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Uptone Regen and your DAC. What DAC do you use?


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By some reason I avoid anything soft under the components. Wood or metal better suits me. And I love Barry Diament's bowl/ball idea for supporting all components and speakers.

 

I agree, to extent.

 

Although a little off topic, the isolation/coupling quandary is out there. I work in the mechanical vibration area these days, from generation to measurement on the order of 10 nm or less amplitude, which is where most small metallic objects vibrate. I have measured the resonant vibration spectrum of many things with our instruments, including various commercially available cones. Quite interesting. Any object has numerous frequencies of resonance at which it actually acts like an amplifier due to constructive interference. That's how the opera singer blows up the crystal goblet. (at resonance the amplitude of vibration increases to the point of exceeding the elastic limit of the crystal) That vibration needs to be drained from the component or it will just travel through any contact with a material of similar acoustic impedance, which is analogous to electrical impedance. The closer the impedances match, the higher the efficiency of transfer. This topic can get deep. There are nulls and maxima in the amplitude of vibration on any surface. All this can be modeled to find those locations and put your contact there. Balls are a special case all their own.

 

Personally, I prefer the results of spikes into hardwood, end grain butcher block. I may have to try balls. Ceramic balls will have very sharp, higher frequency resonances than most metals. Ideally you would want to step down from metal or composite (yes even composites do have some very low Q resonances) to intermediary materials of decreasing acoustic impedance to max out the transfer before you dump it into a really non-resonant material. Not sure how much improvement it would be, though.

 

Back on topic, I made 2 small angled blocks (inclined triangles, if you will, when looked at on edge) that I could slide against each other to bring them to the best height for the REGEN to be level. I also put very thin 800 grit sandpaper on the contacting faces so they won't slip. The 2 sandpaper surfaces should also alleviate any vibration transfer from the shelf to the REGEN.

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I agree, to extent.

 

Although a little off topic, the isolation/coupling quandary is out there. I work in the mechanical vibration area these days, from generation to measurement on the order of 10 nm or less amplitude, which is where most small metallic objects vibrate. I have measured the resonant vibration spectrum of many things with our instruments, including various commercially available cones. Quite interesting. Any object has numerous frequencies of resonance at which it actually acts like an amplifier due to constructive interference. That's how the opera singer blows up the crystal goblet. (at resonance the amplitude of vibration increases to the point of exceeding the elastic limit of the crystal) That vibration needs to be drained from the component or it will just travel through any contact with a material of similar acoustic impedance, which is analogous to electrical impedance. The closer the impedances match, the higher the efficiency of transfer. This topic can get deep. There are nulls and maxima in the amplitude of vibration on any surface. All this can be modeled to find those locations and put your contact there. Balls are a special case all their own.

 

Personally, I prefer the results of spikes into hardwood, end grain butcher block. I may have to try balls. Ceramic balls will have very sharp, higher frequency resonances than most metals. Ideally you would want to step down from metal or composite (yes even composites do have some very low Q resonances) to intermediary materials of decreasing acoustic impedance to max out the transfer before you dump it into a really non-resonant material. Not sure how much improvement it would be, though.

 

Back on topic, I made 2 small angled blocks (inclined triangles, if you will, when looked at on edge) that I could slide against each other to bring them to the best height for the REGEN to be level. I also put very thin 800 grit sandpaper on the contacting faces so they won't slip. The 2 sandpaper surfaces should also alleviate any vibration transfer from the shelf to the REGEN.

Would you share any pictures? Thank you.
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Back on topic, I made 2 small angled blocks (inclined triangles, if you will, when looked at on edge) that I could slide against each other to bring them to the best height for the REGEN to be level. I also put very thin 800 grit sandpaper on the contacting faces so they won't slip. The 2 sandpaper surfaces should also alleviate any vibration transfer from the shelf to the REGEN.

 

Now that's clever. Elegant, simple, effective. Pictures please. :)

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Was that 'a fun family experience' or a 'memorable family experience' ????

 

Well I hope our trip will turn out to be both.

 

This morning I am stressing because FedEx Ground claims they delivered 7 cartons yesterday but that is false. That shipment contains 350 of those black and white square jewelry boxes we kit the REGENs into, and the plan was to have my assembler get started with those (silver labels, SMPS, cords, etc.) while I am gone. I hate it when the simple things throw a wrench into a careful plan.

