Auralic Aries (Hardware) - Impressions and Information

[austinpop]

3 hours ago, Doak said:

I am NOT resampling and definitely DO have access to use the filters. 

Mine stays on Precise unless I need to Smooth something out.

 

Hi @Doak

 

This is only since the 5.0 beta, right? Or did you do this on prior releases?

 

If you did this on 4.1, where a web UI did not exist, can you pinpoint which parameter exactly you are referring to?

 

Until the Resampler engine came along in 5.0, I thought the Aries/Aries Mini passed through bits without any DSP or modification. The only Filter settings I'm aware of in 4.1 are in the Internal DAC section of the Mini, which only apply to the analog outputs of the Mini.

[austinpop]

If you guys want to discuss comparisons of endpoints, you might want to refer to 2 existing threads:

 

This one, started by @scan80269

and then this one started by moi:

 

[Doak]

34 minutes ago, austinpop said:

 

Hi @Doak

 

This is only since the 5.0 beta, right? Or did you do this on prior releases?

 

If you did this on 4.1, where a web UI did not exist, can you pinpoint which parameter exactly you are referring to?

 

Until the Resampler engine came along in 5.0, I thought the Aries/Aries Mini passed through bits without any DSP or modification. The only Filter settings I'm aware of in 4.1 are in the Internal DAC section of the Mini, which only apply to the analog outputs of the Mini.

Correct. all new in 5.0 beta.

[austinpop]

6 minutes ago, Doak said:

Correct. all new in 5.0 beta.

 

Here is what my screen shows:

 

 

So let's take a particular case - 96 kHz.

 

 

To me, this is saying perform no DSP, since the source and target sample rate are the same. In that case, I can't see how the filter setting would have any effect.

 

Can you clarify when you heard the difference between these settings, what sample rate was the input track, and what was the target setting?

 

If they're the same, then I'm with @pl_svn that is a BUG. No way should DSP kick in. Or - they need to provide a way to express the user intent of No DSP - I MEAN IT!

 

[Doak]

2 hours ago, austinpop said:

 

Here is what my screen shows:

 

 

So let's take a particular case - 96 kHz.

 

 

To me, this is saying perform no DSP, since the source and target sample rate are the same. In that case, I can't see how the filter setting would have any effect.

 

Can you clarify when you heard the difference between these settings, what sample rate was the input track, and what was the target setting?

 

If they're the same, then I'm with @pl_svn that is a BUG. No way should DSP kick in. Or - they need to provide a way to express the user intent of No DSP - I MEAN IT!

 

I am doing precisely as you illustrate and the filter settings remain available and operative.

Agree that this is a bug and should be reported as such.

[austinpop]

25 minutes ago, Doak said:

I am doing precisely as you illustrate and the filter settings remain available and operative.

Agree that this is a bug and should be reported as such.

 

Thanks for checking. I sent them a note - both to @Wang Xuanqian and their support email.

 

I will report back anything I learn.

[Doak]

1 minute ago, austinpop said:

 

Thanks for checking. I sent them a note - both to @Wang Xuanqian and their support email.

 

I will report back anything I learn.

Great! I sure hope they do the right thing and allow NO filtering/processing. Have been listening to DSD reference material on my Lampi and find myself reaching for the Smooth button, which kills the sweet, rich sound I LOVE so much about this DAC.  Now THIS is SERIOUS!

[Nebeljäger]

...has someone got a beta 2 update for mini?

[mikey8811]

I've tried the Smooth and Precise filters now.

 

In my system with an Aries Femto and USB output into a PS Audio Direcstream DAC, I preferred the Precise setting over the Smooth.

 

The files I played were standard redbook with no upsampling selected and there was a difference in sound so I guess the filter settings are applied even sans up(or down)sampling.

 

Precise like someone else said in an earlier post had better leading edge and transients. In my setup, it was also a fuller sound with more timbre all round and a killer bass which gave a kickass sound. I heard more sounds distinctly in the mix and there was better layering of instruments with a more 3D soundstage. Not much sibilance or harshness in the treble.

 

Smooth in comparison seemed weaker and less engaging but sweeter and more refined.

[austinpop]

Well, the plot thickens.

