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Which of these upgrades should I make to my system?


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Hierge,

 

Please, please, do not continue arguing about DBT's here. They have been discussed ad nausuem, till the cows come home, and then disgustingly, even more. They have been the cause of a number of members being banned, and of countless threads going down the toilet :(

 

Some people here believe in DBT's explicity. Some think they are OK when done by pro's. Some don't care for them at all. We pretty much know who thinks what, and nobody is going to change anyones mind from arguing in this thread. So, continued discussion can only come to grief :(

 

If you feel you must discuss them, start your own thread, but his one is about a totally different subject. OK ?

 

Thanks for your cooperation.

 

Amigo, I didn't engage in any personal attacks like the guy who jumped on me. So, you can play thread cop if you want and I will stop expressing opinions you want to shut down. Clearly this is a sore spot, but consider that I was responding to someone else. You jumped into this on your own and are expressing some sort of unwritten custom or rule.

 

I'll remind you that the gist of this thread if you go back and reread is the OP wants to weed out real sound improvements and spend his resources on them. This devolved into people making all kinds of recommends to him.

 

You only jump in on this when the dreaded DBT issue is brought up IN THE CONTEXT of a person asking for help deciding what to invest in and what not to invest in. So, I'm not sure that what you are saying is appropriate.

 

I don't care what anyone thinks of DBT, but in the context of this thread it makes sense to bring it up. If you were wanting good advice on how to spend your money, would you want to hear opinions exclusively from people who tweak systems and be EXCLUDED from opinions on DBT?

 

How would I know that there's a custom or a rule that nobody is allowed to discuss DBT and only tweakers are allowed to comment on threads? I'm going to drop the issue and won't bring it up again, but you have to admit that I'm right about the context of this thread allowing me to make the point to the OP. He is my only audience not people like you.

 

I've never heard of DBT being an issue on a forum that has led to people being banned. That sounds like censorship. I won't bring it up again. The guy asked and I was honestly trying to help him until I was personally attacked.

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I've never heard of DBT being an issue on a forum that has led to people being banned. That sounds like censorship. I won't bring it up again.

 

Hierge,

 

Maybe that is because you are a very recent newbie here, and aren't aware of the some of the troubles this CA community has been through.

 

Not censorship, AT ALL. The problem is that some people have trouble containing their worse natures, and it is the nasty posting behavior that is the problem, not the content of the ideas. It was their over-the-line bad behavior that got them banned, not the ideas they expressed.

 

Did you notice that I did NOT impune, attack, or 'diss, your character, OR your ideas. Only informed you that you were venturing into an area that can easily get out of control, and asked you politely to cease. Your response felt something like a counter attack, which is unnecessary. Most folks here are not writing 'attacking' posts, but they are often perceived that way. This is an international forum and language skills vary considerably. Also being a very 'geeky' subject area, interpersonal skills also vary :)

 

If you give CA folks the benefit of the doubt, cut them some slack, and don't react defensively, you can get along quite well, I bet :)

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Im a noob on this forum so I dont want to get involved in flame wars, but it sounds to me like this DBT info is relevant to me in terms of where I should, and should not, be spending my hard earned (and quite limited...) funds.

 

Thanks for the reply mistersprinkles.

 

