guys at Pink Faun would love that to happen. To my old ears, the sound we can get from the OCXO clocked mobo, HQ Player doing PCM to DSD 256 playing into ExaSound DAC with the femto clock, which has a prototype external power supply from Taiko Audio (edbk) is simply magic.

 

The DSD playback solution has me, in my old brain, perceiving sonic realism and beauty at a level that has me grinning like a Cheshire cat and in rapture at every chord of a stringed instrument. Similar reaction in my head to percussion. edbk has a similar evaluation of the sound quality of the Sound Galleries Music server prototype.

 

So to a cut a long story short, my 2 cents is Superdad's commentary in the bubble above carries more sonic weight at the present time, and I expect that to remain the case until the next version of Pink Faun's I2S bridge, and then I will have to listen and test all over again :-)

Sound Test, Monaco

Consultant to Sound Galleries Monaco, and Taiko Audio Holland

e-mail [email protected]

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Jesus, what's your take on the use of Windows drivers with the PF I2S board. Seems the lack of ASIO drivers by PF for this board will have an impact, but how much? Thanks.

 

During the test session with the Sound Galleries server fitted with the Pink Faun PCI to I2S Bridge, we were using ASIO4ALL. You can get full details from Pink Faun by e-mailing [email protected]

Sound Test, Monaco

Consultant to Sound Galleries Monaco, and Taiko Audio Holland

e-mail [email protected]

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I completed both USB and I2S server builds.

 

The USB server is a CAPS Pipeline with these changes:

PPA OS SSD with OCXO clock with JCAT BPS powering this

PPA Sarah SATA cable for the OS SSD

PPA Music SSD with TCXO clock

PPA V3 USB card with OCXO clock

E3-1240L V3 25W TDP CPU

2 AQ Jitterbugs plugged in but not in the USB data stream (didn't like it inline)

Light Harmonic 10G USB cable -> Regen with Netron Star Clock, LPS powering this -> Supra USB cable

Server 2012 R2 with AO 1.40, HQ Player

PS Audio DirectStream DAC

 

The I2S server is a CAPS Zuma with these changes:

HD-Plex LPS with 250W DC-ATX

5V feed from the LPS just for the OS and Music SSDs (made a surprising difference vs powering it with peripheral power from the ATX)

Pink Faun I2S bridge

Server 2012 R2 with AO 1.40, JRiver 21

PF supplied HDMI cable to DirectStream

 

Before finishing the I2S server (before the Pink Faun board arrived), I plugged in the SOtM USB card on the Zuma, ran it through the modified Regen and compared it to the Pipeline server.

There was no contest - the Pipeline was clearly better - soundstanding, imaging, details...

 

Partly due to this, I was expecting the Pink Faun board to not sound as good as well, but I was surprised - it sounds really good.

 

Given the parts and price difference, I now wonder what a souped up PF-based I2S server would sound like.

 

I give the edge to the USB server at this time but I plan to do more tweaking with drivers and software on the PF/Zuma machine.

 

I can relate to what EuroDriver is doing now with his project and when he says "we know we have to run hard and throw a lot high quality parts at the USB implementation to keep ahead of I2S".

 

Pipeline USB:

P9060301.JPG

 

Zuma I2S:

P9180308.JPG

P8290288.JPG

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I completed both USB and I2S server builds.

 

The USB server is a CAPS Pipeline with these changes:

PPA OS SSD with OCXO clock with JCAT BPS powering this

PPA Sarah SATA cable for the OS SSD

PPA Music SSD with TCXO clock

PPA V3 USB card with OCXO clock

E3-1240L V3 25W TDP CPU

2 AQ Jitterbugs plugged in but not in the USB data stream (didn't like it inline)

Light Harmonic 10G USB cable -> Regen with Netron Star Clock, LPS powering this -> Supra USB cable

Server 2012 R2 with AO 1.40, HQ Player

PS Audio DirectStream DAC

 

The I2S server is a CAPS Zuma with these changes:

HD-Plex LPS with 250W DC-ATX

5V feed from the LPS just for the OS and Music SSDs (made a surprising difference vs powering it with peripheral power from the ATX)

Pink Faun I2S bridge

Server 2012 R2 with AO 1.40, JRiver 21

PF supplied HDMI cable to DirectStream

 

Before finishing the I2S server (before the Pink Faun board arrived), I plugged in the SOtM USB card on the Zuma, ran it through the modified Regen and compared it to the Pipeline server.