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Now that's clever. Elegant, simple, effective. Pictures please. :)

 

Thanks, Alex. Disclosure: I stole the idea from some guys a while back... I think it was the Greeks or Romans or Egyptians or Mayans. so long ago I don't remember. :-)

 

This setup is my first prototype. I'm now making a customized version because of the physical arrangement of my DAC and my shelf. I've got to put a step in the bottom block to get off the back rail of my stand and get the support coming from the shelf. I may need to put a step in the top block to firm up the REGEN to USB adapter connection. There is still some leverage being applied to the connectors and I'm not sure that using the adapter as a "suspension bridge" is the best idea, or maybe i'm just having fun figuring it out while the music plays. :-)

 

Adjustable Support Blocks for Uptone REGEN.jpg

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I'm going to cut a cube of styrofoam packing from one of the shipping cartons I've saved, then use some blu-tack top and bottom to affix the REGEN to it, and then stick it to the shelf behind the DAC. Squishing down the lump of blu-tack will make it easy to get the height exactly right, and it will also isolate the REGEN from vibrations.

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Why not simply cut the block the correct size?

Thanks, Alex. Disclosure: I stole the idea from some guys a while back... I think it was the Greeks or Romans or Egyptians or Mayans. so long ago I don't remember. :-)

 

This setup is my first prototype. I'm now making a customized version because of the physical arrangement of my DAC and my shelf. I've got to put a step in the bottom block to get off the back rail of my stand and get the support coming from the shelf. I may need to put a step in the top block to firm up the REGEN to USB adapter connection. There is still some leverage being applied to the connectors and I'm not sure that using the adapter as a "suspension bridge" is the best idea, or maybe i'm just having fun figuring it out while the music plays. :-)

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]18604[/ATTACH]

Forrest:

Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA

DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP>

Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz

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In my installation I couldn't even get a good enough measurement with my calipers. I needed an adjustable support. I also move it under 3 different DAC connections. If you can cut a one piece just go for it, don't bug me with your question.
I like this two piece solution. It is more organic, you could play with air and weight. Not a dumb one piece.
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This morning I am stressing because FedEx Ground claims they delivered 7 cartons yesterday but that is false. That shipment contains 350 of those black and white square jewelry boxes we kit the REGENs into, and the plan was to have my assembler get started with those (silver labels, SMPS, cords, etc.) while I am gone. I hate it when the simple things throw a wrench into a careful plan.

 

I see that nobody responds to this, so I will.

 

Alex, I guess it needs the daily life experience to feel like you feel. Happens all the time and best is to know in advance that nothing much can be done about it anyway. One thing : you will never lose your money (assumed all was insured). But one other thing just the same : such a thing may get you in a complete dead lock. Worse what can happen :

 

FedEx : We need to investigate this. Takes 8 working days (so they take 8 working days).

8 Working days pass and you hear nothing. Officially you're entitled to have the work re-done. But will you really ? Well, the business has to continue so you decide to do that.

After 16 days FedEx comes back to you with the message "found !". Everybody happy.

Well, not of course, unless by now you want double the quantity. So that not assumed the real fight begins. Who is going to pay for the additional quantity/amount ? Should be FedEx. But did they *really* approve your going ahead with that ? They did not.

Moral : You can't do a thing until the damage was payed for.

 

So moral for us : At this moment it could be a good thing that us customers anticipate one month later or worse delivery.

But I'm confident that the shipment will normally pop up. At a closed door now, so that's another small problem.

 

Alex, heads up man.

Peter

Lush^3-e      Lush^2      Blaxius^2.5      Ethernet^3     HDMI^2     XLR^2

XXHighEnd (developer)

Phasure NOS1 24/768 Async USB DAC (manufacturer)

Phasure Mach III Audio PC with Linear PSU (manufacturer)

Orelino & Orelo MKII Speakers (designer/supplier)

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Regen woks well with Lamp GG. It brings depth and clarity of the very excellent GG. I wonder what kind of improvements will Amber Regen bring. I do hope someone will bring out a kit to support Regen. It places quite a lot of mechanical stress on the DAC USB input.

 

 

Adyc, Love to upgrade to the GG in the near future.

I agree that a support for the Regen would be lovely. For Lamp DAC, the size of the unit implies that we dont have table space to support the Regen. Hence the best I could do was to use a siicone band to hold up the unit. This does help as the unit and the wire weight is now not hinged on the USB connection. Pic as added.

 

I think the Regen is crying for OEM into other DAC like the USB card like Amanero is.