 

Here is what Wang responded to me with:

 

The filter mode inside Processor setting only effect resampling process, if the original sampling rate and destination sampling rate are the same, the resampling plug-in is bypassed and the output is bit-perfect (without any change).

[pl_svn]

honestly... I can't see why/how it could be otherwise

[austinpop]

Just now, pl_svn said:

honestly... I can't see why/how it could be otherwise

 

Moi aussi - me too!

[mikey8811]

49 minutes ago, austinpop said:

Well, the plot thickens.

 

Here is what Wang responded to me with:

 

The filter mode inside Processor setting only effect resampling process, if the original sampling rate and destination sampling rate are the same, the resampling plug-in is bypassed and the output is bit-perfect (without any change).

 

That may well be the case but I did hear a difference between the Precise and Smooth filter settings when playing un-upsampled redbook files.

 

I wonder why that is the case now if the filter settings only kick in with resampling.

 

The only other difference in setup from when I tested both filters is changing the wall outlet to which the distributor with the Aries, preamp and DAC are plugged in from a Maestro to a Furutech GTX D Gold. But I am sure when I last listened to the Smooth filter, I had just switched the outlets so this should not be a factor unless it takes time for a used outlet to settle in again.

[mikey8811]

Austinpop, are you still using the Aries?

 

Your signature shows you as having switched over to the SoTM SMS 200. If so, how does the sound differ?

 

 

[austinpop]

3 minutes ago, mikey8811 said:

Austinpop, are you still using the Aries?

 

Your signature shows you as having switched over to the SoTM SMS 200. If so, how does the sound differ?

 

 

 

Sharp eyes!

 

Yes, I am transitioning to the sMS-200, but I still have my Mini.  This came after an evaluation I did a couple months ago, that I wrote about at the link below. It also answers your question.

 

BTW - my Aries Mini, along with the accompanying Auralic LPS are going to be for sale soon!

[Doak]

14 minutes ago, mikey8811 said:

 

That may well be the case but I did hear a difference between the Precise and Smooth filter settings when playing un-upsampled redbook files.

 

I wonder why that is the case now if the filter settings only kick in with resampling.

 

The only other difference in setup from when I tested both filters is changing the wall outlet to which the distributor with the Aries, preamp and DAC are plugged in from a Maestro to a Furutech GTX D Gold. But I am sure when I last listened to the Smooth filter, I had just switched the outlets so this should not be a factor unless it takes time for a used outlet to settle in again.

????????

I can easily hear the difference in filters with NO oversampling being done.

As I mentioned in a previous post, I am not at all thrilled with DSD sound now through my Lampi and I've come to expect being thrilled by it. This morning I'd forgotten and left the Smooth filter and the sound was SO bland I heard it immediately and switched it to Precise. It was immediately better, though still not up to pre 5.) standards. 

 

[pl_svn]

18 minutes ago, Doak said:

not up to pre 5.) standards.

 

I'm sure there's still "a lot" to be fine-tuned in 5.0 betas playback: as I said I'm hearing light and intermittent "static noises" that go away as soon as I revert to 4.1.0 and come back when I install a beta again 

[Duke40]

2 hours ago, pl_svn said:

 

I'm sure there's still "a lot" to be fine-tuned in 5.0 betas playback: as I said I'm hearing light and intermittent "static noises" that go away as soon as I revert to 4.1.0 and come back when I install a beta again 

 

I also heard intermittent static noises with ver 5.02 beta,  though it was only when I upsampled, say 44.1 to 88.2, my experience so far.

[2string1]

On 4/15/2017 at 1:38 PM, pl_svn said:

 

they definitely do matter on s/pdif outs. not sure on USB as, given most (if not all modern) DACs use asynchronous mode, DAC's own clocks are the relevant ones

 

I guess, though, that everything matters and a cleaner incoming signal somehow helps

Interesting... does anyone else want to voice there thoughts?  If you buy a Vega can you go with the none femto Aries and get the same results as to a femto aries into a femto vega? Sorry for the dumb question,but how do you choose to upsampled a file with the Aries and Vega

[Duke40]

3 hours ago, austinpop said:

Well, the plot thickens.