Let me try and back out of this. My first recommend to you was a Supra USB cable. It was a tweak recommend. That's based purely on my own opinion and a reference to GR and JS who are posters on this forum and DAC experts. Then you mentioned in another post if I remember that you had some good interconnects. I actually recommended if you are going that route that Supra seems like a good company on that front too. I doubled down on the Supra Cable and then asked you about the foam isolation pads you bought because I'm interested in them. These are all tweaks. Then I wanted to reiterate the other side of the argument so I didn't appear to be biased towards tweeks. Then I crossed the line. Somebody felt that I had slighted the tweak community. I did mention "lamp cord" which is probably the equivalent of yelling a certain word in Baltimore these days. It was not what I intended. I actually posted a report about an hour ago that supports testing showing how well constructed cables are demonstrably better. I use good ten gage wire with tons of strands. Got it free from a buddy who bought expensive silver speaker wire. I didn't get in his face about it. If you are spending five grand on speakers why not connect them with good wire on the chance that it may make it better... I made the same comment about the Supra USB cable. I tried it and it really made a huge difference on my really cheap DAC. It helped a lot on my Modi too. I don't have much money right now so I'm there with you. I also respect the fact that you love your speakers which were made in your hometown. I actually have been researching them for my own system eventually and will try to get a demo if I can sometime. That's what I consider to be a responsible thread participant. Other people suggested ditching your speakers etc. I didn't do that. I've never heard them. How can I tell you my speakers would be better? Speakers are NOT a tweak. I think that there are many analog components that are tweaks that you may or may not want to spend Canadian dollars on. Just be aware that people I've seen on CA are very passionate about their opinions and are genius tweakers along the lines of Nikola Tesla. That doesn't mean Tesla believed in things that are not demonstrable in real world testing. He believed that Edison was an idiot for trying hundreds of ways to do something. He believed in mathematics.

 

Here's a parable from a Youtube video I watched on opamps. A lot of people were switching them out on guitar pedals and other applications. People do it to computer audio boards commonly. There's a whole industry devoted to the art of picking opamps. The moderator of the event which was to demonstrate on listening tests to the audience that there are no differences, contacted the actual Japanese chip designer and got a translator. The chip designer was really taken aback that anyone would think they could audibly hear a difference in an opamp. Saying something like this can get you banned on CA. I would tell you what I believe to be the truth.

 

People don't want to appear like they've wasted their money. That's human nature. I just feel like you deserve the other side too. Decide for yourself if you think double blind tests are valid. They really upset cable manufacturers and affect real sales. If you have the money, spend it on speakers in my opinion. You have great speakers you love so now you need to know about cables etc. You are getting good advice from many people who care.

 

I have been an audio enthusiast for over 40 years and worked for one of the premier audio stores of it's time. I've heard more vintage equipment than I care to remember. I'm not an expert on computer audio, but I am sharing my limited knowledge and experiences with you. I am starting at the bottom.

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Wow Hierge thanks for that detailed post. I have ordered the Supra USB cable and also the higher quality analog interconnects and it should all be here within about a week. I will report back on my findings.

 

And yes I do like my speakers, even though nobody has ever heard of them because they are a local company.

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Wow Hierge thanks for that detailed post. I have ordered the Supra USB cable and also the higher quality analog interconnects and it should all be here within about a week. I will report back on my findings.

 

And yes I do like my speakers, even though nobody has ever heard of them because they are a local company.

 

You're welcome. I appreciate the give and take on this forum. I really intend to investigate your speakers and the isolation pads you bought. You are making good decisions and when you get more money I'm sure you will make even more informed decisions than you do now. I don't have a fancy system. I just want to enjoy music. The brilliant people here are pushing the cutting edge and just want to share that with you to help you. I've gotten a great deal of help out of the goodness of people's hearts already in the brief time I've been posting.

 

My next excursions are likely to be on a good Schiit headphone amp, a used set of primo speakers or new ones like you have, some isolation pads for speakers, attempted biamping of my main speakers (PSB Stratus Goldi's) and when I hit the lottery new ten thousand dollar speakers with amps I cannot lift. Then I will get ten DACs and five sets of top of the line headphones. I will fly in an expert to assemble the entire setup in my mansion. I will have a listening room with all the speakers I collect. I will have a home theater with leather seats and a wine room connected.

 

Until then I will read CA and interact with friendly people like you. Cheers!

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I know what you mean about wanting expensive gear. I want a pair of Bowers & Wilkins 800 Diamond speakers. IDK what they cost but if I had to guess I'd put it between 40,000-80,000 dollars per speaker.

 

There's just something about being able to tell friends who are already stunned by the sound quality that "Yes, the tweeters in my speakers are pure artificial diamond grown in a laboratory".