FullSizeRender.jpg

FullSizeRender-1.jpg

Qnap NAS (LPS) >UA ETHER REGEN (BG7TBL Master Clock) > Grimm MU1 > Mola Mola Tambaqui /Meridian 808.3> Wavac EC300B >Tannoy Canterbury SE

 

HP Rig ++ >Woo WES/ > Stax SR-009, Audeze LCD2

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Well I hope our trip will turn out to be both.

 

This morning I am stressing because FedEx Ground claims they delivered 7 cartons yesterday but that is false. That shipment contains 350 of those black and white square jewelry boxes we kit the REGENs into, and the plan was to have my assembler get started with those (silver labels, SMPS, cords, etc.) while I am gone. I hate it when the simple things throw a wrench into a careful plan.

 

Nothing surprises me when it comes to FedEX, their drivers and their support staff including their supervisors (management).

 

The tracking number I used to refer to the status of an important shipment indicated FedEX had delivered a pair of custom JL Audio subwoofer stands fabricated by Sound Anchor to me that day. FedEX's customer support confirmed the delivery when I telephoned to inquire who FedEX actually delivered the stands to as I did not have the stands to stand on. FedEX assured me I had signed for them. Apparently, they had an amnesiac on the phone (me). Did I want to make a claim and request they trace the delivery to me that I had accepted? Perhaps they intended to call me back and ask me if I signed for the delivery and question the driver who delivered the stands to me.

 

Hours later my door bell rang. I opened my front door and viewed my neighbor from across the street standing sweating next to a large box that had been opened. FedEX had delivered to number 28, a private home, with a large bronze Frontgate address plate staked to the lawn. Someone in his family accepted the delivery assuming it was for them, not realizing it was intended for me at 29, a private home, across the street with a large bronze Frontgate address plate staked to the lawn. Those stands were heavy; and he had carried them a block. They were also expensive.

 

I was grateful for my neighbor's efforts and honesty; and furious that the FedEX driver had carelessly delivered this important shipment to the wrong home despite clearly identifying residence signs. I telephoned FedEX a second time and demanded to speak to a supervisor who understood how egregious the incident was for me by supporting the FedEX driver's innocent mistake ignoring the clearly marked residence identification placards. It was clear that my neighbor and I were the only persons who cared about doing the right thing and assessed how incompetent the driver's action was.

 

Alex, I hope your cartons are located and delivered to you without any further delay -- how could they not be found? Consider asking your neighbor. One of those jewlry boxes is intended for my Regen Amber order among the other devices I look forward to receiving.

 

Will you be shipping my total order next month via FedEX? How about UPS? (Smile!)

 

Try to enjoy your up-coming holiday whether or not FedEX lets you.

 

Best,

Richard

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The question was rhetorical.

In my installation I couldn't even get a good enough measurement with my calipers. I needed an adjustable support. I also move it under 3 different DAC connections. If you can cut a one piece just go for it, don't bug me with your question.

Forrest:

Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA

DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP>

Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz

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The question was rhetorical.

 

Well, you got some rhetoric in return. ;)

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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Yep, my fault for addressing someone attempting to use a caliper when a ruler would do. Three different DACs? Last I looked, a cube has three parallel surfaces. Hmm.

 

I am sure it works and all. That is until the 2x material does its thing. I am sorry, but as a professional woodworker, it bugs me. At the very least, if someone is going to take the time to do that, rotate the stock 90 degrees in so that it will be more stable long term. I'll shut up about it now. Sorry for the digression.

 

Despite the form factor issues (a necessary evil) I am loving my Regen, and look forward to an Amber.

Well, you got some rhetoric in return. ;)

Forrest:

Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA

DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP>

Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz

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Yep, my fault for addressing someone attempting to use a caliper when a ruler would do. Three different DACs? Last I looked, a cube has three parallel surfaces. Hmm.

 

I am sure it works and all. That is until the 2x material does its thing. I am sorry, but as a professional woodworker, it bugs me. At the very least, if someone is going to take the time to do that, rotate the stock 90 degrees in so that it will be more stable long term. I'll shut up about it now. Sorry for the digression.

 

Despite the form factor issues (a necessary evil) I am loving my Regen, and look forward to an Amber.

 

Missed the rhetorical part, apologies. I thought the question sounded obtuse, at best. No ill intent meant! You're right about turning the stack around for stability. And sorry again, I'm not an ace woodworker so this is my hack attempt. Want something metal or ceramic machined to microns? I can do that. I'll gladly listen to more good suggestions from a pro! With this hack I can adjust to exactly the height needed given any setup, eh? Like others, my DAC is deep enough so that the REGEN is hanging over the rear support tube of the shelf so I don't have an even surface to work with. Slight complication.

