Sony HAP-Z1ES has arrived

[sfseay]

3 minutes ago, jimdukey said:

When using the USB out to a Dac, what rates are played?

I assume the Remastering Engine is bypassed.

So no upsampling, just plays whatever rate the File is?

I have the Remastering turned off when connected via USB to my Esoteric N-05.  The Esoteric has adjustable upsampling and the DAC in the Esoteric is better than the one in the Sony.  I upsample whatever the Sony sends.  DSD can't be upsampled by the Esoteric and I wouldn't want that anyway.

[jimdukey]

I'll try it with my Lampi DSD Dac.

If the remastering engine still functions, I could listen to PCM and DSD files on the Lampi.

I always have the R.M. Engine on, and DSEE Auto.

Love my Z1, am also going to try replacing the HD with a SSD, as outlined on this forum!

[sfseay]

18 minutes ago, jimdukey said:

Then just use it as is, it's already a Dac, just load some files.

There are much better DACs than what the HAP-Z1ES offers.  If you have a better DAC, you should use it and bypass the one in the HAP

[jimdukey]

The poster mentioned Lesser System.

I guess the Z1 is Lesser, so it should fit right in.

[Otto]

Anyone can help me？

I got Z1es  with  only one firmware inside (181220r, it is impossible to downgrade)，does anyone know any DDC I can use so I can make usb signal become coaxial signal ,thank you very much

[Otto]

On 3/19/2018 at 5:03 PM, pro_info said:

Ok, m2tech HiFace two not work with last firmware...

Sir,did you try m2tech , I got same problem

[pro_info]

@Otto (I answer here, rather than on audiogon) As I said, I use a C-Media CM6631A chip, except it doesn't support DSD. In my case it doesn't matter since I don't have the amplifier that is DSD compatible, but for you, it won't do. In any case, not everything that is XMOS is compatible with the latest Sony firmware, so maybe stay in C-Media and try the CM6632A chip that seems to support it...

-------------------------

Comme je le disais, j'utilise un chip C-Media CM6631A, sauf qu'il ne supporte pas le DSD. Dans mon cas ce n'est pas grave puisque je n'ai pas l'ampli qui est compatible DSD, mais pour vous, ça n'ira pas. En tout cas, tout ce qui est XMOS n'est pas compatible avec le dernier firmware de Sony, donc peut-être rester dans les C-Media et essayer le chip CM6632A qui lui semble le supporter...

[Otto]

2 hours ago, pro_info said:

@Otto (I answer here, rather than on audiogon) As I said, I use a C-Media CM6631A chip, except it doesn't support DSD. In my case it doesn't matter since I don't have the amplifier that is DSD compatible, but for you, it won't do. In any case, not everything that is XMOS is compatible with the latest Sony firmware, so maybe stay in C-Media and try the CM6632A chip that seems to support it...

-------------------------

Comme je le disais, j'utilise un chip C-Media CM6631A, sauf qu'il ne supporte pas le DSD. Dans mon cas ce n'est pas grave puisque je n'ai pas l'ampli qui est compatible DSD, mais pour vous, ça n'ira pas. En tout cas, tout ce qui est XMOS n'est pas compatible avec le dernier firmware de Sony, donc peut-être rester dans les C-Media et essayer le chip CM6632A qui lui semble le supporter...

Thank you for help,I have tried so many DDc,they won't help dsd but ok with pcm

[dep14]

Ok,

 

So Tidal doesn't look like it's going to happen.

 

HOW ABOUT DEEZER SONY!  It's advertised for other sony products.

 

https://www.deezer.com/en/devices/soundsystems

 

Anyone know how we can get messages to anyone who could actually address this at Sony?

 

Ridiculous no hi-res streaming capability.

[Otto]

On 8/3/2018 at 11:40 PM, sfseay said:

I have the Remastering turned off when connected via USB to my Esoteric N-05.  The Esoteric has adjustable upsampling and the DAC in the Esoteric is better than the one in the Sony.  I upsample whatever the Sony sends.  DSD can't be upsampled by the Esoteric and I wouldn't want that anyway.

Sir ,which version of firmware in z1es are u using ？thx

[Otto]

On 8/3/2018 at 11:28 PM, sfseay said:

USB DAC Capability?  It has had that feature for over a year.  I have connected it to an Auralic Vega, PS Audio Stellar Gain Cell DAC, Esoteric K-07, and now am listening to it through an Esoteric N-05...all via the HAP-Z1ES USB port

Sir,n-05 with latest firmware ？

 

On 8/3/2018 at 11:28 PM, sfseay said:

USB DAC Capability?  It has had that feature for over a year.  I have connected it to an Auralic Vega, PS Audio Stellar Gain Cell DAC, Esoteric K-07, and now am listening to it through an Esoteric N-05...all via the HAP-Z1ES USB port

N-05 connected with 18120r firmware？thx

[les]

Can anyone shed some light on the filter options? I'm assuming the "normal" and "precision" settings denote the reconstruction filter used. I guess they are akin to "listen" and "measure" settings on various Ayre units. If so, do we have more information as to what kind of filters they are (pre-ring, post-ring, etc.)?

 

Also, I may be the odd man out, but I actually prefer my HAP-Z1ES without the DSD remastering engine. I just got the machine so it just may be getting used to the sound...

[jimdukey]

I use the Standard Upsampling, DSEE Auto, and Remastering Engine ON.

That's the whole reason to even Have the Z1!

Precision was too bright.

I've had it a few years now, very happy with it.