 

Here is what Wang responded to me with:

 

The filter mode inside Processor setting only effect resampling process, if the original sampling rate and destination sampling rate are the same, the resampling plug-in is bypassed and the output is bit-perfect (without any change).

 

Like Doak and Mikey, I clearly hear the difference with the filter modes and I am not upsampling.

 

I think I am the only one so far who hears a difference with this setting;

"Processor Setup    -    PCM Auto detect"

My preference is Disabled.

 

I can hear this clearly using my Audeze LCD-X headphones, and they are certainly not detail monsters, more on the warm side of neutral.  My headphone rig (Auralic Aries Femto > Auralic Gemini 2000) is now completely isolated from AC with both components using VR MINI's, supplying the Gemini DAC/Headamp with supercapacitors made the bigger improvement, it is now easier/clearer to hear changes. Headphone Rig (Aries,Gemini,VR MINI's) is also isolated from vibration/resonance using Townshend Audio seismic pods.

Aries & Gemini are isolated from each other using Lifatec Glass Toslink cable (though I will very likely get a ISO Regen in a couple of months).

TLDR; My headphone rig is completely isolated from AC, Vibration, and the electronics from each other, think this is why it is now easier for me to hear changes.

[Duke40]

Sent the following to Auralic ...

 

My Aries Femto appears to be resetting some of it’s settings on Beta Firmware 5.02.

It appears this happens if I switch to using Airplay (from my Apple TV 4) to connect to the Aries, then go back to using Lightning DS on my iPad Pro.
I am trying to find the pattern for the settings resetting, this is appears to me to be the likely cause, could be something else, this is just my best guess so far.

The settings I notice that reset, that is I have them “Disabled", then after using Airplay, it goes back to “Enabled" ;
        Streamer Setup     -    Enable Volume Control
        Processor Setup    -    PCM Auto detect
        Processor Setup    -    Convert DSD to PCM

Also, I set the following setting to “Precise” as I prefer it, though it gets reset to “Smooth" 
        Processor Setup    -    Filter Mode

The above are the only 4 settings that I have changed, and they all seem to get reset after using Airplay.

[Doak]

2 minutes ago, Duke40 said:

 

Like Doak and Mikey, I clearly hear the difference with the filter modes and I am not upsampling.

 

I think I am the only one so far who hears a difference with this setting;

"Processor Setup    -    PCM Auto detect"

My preference is Disabled.

 

I

When PCM Auto Detect is enabled everything is upsampled to upper limit of the DAC being used.

I would expect this to make a difference in the sound.

[Doak]

2 minutes ago, Duke40 said:

Sent the following to Auralic ...

 

My Aries Femto appears to be resetting some of it’s settings on Beta Firmware 5.02.

It appears this happens if I switch to using Airplay (from my Apple TV 4) to connect to the Aries, then go back to using Lightning DS on my iPad Pro.
I am trying to find the pattern for the settings resetting, this is appears to me to be the likely cause, could be something else, this is just my best guess so far.

The settings I notice that reset, that is I have them “Disabled", then after using Airplay, it goes back to “Enabled" ;
        Streamer Setup     -    Enable Volume Control
        Processor Setup    -    PCM Auto detect
        Processor Setup    -    Convert DSD to PCM

Also, I set the following setting to “Precise” as I prefer it, though it gets reset to “Smooth" 
        Processor Setup    -    Filter Mode

The above are the only 4 settings that I have changed, and they all seem to get reset after using Airplay.

NOT a "good thing" IMO.

These are things I would probably never want enabled and now they are being enabled when switching streaming modes. Would be a PIA to have to manually reset to off continually if one uses these other modes.

[Duke40]

7 minutes ago, Doak said:

When PCM Auto Detect is enabled everything is upsampled to upper limit of the DAC being used.

I would expect this to make a difference in the sound.

 

Thanks Doak,  though I use Toslink S/PDIF , not USB, on my headphone rig.

 

Thought this only applied to USB, as Auralic says the following

"PCM Auto-Detect: Your streaming device will detect the maximum sampling rate supported by a USB-connected DAC and adjust accordingly."

 

I will check my DAC to see if it is actually upsampling even though I am using Toslink ... 

[2string1]

How would one check the Vega to see if it is actually upsampling.I'm extremely green when it comes to this.