There was no contest - the Pipeline was clearly better - soundstanding, imaging, details...

 

Partly due to this, I was expecting the Pink Faun board to not sound as good as well, but I was surprised - it sounds really good.

 

Given the parts and price difference, I now wonder what a souped up PF-based I2S server would sound like.

 

I give the edge to the USB server at this time but I plan to do more tweaking with drivers and software on the PF/Zuma machine.

 

I can relate to what EuroDriver is doing now with his project and when he says "we know we have to run hard and throw a lot high quality parts at the USB implementation to keep ahead of I2S".

 

Pipeline USB:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]20972[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]20974[/ATTACH]

 

Zuma I2S:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]20973[/ATTACH]

 

 

Great post, great news. What drivers did you use with the Pink Faun?

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Jesus, what's your take on the use of Windows drivers with the PF I2S board. Seems the lack of ASIO drivers by PF for this board will have an impact, but how much? Thanks.

 

It's only important if it can be quantified and it's can't because there is no ASIO driver as far as I know. Try ASIO4ALL or WASAPI as noted above.

 

BTW We are working with them to add the driver to Vortexbox and Sonic Orbiter.

 

Jesus R

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I completed both USB and I2S server builds.

 

The USB server is a CAPS Pipeline with these changes:

PPA OS SSD with OCXO clock with JCAT BPS powering this

PPA Sarah SATA cable for the OS SSD

PPA Music SSD with TCXO clock

PPA V3 USB card with OCXO clock

E3-1240L V3 25W TDP CPU

2 AQ Jitterbugs plugged in but not in the USB data stream (didn't like it inline)

Light Harmonic 10G USB cable -> Regen with Netron Star Clock, LPS powering this -> Supra USB cable

Server 2012 R2 with AO 1.40, HQ Player

PS Audio DirectStream DAC

 

The I2S server is a CAPS Zuma with these changes:

HD-Plex LPS with 250W DC-ATX

5V feed from the LPS just for the OS and Music SSDs (made a surprising difference vs powering it with peripheral power from the ATX)

Pink Faun I2S bridge

Server 2012 R2 with AO 1.40, JRiver 21

PF supplied HDMI cable to DirectStream

 

Before finishing the I2S server (before the Pink Faun board arrived), I plugged in the SOtM USB card on the Zuma, ran it through the modified Regen and compared it to the Pipeline server.

There was no contest - the Pipeline was clearly better - soundstanding, imaging, details...

 

Partly due to this, I was expecting the Pink Faun board to not sound as good as well, but I was surprised - it sounds really good.

 

Given the parts and price difference, I now wonder what a souped up PF-based I2S server would sound like.

 

I give the edge to the USB server at this time but I plan to do more tweaking with drivers and software on the PF/Zuma machine.

 

I can relate to what EuroDriver is doing now with his project and when he says "we know we have to run hard and throw a lot high quality parts at the USB implementation to keep ahead of I2S".

 

Pipeline USB:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]20972[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]20974[/ATTACH]

 

Zuma I2S:

[ATTACH=CONFIG]20973[/ATTACH]

 

I have some suggestions for the Zume build if you don't mind? What outputs does your HD-Plex PS have and which one are you using? 12V or 19?

 

Jesus R

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Pepi, Again your builds looks just great. And very glad to hear the SQ is good. (Can we yet say the earlier naysayers have been trumped?)

 

I ordered my PF card today and will also put into a modified Zuma. This server will also have a USB board. So, two outputs. Powered by HDPlex and maybe another, or other if needed. Jesus did say earlier to power the PF with a good source, but it looks like you have not got to that point yet. After hearing of your success with PPA equipment, his stuff might be on the table for me now too. Maybe a month or two before all is done.

 

Again, well done. Closer to reaching our goals stated earlier of doing head-to-head with USB and I2S.

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PF card would work fine off the 12V output from HDPlex, correct? I modified the molex connector that comes with HDPlex to provide 12V instead of the included 5V so my plan is to power PF from that molex plug and then power my PPA V2 card with the 5V connector, Regen with the 9V, and obviously 19V to the motherboard through the HiFi 250W ATX PSU. Should give a pretty fair comparison though, as stated, we're limited to WASAPI right now (and thus, no AO Core Mode) for PF. I don't know that ASIO4ALL will give any benefit over WASAPI except that perhaps it works in Core Mode.

 

I will say that just powering Regen and the PPA cards via HDPlex - not the SSDs so far - the difference is quite obvious. So I'm excited to power the entire rig from HDPlex when my replacement ATX PSU gets here, then on to the PF setup.