Cables and P.C.s matter too.

[gstew]

3 hours ago, les said:

Can anyone shed some light on the filter options? I'm assuming the "normal" and "precision" settings denote the reconstruction filter used. I guess they are akin to "listen" and "measure" settings on various Ayre units. If so, do we have more information as to what kind of filters they are (pre-ring, post-ring, etc.)?

 

Also, I may be the odd man out, but I actually prefer my HAP-Z1ES without the DSD remastering engine. I just got the machine so it just may be getting used to the sound...

Ditto on preferring the DSD remastering engine off. I found that converting PCM to DSD reduced some of the subtle cues that preserved the hardness of attacks such as the piano hammers striking the strings, plucks on other stringed instruments, and percussive impacts.

 

I'm sorry I don't know any details on Sony's filtering options. The PCM1795 chips have 2 built-in options, sharp roll-off and slow roll-off, but I'd guess they are bypassed (another option) and the normal and precision filters are generated in the FPGA DSP board.

 

I prefer normal, but in my setups and to my ears (and with my mods... my HAP Z1-ES is extensively DIY modified) I prefer the normal filter. Before the mods I preferred Precision.

 

Greg in Mississippi

[les]

A Question: In what way is the DSD Re-Mastering in HAP Z1ES  different than the 1-bit ("High Density Linear Converter") delta-sigma DAC in my 25 year old SONY ES CD player?

[sfseay]

Your CD player contains a simple D/A converter where the HAP has an upsampling engine in addition to a modern D/A converter.  The HAP's technology is light years ahead of the ES CD player

 

[les]

Yeah, certainly the HAP is light years ahead of my 25-year old ES CD player. But I was just referring to its DSD-Remastering feature. No doubt it's a more sophisticated implementation/algorithm, but it's been done for the past 25+ years (even in the cheapest CD players), this PCM-to-DSD, that is.

 

Sound-wise, I do miss a bit of my CD player's "exuberance." I do wish the HAP had a bit more "air" on top. I still have to play around with other filter settings/options... Interestingly, I know that they both measure ruler-flat in terms of response, so I'm not really sure what I'm hearing. All fascinating.

[jimdukey]

"(even in the cheapest CD players), this PCM-to-DSD, that is."

The CD players don't do the conversion, so I don't know what you mean.

[mindset]

On 9/13/2018 at 7:37 AM, les said:

A Question: In what way is the DSD Re-Mastering in HAP Z1ES  different than the 1-bit ("High Density Linear Converter") delta-sigma DAC in my 25 year old SONY ES CD player?

Both are doing some kind of upsampling and delta-sigma modulation of the original PCM in addition to other possible undisclosed spices.  The final sampling rate may also differ (5.6 MHz for Z1ES), and different delta-sigma modulators may be used between the two.  On the analog side, different low pass filters are used for sure.

 

 

[mindset]

37 minutes ago, mindset said:

Both are doing some kind of upsampling and delta-sigma modulation of the original PCM in addition to other possible undisclosed spices.  The final sampling rate may also differ (5.6 MHz for Z1ES), and different delta-sigma modulators may be used between the two.  On the analog side, different low pass filters are used for sure.

I think I was wrong.  It seems many of the old 1-bit ES players were using some sort of PWM which differs from delta-sigma modulation.

 

[les]

Is there any way/a setting that will allow me to play just one song (the selection) from the remote control app (Android)? Most of the times I do play the full album, but there are times when I  just wish to hear a single song and then move onto another... All without playing with playlists and such.

[les]

I'll just assume that above is not possible. I guess this is just a personal preference thing.

 

Another usage question... Is there an ability (in the remote app) to jump to a specific letter, like "S," when in Artist mode? This would reduce the amount of scrolling necessary. I could have sworn seeing a screenshot that had A-Z links, but now I question that...

[boomklever]

Hi Les,

 

first question: if you find your song through the search option and then start that song then you will be able to play that single song. I don’t know if there is a way to add another song to play after the first song (other then creating a playlist).

 

second question: the letters a-z on the right side of the screen are clickable. Hitting the ‘m’ for instance leads you directly to artists starting with m... 

[boomklever]

I am stil enjoying my HAP player, especially the way the apps work on several devices.

 

But one feature I still miss and I truely hope that the developers will add it one day: putting albums on a shelve and be able to play an album from that shelve.

 

This differs from the playlist option becuase it remains the original album and not a collection of tracks.

 

When dealing with real CD’s in the past I did the same: I put my newest CD’s on a separate shelve.

 

An alternative solution could be the ‘recently added’ playlist if it would only list the albums and not all tracks in order of adding.

 

 Hope the development team is listening here ?

[les]

15 minutes ago, boomklever said:

Hi Les,

 

first question: if you find your song through the search option and then start that song then you will be able to play that single song. I don’t know if there is a way to add another song to play after the first song (other then creating a playlist).

 

second question: the letters a-z on the right side of the screen are clickable. Hitting the ‘m’ for instance leads you directly to artists starting with m... 

 

Thank you for the answers. I guess I'll just create a playsheet for the first issue. Not exactly my preference, but not the end of the world, either, of course.

 

As for the second question... I just don't see those A-Z links on my android app. (I'm glad I wasn't just imaginging things...) I might have to play around with font sizes and such, perhaps. Anyway, good to know it's possible. Thank you.

 

I wonder if Sony is still continuing to push/update this product. Or has it been sunsetted... The way it's built, it's going to last a loooong time, I think. Quite happy with it.