 

As we've all experienced, internet communications can be rather ambiguous so we all should try to understand better and to choose our wording carefully.

 

Best,

Jay

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My apologies as well. I imagine that one would need to create a "shelf" if your dac hangs over the back. A piece of plywood just thinner than the height of the rear feet. Drill holes for the feet to penetrate, and the dac's weight ought to hold it. Not very elegant, but some judicious trimming and a can of black lacquer would go a long way.

Missed the rhetorical part, apologies. I thought the question sounded obtuse, at best. No ill intent meant! You're right about turning the stack around for stability. And sorry again, I'm not an ace woodworker so this is my hack attempt. Want something metal or ceramic machined to microns? I can do that. I'll gladly listen to more good suggestions from a pro! With this hack I can adjust to exactly the height needed given any setup, eh? Like others, my DAC is deep enough so that the REGEN is hanging over the rear support tube of the shelf so I don't have an even surface to work with. Slight complication.

 

As we've all experienced, internet communications can be rather ambiguous so we all should try to understand better and to choose our wording carefully.

 

Best,

Jay

Forrest:

Win10 i9 9900KS/GTX1060 HQPlayer4>Win10 NAA

DSD>Pavel's DSC2.6>Bent Audio TAP>

Parasound JC1>"Naked" Quad ESL63/Tannoy PS350B subs<100Hz

Link to comment

I like small, light, simple. With the Regen, this is helped by the fact there's a slight ridge where the endplates are fastened to the body of the case. Here are photos showing the piece of cardboard I cut out, but one could easily make something more elegant-looking and adjustable, yet still very light and simple, from plastic (for example, using a 3D printer, hint hint ;) ). Small rubber or rubbery ends for such a support, a not terribly sticky adhesive such as is used in Post-It notes (at least at the Regen end), or a cutout to allow the Regen to fit through the support (as I recall one of the designs posted here a few weeks ago showed) might hold things more securely.

 

IMG_0806.jpg

IMG_0808.JPG

IMG_0807.JPG

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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To support the REGEN I use four thicknesses of Vibraphone discs I had lying around, between the REGEN and the shelf on which the DAC sits. Fits snugly, and the resilience of the Vibraphone keeps it from sliding around (and may even provide some vibration control). Simple and effective, but one needs to have room on the shelf to use anything similar to this.

For my system details, please see my profile. Thank you.

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I like small, light, simple. With the Regen, this is helped by the fact there's a slight ridge where the endplates are fastened to the body of the case. Here are photos showing the piece of cardboard I cut out, but one could easily make something more elegant-looking and adjustable, yet still very light and simple, from plastic (for example, using a 3D printer, hint hint ;) ). Small rubber or rubbery ends for such a support, a not terribly sticky adhesive such as is used in Post-It notes (at least at the Regen end), or a cutout to allow the Regen to fit through the support (as I recall one of the designs posted here a few weeks ago showed) might hold things more securely.

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]18625[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]18626[/ATTACH] [ATTACH=CONFIG]18627[/ATTACH]

 

Why not tape the USB cable to the back wall and that will take the stress off. You can use transparent packing tape and do it below the line of sight (push the cable up higher than normal).

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Why not tape the USB cable to the back wall and that will take the stress off. You can use transparent packing tape and do it below the line of sight (push the cable up higher than normal).

 

It might work for some people. For me it wouldn't for a few reasons:

 

- Packing tape leaves adhesive on the painted surface. Painter's tape doesn't, but doesn't hold terribly well.

 

- When the Amber arrives, I'll very likely switch back to the Mapleshade, which weighs nearly nothing, and which I wouldn't want to subject to tape. Besides, it's not long enough to run from the computer to the wall, then to the DAC.

 

But thank you on behalf of anyone for whom this is a good solution.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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FYI:

All REGENs available for shipment to clients in June have been pre-sold.

The web ordering page and automatic confirmation notices have just been changed to inform that new orders (as of 4:00 p.m. Pacific time, May 17th) will be shipped in early-July. I will update everywhere once a more exact July schedule is known.

 

Once again, as of now, ALL orders already placed will ship in JUNE. Only new orders from this moment forward are for July.

 

Thanks everyone!

--Alex C.

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