How do you store DFF ( untagged ) files?

[Miska]

If Miska's DFF2DSF doesn't address the click issue, then my ISO2DSF brings no advantage over Sonore ISO2DSD.

 

At least we verified before, that sacd_extract was truncating track tails when writing DSF files, and this new solution fixes that part. If there is another problem, then that may need separate treatment, but at least now there's one problem less...

 

(people originally noticed that because there was a piece of sound missing when going from adjacent track to another if there was no silent period at that point)

[bogi]

Thanks Miska for information. So this 'DSF truncating error' in sacd_extract is relevant for DSD (not compressed) content.

[Miska]

Thanks Miska for information. So this 'DSF truncating error' in sacd_extract is relevant for DSD (not compressed) content.

 

Yes... It is purely about how it handles DSF file format. It can correctly write same content to DFF and thus the need for ISO->DFF->DSF route.

 

If there is a bug related to DST compression somewhere, then it's another issue. But I'm not sure I managed grasp the exact case when the files tick or don't tick in Ted's setup...

[paul3000h]

Bogi,

........ Maybe Paul's comments about clicks in DFF was because maybe he didn't use the -c argument (i.e didn't check the box in Jesus's GUI).

 

I do check the box so no tick in my Moffo DFF's.

 

The ticks I found in DFF's were DFF's I downloaded from 2L The Nordic Sound.

[paul3000h]

Miska and Bogi and Ted I sent a private message with a download link for some Moffo files in case you want to test re my various comments regarding them. I am not techie enough to do complicated tests.

[ted_b]

I am sorry my multiple posts have not gotten any of this across.

 

The ticks in DFF occur when I extracted some ISOs (which were tickless, of course) and did not use the -c argument (i.e I did not check the box in Jesus's GUI or did not use the -c argument in command line). Maybe these ticks were then caused by the player (JRiver 20) or DACs (checked with both exaSound and Mytek in my home office) not liking DFF with DST compression, don't know!!

 

Then I said: since there are ticks in this DFF example, it is silly to use Miska's converter for these because Miska's converter is not intended to make ticks go away, it is intended to take tickless DFF and convert it to tickless DSF (that is then available for tagging). My example was not tickless DFF. Period!

 

Now....why the ticks in DFF? I don't know. Clearly they are related to DST, cuz when you use the -c argument (decompress any DST) on the same ISOs the DFF tracks have no ticks! Could be player, or maybe DAC (both my home office DACs are SABRE-based so possibly similar goings on internally). I will try with a couple others that are in my main room, like Hugo or Directstream.

 

I want to add one more variable. ISOs. I chose the Laura St Vincent Vivaldi ISO because the track transitions had no audible ticks in the ISO. However, I have listened to several random ISOs (I have thousands) and I can easily find several of them where there is a tick in the track transitions....and these are ISOs! There has been no extraction per se, except by the player (JRiver) internally. Yet the player likes many of my ISOs and some it does not. ? I assume this is due to authoring issues, but I am over my head here. Clearly DST presence is not a variable in these ISO examples cuz even some ISOs that are authored with DST (like Laura St Vincent- Vivaldi and most other multichannel ISOs, frankly) are fine with track transitions, and the tick only occurs if one were to extract them in either the faulty DSF mode or, as mentioned above, extract them in DFF without the -c argument. So I am stumped here.

 

Miska and Bogi, if you use Google Drive I can send you a ticking ISO and a tickless one to evaluate yourself. It would be educational and maybe progress would be made somewhere.

[bogi]

Ted, thanks for you explanation.

 

the tick only occurs if one were to extract them in either the faulty DSF mode or, as mentioned above, extract them in DFF without the -c argument.

 

IMO the 'DFF DST' issue is related to player software and not to DAC. Why? My understanding is, that DSD capable DACs know nothing about DST, they require DSD stream. If DST was not decompressed to DSD before playback, players like Foobar2000 or JRiver do on the fly decompression and send DSD stream to DAC. So we have 2 cases:

a) offline decompression for example using -c switch of sacd_extract ... no clicks

b) on the fly decompression in audio player, you can observe it by higher computer load ... you detected clicks

Therefore I think it is an issue in the DSD component within audio player.

I am using Google Drive, I will send you PM. It could be helpful for future comparisons to have 2 such ISOs as you suggested.