 

I also just added some foam diffusion to the front wall of my room this morning. Why, oh why, did I not do that before...

Ryzen 3900x Roon Core PC -> Intel i9900k HQPlayer W10 machine -> iFi Zen Stream NAA

Holo May KTE, Benchmark LA4 preamp

SMC Audio upgraded DNA-125 Amp

Dynaudio Confidence C2 Platinum speakers

Vinyl rig - Schiit Sol, Nagaoka MP-500, Mod Squad PhonoDrive phono stage

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What I2S cables could be used with the Pink Faun? Seems normal video-style HDMI cables would work but are not optimized for audio, is this right? Pink Faun sells two cables but they're not cheap. Would the video-type cable work until I decide what to move up to?

 

Thanks.

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What I2S cables could be used with the Pink Faun? Seems normal video-style HDMI cables would work but are not optimized for audio, is this right? Pink Faun sells two cables but they're not cheap. Would the video-type cable work until I decide what to move up to?

 

Thanks.

 

You have to ask them if the cable uses a standard pin assignment. I have customers using cables from PS Audio, Wyred4Sound, and Cardas. I personally don't like bulky HDMI cable because I have a short run and it puts a lot of pressure on the connections. I just use a standard HDMI cable from Blue Jean Cable Co. The cable is important though so use a good quality cable.

 

Jesus R

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I have some suggestions for the Zume build if you don't mind? What outputs does your HD-Plex PS have and which one are you using? 12V or 19?

 

Jesus R

 

Hi Jesus,

 

I'm using the 19V for the computer - the HD-Plex DC-ATX takes 16-24VDC.

The HD-Plex also has a 5V output which I'm using for the SSDs. This made a nice difference though I think it'll likely be even better with a JCAT/Bakoon battery.

 

OT - holy cow - I see that HD-Plex has a new product listed on their website - a 300W ATX Linear PSU with no DC ATX needed.

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PF card would work fine off the 12V output from HDPlex, correct? I modified the molex connector that comes with HDPlex to provide 12V instead of the included 5V so my plan is to power PF from that molex plug and then power my PPA V2 card with the 5V connector, Regen with the 9V, and obviously 19V to the motherboard through the HiFi 250W ATX PSU. Should give a pretty fair comparison though, as stated, we're limited to WASAPI right now (and thus, no AO Core Mode) for PF. I don't know that ASIO4ALL will give any benefit over WASAPI except that perhaps it works in Core Mode.

 

I will say that just powering Regen and the PPA cards via HDPlex - not the SSDs so far - the difference is quite obvious. So I'm excited to power the entire rig from HDPlex when my replacement ATX PSU gets here, then on to the PF setup.

 

I also just added some foam diffusion to the front wall of my room this morning. Why, oh why, did I not do that before...

 

I think you should check with Pink Faun regarding the voltage requirements. The LP4 connector I'm using has both 5V and 12V and they are supplied on different pins.

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Getting it running with the ASIO4ALL driver was quite easy.

 

I believe you still need to follow the PF card setup and configuration in Windows as documented in their manual at Windows I2S-bridge

 

ASIO4ALL is available at ASIO4ALL - Universal ASIO Driver

When you install it, you'll need to select the Offline Settings option (it's not selected by default).

 

After installation, JRiver picks it up and ASIO4ALL v2 is a choice that you can switch to.

 

You'll then need to run this Offline Settings program - it presents a few devices (3 in my case).

It was then a matter of choosing each one in turn (they were all named High Definition Audio Device), running JRiver, and seeing if you got sound.

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Hi Todd,

 

Here's the LP4 pinout:

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]20996[/ATTACH]

 

Thanks Pepi - by default the HDPlex LP4/Molex connector is wired with the +5V (Red) position and the "right" gnd position, using the lower-right image you posted. I moved the GND over by one (this was just an assumption on how the PF will be pinned) and moved the red wire to the opposite side, the 12V pin. So assuming I use the 12V output to my rewired molex, I should be able to power the PF that way, unless I have to move the GND back to where it was originally, easy enough.

 

Now the question is can I get another molex adapter like supplied with the HDPlex to power my SSDs with a Molex-Sata cable. I can probably just get an extra from HDPlex. I'm using that to power my PPA V2 card which takes a 2.5 mm DC jack, so I basically want to convert that 2.5 mm DC to molex. I'll do some digging, shouldn't be too tough to find?