 

Those things must sound amazing...

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Hierge,

 

Maybe that is because you are a very recent newbie here, and aren't aware of the some of the troubles this CA community has been through.

 

Not censorship, AT ALL. The problem is that some people have trouble containing their worse natures, and it is the nasty posting behavior that is the problem, not the content of the ideas. It was their over-the-line bad behavior that got them banned, not the ideas they expressed.

 

Did you notice that I did NOT impune, attack, or 'diss, your character, OR your ideas. Only informed you that you were venturing into an area that can easily get out of control, and asked you politely to cease. Your response felt something like a counter attack, which is unnecessary. Most folks here are not writing 'attacking' posts, but they are often perceived that way. This is an international forum and language skills vary considerably. Also being a very 'geeky' subject area, interpersonal skills also vary :)

:)

If you give CA folks the benefit of the doubt, cut them some slack, and don't react defensively, you can get along quite well, I bet

 

You put smiles on your post, but you are trying to bully me with condescension and hazing through smug comments about me being defensive and a new member. I've written tens of thousands of posts on dozens of forums for over twenty years and am quite aware of etiquette. I did nothing to garner you preaching to me about cutting slack and not acting defensively. If you are a CA moderator then tell me and I will apologize. If you are not a moderator, then kindly butt out or turn me in if you think I've done something wrong. You say you aren't impugning me and that you are politely asking me to cease. Again, if you are a moderator I deeply apologize and will self censor. If you aren't then... cut me some slack and try to get along with ME instead of lecturing me. :)

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You put smiles on your post, but you are trying to bully me with condescension and hazing through smug comments about me being defensive and a new member. I've written tens of thousands of posts on dozens of forums for over twenty years and am quite aware of etiquette. I did nothing to garner you preaching to me about cutting slack and not acting defensively. If you are a CA moderator then tell me and I will apologize. If you are not a moderator, then kindly butt out or turn me in if you think I've done something wrong. You say you aren't impugning me and that you are politely asking me to cease. Again, if you are a moderator I deeply apologize and will self censor. If you aren't then... cut me some slack and try to get along with ME instead of lecturing me. :)

 

Whoa. Daudio is politely, *not condescendingly*, trying to give you good factual information. Your angry reaction is uncalled for. mistersprinkles is liking your help, so let's concentrate on helping the OP instead of derailing the thread with flames.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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Whoa. Daudio is politely, *not condescendingly*, trying to give you good factual information. Your angry reaction is uncalled for. mistersprinkles is liking your help, so let's concentrate on helping the OP instead of derailing the thread with flames.

 

I disagree. Reread his posts.

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I disagree. Reread his posts.

 

I don't know, man. I think you're a cool guy Hierge but you really are sort of overreacting here. It's easy for people to misconstrue things on forums because text lacks any kind of tone or emotion. There are no facial expressions or hand gestures to help you understand what the person you are talking to REALLY means. So often, you have to guess. I don't think anybody else is interpreting the same persecution that you are in the other member's posts. I certainly am not. I think you're a great guy and you have given me helpful advice but honestly, I have seen far worse people say far worse things on far worse forums. Know what I mean? Often, when you are relatively new to a forum (3-4 months or less), you haven't really fully come to appreciate the sort of culture and mannerisms that are common to it. There are forums where people are 100% proper and there are forums where people say whatever they want (reddit for example). This one seems to be one of those more proper forums. As audiophiles tend to be educated, financially well off people (lower middle class Charlie isn't going to drop $10,000 on a pair of speakers), I think it is unlikely that the venom which you are seeing is truly there... as the more educated people in this world tend to stay away from flaming or trolling others. There are always exceptions to that rule, of course.

 

I could be wrong and I ask that you take into consideration that I like you, and I am trying to brighten your day here, and do take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

Cheers.