[paul3000h]

Good summary thanks Ted. In my setup, Foobar and exaSound e20 DAC, I get no ticks using/playing iso's DST or DSD

[ted_b]

I have a full Foobar setup too, and with the same example ISO (Kunzel - Nutcracker Selections, Telarc) it responds the same as JRIver, with a slight tick at the beginning of most if not all tracks. exaSound e28 with all the foobar plugins/components needed to play ISOs in DSD (ASIoproxy, foo-out-asio, foo-input-sacd, etc).

[bogi]

paul3000h, I found new version of Foobar2000 Super Audio CD Decoder | SourceForge.net, here is changelog for 2014:

 

09/29/14:

Version 0.7.3 - DSDIFF odd chunk length bug fixed, Windows XP compatibility.

 

If you didn't update it last month in your Foobar2000 instalation, could you please test, if it addresses the DFF issue you discovered?

[ted_b]

Mine is newest decoder version.

[bogi]

New ISO2DSF version 1.2.0 is available here https://docs.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0B1IZPbDClIn6bTV4bEVrU1JuWHM

 

Please do not forget to update dff2dsf.exe from Miska to version 1.2.1 (or later), otherwise tagging will not function.

 

Changes are:

- added automated tagging of DSF files

- removed TXT file generation for MP3TAG + removed cfg file parameter $create_TXT_for_MP3TAG

- added possibility to preserve DFF files + added cfg file parameter $preserveDFF

- CUE sheet generation: added handling of special characters in FILE references, added album title

- allowed double quotes as part of album or track title

- allowed ,;() characters in album folder and track filenames

- corrected “Press any key to exit” to “Press <Enter> to exit”

[ted_b]

Works great, tagging and all! Thanks!

[paul3000h]

paul3000h, I found new version of Foobar2000 Super Audio CD Decoder | SourceForge.net, here is changelog for 2014:

 

09/29/14:

Version 0.7.3 - DSDIFF odd chunk length bug fixed, Windows XP compatibility.

 

If you didn't update it last month in your Foobar2000 instalation, could you please test, if it addresses the DFF issue you discovered?

 

I did not find any difference, clicks same as before.

[bogi]

New version of ISO2DSF v1.2.1 contains the following changes against v1.2.0:

- corrected support for double quotes in album and track titles and performers

- added support for ID3v2 frames: DATE, GENRE, ISRC (if found in SACD ISO metadata)

- added Catalog Number as COMMENT ID3v2 frame (if found in SACD ISO metadata)

 

 

Download: https://docs.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0B1IZPbDClIn6SWxTXzQxYlBhQ2M

[bogi]

New version ISO2DSF v1.2.2 contains the following changes:

 

 

• Added support for language specific characters in metadata. ID3v2 tags are now coded in Unicode.
  
• Improved readability of created album folder name and DSF track file names, if they contain language specific characters.
  
• Improved displaying language specific characters in the Command Prompt window.
  
• Only standard ASCII characters are now allowed in the path to iso2dsf.exe and the path to ISO file. This handling was added, because sacd_extract doesn't support non-ascii characters in ISO path.
  

 

 

Download: https://docs.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0B1IZPbDClIn6dW9nNVNiRjNNT1k

[seatrope]

Hi Bogi!

 

Thanks for the update - it seems to have solved the problem in Metadata. The file names are now with the traditional english rendering of the umlauts, e.g. oe for o umlaut, which is great. Thanks so much!!!

 

Yeang

[Esprit]

Can be this a solution for Apple users?

TraX for Mac | MacUpdate

[ironmine]

New version ISO2DSF v1.2.2 contains the following changes:

 

Hello Bogi!

 

Can you please add ISO2DST feature to your program?

 

I prefer to keep my SACD as DST files and play them using the Super Audio CD decoder (Foobar component) because:

 

1) It preserves the original DSD audio (in case I buy a DSD DAC in future);

2) DST makes the smallest file size, even when compared to PCM 24/88.

3) It allows me, during the playback, to uncompress the DST audio files "on the fly" into a PCM format higher than 24/88 (e.g., 24/176 or 24/352) without needing to store such large PCM files.

4) It allows me to keep up with the latest versions of the Super Audio CD decoder.

[gumby]

New version ISO2DSF v1.2.2 contains the following changes

 

I couple suggestions, or possibly questions.