 

EDIT - I may be making a very dumb assumption - does the PF Bridge get power from a DC jack or an LP4 type connector?

 

And yes, Jord did confirm 12V, I forgot about that email exchange with him. Jord rocks, just for the record :)

 

Edit 2 - looks like it takes a SATA power connector per the manual linked above? " Place the Pink Faun I2S-bridge in the PCI slot and connect the power supply (SATA)."

Ryzen 3900x Roon Core PC -> Intel i9900k HQPlayer W10 machine -> iFi Zen Stream NAA

Holo May KTE, Benchmark LA4 preamp

SMC Audio upgraded DNA-125 Amp

Dynaudio Confidence C2 Platinum speakers

Vinyl rig - Schiit Sol, Nagaoka MP-500, Mod Squad PhonoDrive phono stage

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Hi Jesus,

 

I'm using the 19V for the computer - the HD-Plex DC-ATX takes 16-24VDC.

The HD-Plex also has a 5V output which I'm using for the SSDs. This made a nice difference though I think it'll likely be even better with a JCAT/Bakoon battery.

 

OT - holy cow - I see that HD-Plex has a new product listed on their website - a 300W ATX Linear PSU with no DC ATX needed.

 

I think you will be very pleased if you can power the card directly from the external PS and not off of the internal DC to DC converter. Also, I would move the DC to DC converter away from the card.

 

Jesus R

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I think you will be very pleased if you can power the card directly from the external PS and not off of the internal DC to DC converter. Also, I would move the DC to DC converter away from the card.

 

Jesus R

 

Hi Jesus,

 

Great suggestions, thank you! I'll do these.

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Thanks Pepi - by default the HDPlex LP4/Molex connector is wired with the +5V (Red) position and the "right" gnd position, using the lower-right image you posted. I moved the GND over by one (this was just an assumption on how the PF will be pinned) and moved the red wire to the opposite side, the 12V pin. So assuming I use the 12V output to my rewired molex, I should be able to power the PF that way, unless I have to move the GND back to where it was originally, easy enough.

 

Now the question is can I get another molex adapter like supplied with the HDPlex to power my SSDs with a Molex-Sata cable. I can probably just get an extra from HDPlex. I'm using that to power my PPA V2 card which takes a 2.5 mm DC jack, so I basically want to convert that 2.5 mm DC to molex. I'll do some digging, shouldn't be too tough to find?

 

EDIT - I may be making a very dumb assumption - does the PF Bridge get power from a DC jack or an LP4 type connector?

 

And yes, Jord did confirm 12V, I forgot about that email exchange with him. Jord rocks, just for the record :)

 

Edit 2 - looks like it takes a SATA power connector per the manual linked above? " Place the Pink Faun I2S-bridge in the PCI slot and connect the power supply (SATA)."

 

Hi Todd,

Sounds good - I'll be making this change and powering the card with 12V from the HDPlex as well. I don't know if the board ties the 2 grounds together though - a question for Jord.

 

I don't know of any other source for the 2.1mm to LP4 adapters - very useful for the stuff we're trying to do but I imagine it's a small market for DIY audiophile types.

 

The PF board doesn't have a DC jack, only the LP4 connector in the rear of the card.

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Hi Todd,

Sounds good - I'll be making this change and powering the card with 12V from the HDPlex as well. I don't know if the board ties the 2 grounds together though - a question for Jord.

 

I don't know of any other source for the 2.1mm to LP4 adapters - very useful for the stuff we're trying to do but I imagine it's a small market for DIY audiophile types.

 

The PF board doesn't have a DC jack, only the LP4 connector in the rear of the card.

 

Pepi, I'm just going to use this:

 

2.1MM COAX POWER JACK (FEMALE) W/ PIGTAIL | All Electronics Corp.

 

And solder it to an LP4 from the parts bin and use that, from the sounds of how you connected yours (still not sure why PF says to use a "SATA" power supply).

 

Edit - I'm doing the same for my SSDs - that pigtail wired to a male LP4, feeding a female LP4 Molex to Sata adapter. I think that will work, but obviously on that one I'll only supply 5V using the correct wires, not 12V.

Ryzen 3900x Roon Core PC -> Intel i9900k HQPlayer W10 machine -> iFi Zen Stream NAA

Holo May KTE, Benchmark LA4 preamp

SMC Audio upgraded DNA-125 Amp

Dynaudio Confidence C2 Platinum speakers

Vinyl rig - Schiit Sol, Nagaoka MP-500, Mod Squad PhonoDrive phono stage

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