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I don't know, man. I think you're a cool guy Hierge but you really are sort of overreacting here. It's easy for people to misconstrue things on forums because text lacks any kind of tone or emotion. There are no facial expressions or hand gestures to help you understand what the person you are talking to REALLY means. So often, you have to guess. I don't think anybody else is interpreting the same persecution that you are in the other member's posts. I certainly am not. I think you're a great guy and you have given me helpful advice but honestly, I have seen far worse people say far worse things on far worse forums. Know what I mean? Often, when you are relatively new to a forum (3-4 months or less), you haven't really fully come to appreciate the sort of culture and mannerisms that are common to it. There are forums where people are 100% proper and there are forums where people say whatever they want (reddit for example). This one seems to be one of those more proper forums. As audiophiles tend to be educated, financially well off people (lower middle class Charlie isn't going to drop $10,000 on a pair of speakers), I think it is unlikely that the venom which you are seeing is truly there... as the more educated people in this world tend to stay away from flaming or trolling others. There are always exceptions to that rule, of course.

 

I could be wrong and I ask that you take into consideration that I like you, and I am trying to brighten your day here, and do take what I say with a grain of salt.

 

Cheers.

 

Noted. I think your instincts are right here. I am new to this forum, but somebody told me to "cease" talking about something he didn't like. I haven't been banned or accused of causing trouble on other threads on DBT or any other topic. The self appointed "moderator" just assumes that I must be cut off from heading down a dangerous path.

 

I get not wanting to devolve into a flame war. You are right. I have a lot to offer, but if I am called out then I will respond as long as it's still interesting. I am a good guy as you mention and have a platinum reputation on other listserves and forums. I'm a graybeard, however, and would never accept this type of treatment on another forum.

 

Perhaps it's etiquette here to take the negative comments and back off. The first guy who jumped at me told me that I "represented" myself as something different than I originally conveyed and that I needed to stop quoting questionable sources from the Internet. I responded by sending a link to a published report backing me. The second guy then jumps in and tells me that I need to "cease" talking about DBT. Then the third guy tells me the second guy was actually being polite. ???

 

What's the big deal about what I posted on double blind testing? Was it really worth all of this? Love and Peace everyone, it's just a forum.

 

Cheers by the way.

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Noted. I think your instincts are right here. I am new to this forum, but somebody told me to "cease" talking about something he didn't like. I haven't been banned or accused of causing trouble on other threads on DBT or any other topic. The self appointed "moderator" just assumes that I must be cut off from heading down a dangerous path.

 

I get not wanting to devolve into a flame war. You are right. I have a lot to offer, but if I am called out then I will respond as long as it's still interesting. I am a good guy as you mention and have a platinum reputation on other listserves and forums. I'm a graybeard, however, and would never accept this type of treatment on another forum.

 

Perhaps it's etiquette here to take the negative comments and back off. The first guy who jumped at me told me that I "represented" myself as something different than I originally conveyed and that I needed to stop quoting questionable sources from the Internet. I responded by sending a link to a published report backing me. The second guy then jumps in and tells me that I need to "cease" talking about DBT. Then the third guy tells me the second guy was actually being polite. ???

 

What's the big deal about what I posted on double blind testing? Was it really worth all of this? Love and Peace everyone, it's just a forum.

 

Cheers by the way.

 

No, it was certainly not worth getting into all this simply because of your comments on DBT. I certainly found it helpful and I'm sure that some lurkers or fellow noobs found it useful too. The thing is, that on any forum, there are points of contention. There are topics that have been beaten to death and have caused flame wars 100 times in the past, and people on those forums simply don't wish to see another flame war develop. I agree with you regarding your views on self appointed mods. They bother me too. I think you were just being helpful and you didn't deserve any of this. Bottom line though, you can't win, and neither can I. We are late comers to a forum with an established hierarchy, established points of contention, and an established culture. We may not agree with the general way that the forum is run, or what is ok to say and what is not, but at the end of the day, we came to the party too late to try to change the rules.

 

Peace and love

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I know what you mean about wanting expensive gear. I want a pair of Bowers & Wilkins 800 Diamond speakers. IDK what they cost but if I had to guess I'd put it between 40,000-80,000 dollars per speaker.