 

1) It appear you can batch extract files from more than one ISO by highlighting several files and right clicking to execute the "SACD ISO to DSF per track" command. The conversions run in parallel. It seems that it might be better to execute these in series. It probably takes about the same amount of time, but doing more than 3 or 4 at once is quite a computational chore, at least for MCH extractions and particularly for the conversion step to DSF. Generally, if I run a batch using the Mr. Wicked original tool, I start them and leave and come back later anyway. Running them in series is going to allow (I think) a larger batch to get done.

 

2) Is it possible to set up (edit) the config file to extract both the stereo and MCH files with one command (possibly in series) and dump the extracted files in two separate folders. I tried removing the # from in front of both channel commands and it did the stereo and quit. So, currently, it appears the config file needs to be edited every time in order to switch back and forth between the Stereo and MCH conversion.

[bogi]

ISO2DSF 'right click mode' is not intended to be run for more ISO files in parallel.

 

ISO2DSF can be run in non interactive command line mode and that's the intended way how you can run it for list of ISO files. Create your list of ISO files (with full pathname) and run ISO2DSF as batch for these files. You can find command line syntax in the manual.

 

In one pass you can process stereo content extraction. Then change your cfg file and in 2nd pass you can do multichannel content extraction. You can prepare 2 cfg files and switch between them using simple rename commands, if you wish. To avoid overwriting extracted stereo content with multichannel content, you can move your ISO files for example to a subdirectory of the original location. All can be done automated.

 

ISO2DSF is free software, I wrote it primarily for myself and shared my result with others. Currently I don't have any need to change it's functionality. Anyone can create a tool, which will search for all ISO files within a directory tree and generate a batch script for automated SACD content extraction using ISO2DSF.

[bogi]

Hello Bogi!

 

Can you please add ISO2DST feature to your program?

 

I prefer to keep my SACD as DST files and play them using the Super Audio CD decoder (Foobar component) because:

 

1) It preserves the original DSD audio (in case I buy a DSD DAC in future);

2) DST makes the smallest file size, even when compared to PCM 24/88.

3) It allows me, during the playback, to uncompress the DST audio files "on the fly" into a PCM format higher than 24/88 (e.g., 24/176 or 24/352) without needing to store such large PCM files.

4) It allows me to keep up with the latest versions of the Super Audio CD decoder.

 

ISO2DSF was created with special intention to solve 'DSF click issue' of sacd_extract utility. That's the main reason why it exists.

 

It is not possible to create compressed DSF files with ISO2DSF, because the dff2dsf.exe conversion utility from Miska doesn't support compressed DFF files.

 

You can use Sonore ISO2DSD tool to convert SACD ISO files to compressed DFF files (in DST format) and to use them in Foobar2000. sacd_extract transfers metadata to DFF files and Foobar2000 can use them.

[Ron Party]

Hi Bogi.

 

I have been using ISO2DSF to convert ISOs in stereo mode by simply right clicking on the ISO file and selecting "open with". It has worked flawlessly for me.

 

I understand from your post it is possible to extract multichannel from IS0s, but I'm a newbie at this and do not understand how to change the cfg file. Is is possible that you could post a step by step primer, maybe called "Multichannel Extraction For Dummies" like me?

 

Or is it possible for you to just create another exe file for download that already is configured for multichannel extraction?

 

ISO2DSF 'right click mode' is not intended to be run for more ISO files in parallel.

 

ISO2DSF can be run in non interactive command line mode and that's the intended way how you can run it for list of ISO files. Create your list of ISO files (with full pathname) and run ISO2DSF as batch for these files. You can find command line syntax in the manual.

 

In one pass you can process stereo content extraction. Then change your cfg file and in 2nd pass you can do multichannel content extraction. You can prepare 2 cfg files and switch between them using simple rename commands, if you wish. To avoid overwriting extracted stereo content with multichannel content, you can move your ISO files for example to a subdirectory of the original location. All can be done automated.

 

ISO2DSF is free software, I wrote it primarily for myself and shared my result with others. Currently I don't have any need to change it's functionality. Anyone can create a tool, which will search for all ISO files within a directory tree and generate a batch script for automated SACD content extraction using ISO2DSF.

[ted_b]

Ron, it's in his PDF. Simply use notepad (text editor), go to the folder where the stuff is and open the config file (in notepad search window choose "all files" not "text files"). Find isodsf.cfg and open it

 

Change:

#$channel_mode = "multichannel";

$channel_mode = "stereo";

 

to

$channel_mode = "multichannel";

#$channel_mode = "stereo";

 

and save it.

 

To go back to stereo switch it back again.

[bogi]

Thanks, Ted.