 

There's just something about being able to tell friends who are already stunned by the sound quality that "Yes, the tweeters in my speakers are pure artificial diamond grown in a laboratory".

 

Those things must sound amazing...

 

They are approx. $24K/pair. I've heard them. They are nice, but they don't sound 12x better than my $2K B&W's.

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No, it was certainly not worth getting into all this simply because of your comments on DBT. I certainly found it helpful and I'm sure that some lurkers or fellow noobs found it useful too. The thing is, that on any forum, there are points of contention. There are topics that have been beaten to death and have caused flame wars 100 times in the past, and people on those forums simply don't wish to see another flame war develop. I agree with you regarding your views on self appointed mods. They bother me too. I think you were just being helpful and you didn't deserve any of this. Bottom line though, you can't win, and neither can I. We are late comers to a forum with an established hierarchy, established points of contention, and an established culture. We may not agree with the general way that the forum is run, or what is ok to say and what is not, but at the end of the day, we came to the party too late to try to change the rules.

 

Peace and love

 

As Daudio tried to explain, DBT isn't a forbidden topic. I have a thread touching on it myself that I need to write a new post for.

 

What he was trying to say is that we've found from long, sad experience DBT is a topic best handled with great respect for its potential to start long bitter arguments. Some of the things Hierge has said sound different to him, like USB cables, have been the subject matter of these "I hear a difference!"/"DBT proves you can't!" slugfests. So our hard won wisdom counsels that we ought to approach such remarks with enough respect for the ears and intelligence of our friends here to say what is in our minds rather than telling others what they hear: "Everything I've read about actual tests that have been performed and all the testing I've done convince me X does not make a difference," rather than "DBT proves X cannot possibly make a difference (and therefore, expressly or by implication, anyone who says different is hearing things)."

 

You weren't being jumped on or warned to watch yourself. You were having the favor done for you of someone with experience telling you how to speak your mind without unintentionally provoking a reaction you'd be unprepared for but we could see coming a mile away.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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mistersprinkles, one very helpful thing that has come out of discussions of DBT is the necessity to very carefully equalize volume between two things you're comparing. Otherwise the louder one will inevitably sound better, *especially* if the difference is relatively small so you aren't alerted to it.

 

I use an iPhone app called AudioTools. Others may have other suggestions.

One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein

Computer, Audirvana -> optical Ethernet to Fitlet3 -> Fibbr Alpha Optical USB -> iFi NEO iDSD DAC -> Apollon Audio 1ET400A Mini (Purifi based) -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

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mistersprinkles, one very helpful thing that has come out of discussions of DBT is the necessity to very carefully equalize volume between two things you're comparing. Otherwise the louder one will inevitably sound better, *especially* if the difference is relatively small so you aren't alerted to it.

 

I use an iPhone app called AudioTools. Others may have other suggestions.

 

Thanks I'll check it out.

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... I am new to this forum, but somebody told me to "cease" talking about something he didn't like. I haven't been banned or accused of causing trouble on other threads on DBT or any other topic. The self appointed "moderator" just assumes that I must be cut off from heading down a dangerous path.

 

Perhaps it's etiquette here to take the negative comments and back off. The first guy who jumped at me... The second guy then jumps in and tells me that I need to "cease" talking about DBT. Then the third guy tells me the second guy was actually being polite. ???

 

Heirge,

 

Daudio: "Please, please, do not continue arguing about DBT's here"

 

First, please get your facts straight ! I did NOT order you to "cease talking", I ASKED you to stop arguing, and explained why !

 

There is a big difference between the two, and you seem to have jumped to a conclusion that you were attacked, when you were just warned. Politely. Don't confuse me with the 'first guy'. There is no need for a chip-on-the-shoulder attitude on this. Nobody wins.

 

No, I am not a moderator in this forum. There are none. Only Chris C., the founder and chief cook, has the power to ban users or delete posts and threads. I just care about the CA community. If I try to steer the discussion away from known trouble, why should that bother you ?

 

 

I get not wanting to devolve into a flame war. You are right. I have a lot to offer, but if I am called out then I will respond as long as it's still interesting. I am a good guy as you mention and have a platinum reputation on other listserves and forums. I'm a graybeard, however, and would never accept this type of treatment on another forum.

 

I would think that graybeard 'platinum reputation' would be based on respect for other forum members, and not going out of ones way to be contentious.

 

OTOH, it might be fun to watch you "never accept this type of treatment" with some of the Danes on this forum :)

 

 

What's the big deal about what I posted on double blind testing? Was it really worth all of this? Love and Peace everyone, it's just a forum.

 

We told you. The entire subject is emotionly charged amoung the people here. And, from bitter experience, best left alone.

 

And, really !! a 17 year old Stereo Review article ??? Ha ! You'd have to do a lot better then that to survive in a CA DBT slugfest :)

 

Peace and Love

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mistersprinkles, one very helpful thing that has come out of discussions of DBT is the necessity to very carefully equalize volume between two things you're comparing. Otherwise the louder one will inevitably sound better, *especially* if the difference is relatively small so you aren't alerted to it.

 

I use an iPhone app called AudioTools. Others may have other suggestions.

 

+1

 

Good advice

 

In fact it can be even worse or more complex than that. A hot (loudness war) mastered album can sound subjectively better at lower volume on crappy systems (like a car) than a fantastic home system (at the same low volume). Great setups sound amazing at realistic volumes (quite loud) when playing well mastered (unclipped) material with large dynamic range. A loudness war Metallica Death Magnetic or RHCP album will sound awfully harsh when played at loud levels on a great system because the good system will just give you unflinchingly and untamed ALL the horrid distortion that is actually there on the source. It is a real minefield out there....

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I never represented myself as a HiFi Beginner as you state. I said I am new to Computer Audio which is something different. I started working for Myer-Emco the famous audio store in Washington DC in 1977 when I was in high school. By the contentious tone you are using, I'm sure you have little interest in my journey and sound a little defensive. I've read a lot on this. The basis for the lamp cord in my comments is well discussed territory and is not really contentious unless you are a purveyor of non double blind tests. I base the lamp cord on the following article from 1998 from Stereo Review. Argue with someone else if that's what your deal is. http://www.nousaine.com/pdfs/To%20Tweak%20or%20Not.pdf

 

My apologies for referring to you as a 'HiFi Beginner' - you are clearly not! The OP has an active pair of speakers, and whether or not lamp cord is a good idea is off topic anyhow, and not really going to help him much..

System (i): Stack Audio Link > 2Qute+MCRU psu; Gyrodec/SME V/Hana SL/EAT E-Glo Petit/Magnum Dynalab FT101A) > PrimaLuna Evo 100 amp > Klipsch RP-600M/REL T5x subs

System (ii): Allo USB Signature > Bel Canto uLink+AQVOX psu > Chord Hugo > APPJ EL34 > Tandy LX5/REL Tzero v3 subs

System (iii) KEF LS50W/KEF R400b subs

 

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Im a noob on this forum so I dont want to get involved in flame wars, but it sounds to me like this DBT info is relevant to me in terms of where I should, and should not, be spending my hard earned (and quite limited...) funds.

 

Oh, it *is*, but you can find just about every possible argument or point with a simple search on the system. It is really an *old* discussion.

 

What it comes down to is simple. If you are comfortable without doing a blind test of some sort, then that is cool. You will almost certainly have developed skills and abilities that allow you to make good judgements doing so.

 

If you are uncomfortable without doing a blind test of some sort, then by all means, do one. You probably have a different set of skills and part of your evaluation methodology involves such testing.

 

In simple fact, you can arrive at correct conclusions using either method, or any combination that pleases you of both methods. ;)

 

-Paul

Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never dealt with a cat DAC.

Robert A. Heinlein

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My apologies for referring to you as a 'HiFi Beginner' - you are clearly not! The OP has an active pair of speakers, and whether or not lamp cord is a good idea is off topic anyhow, and not really going to help him much..

 

No worries. You're right about self powered speakers and his needs. It was off topic in that respect.

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you were just warned. Politely. Don't confuse me with the 'first guy'. There is no need for a chip-on-the-shoulder attitude on this.

 

Daudio, you just can't help yourself. I think you are way worse than the first guy. He at least apologized. Who appointed you the role of warning anyone? If anything you need to be warned. On my other thread about this which you inspired, read the post calling you "way out of line" trying to moderate this discussion.

 

No, I am not a moderator in this forum. There are none. Only Chris C., the founder and chief cook, has the power to ban users or delete posts and threads. I just care about the CA community. If I try to steer the discussion away from known trouble, why should that bother you ?

 

You're darn right you are not a moderator. I have been a moderator on an NFL forum in the past and it's a tedious job. Moderators are usually tired and seldom, if ever, condescend in responses.

 

On what planet do you live that you'd think it shouldn't bother me that I am being "warned" to "cease" anything? Especially when you are not even a senior member... I have a "warning" for you: stay out of the phony moderation business. Especially with people who are on an equal or better intelligence level than you.

 

I would think that graybeard 'platinum reputation' would be based on respect for other forum members, and not going out of ones way to be contentious.

 

Gee more sarcasm... I am just going out of my way with you because of comments like this.

 

You talk about "we" as though you are speaking for others on the forum, but go check the general discussion thread on this I started to find out if you are blowing smoke or there really are taboo issues on this forum. You aren't getting much sympathy from people who have seen this thread.

 

OTOH, it might be fun to watch you "never accept this type of treatment" with some of the Danes on this forum :)

 

I'm looking forward to it. They have to be more interesting than you. Are they going to pretend to be moderators too or should I just PM you so you can jump in and police the thread?

 

We told you. The entire subject is emotionly charged amoung the people here. And, from bitter experience, best left alone.

 

Oooh. That sounds so ominous... I just don't know what I'll do if somebody gets "emotionally charged." You mean they might actually be "bitter"? Oh God...

 

And, really !! a 17 year old Stereo Review article ??? Ha ! You'd have to do a lot better then that to survive in a CA DBT slugfest :)

 

Oh no! A CA DBT Slugfest??? Please help me. I might have to hide under the bed. The HUMANITY. I'd better renew my Lexis Nexis subscription so I don't get schooled like this again. Boy you really put me in my place.

 

Peace and Love

 

Aren't you sweet. Sarcasm right back at you too "Mr. Moderator." I will be sure and address you as such in the future. Should I call you when somebody is "emotionally charged" ? There's a great thread on the general forum on Climate Change and it's getting uglier by the minute. You'd better hurry and warn them before somebody gets "bitter."

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Daudio, ... you are way worse ... you need to be warned... "way out of line"..., condescend in responses... better intelligence level than you... blah, blah, blah...

 

All this Strom und Drang is ridiculous, and based on a lie.

 

I asked you to stop arguing about DBT's, and explained why. That's it. You could have just said OK, or No.

 

Instead I'm accused of demanding complience, and threating consequences. That's bullshit ! I Did Not Say Anything Like That. Ever.

 

Then the overreaction, the snide comments, spreading the lie, embellishing it, and enlisting 'me-too's. Now this unabashed personal attack :(

 

It's nothing more then... childish online bullying !

 

I have been a moderator on an NFL forum

 

That could explain your inappropriately agressive behavior here (and one wonders why you would take such a job?).

 

No matter. Based on what your postings have shown me, you're just a Mid Fi Guy, and aren't likely to contribute anything I'd be interested in, and not much of a human being either, at least, not online

 

You know newbie, you are late to this party, and it's been going on a long time with out you, and it'll do just fine after you're gone. Older members, like me, have seen lots of people like you, come, flame out, and go.

 

So its time for me to stop feeding the trolls by simply putting you on:

 

My Ignore list.

 

Bye :))

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