mvilla Posted April 20, 2013 Share Posted April 20, 2013 Hi All, Has any of you had the opportunity to listen to those 2 DACs in the subject in his own chain ? Your comments ? Many thanks in advance, Massimo Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 20, 2013 Share Posted April 20, 2013 Hi All, Has any of you had the opportunity to listen to those 2 DACs in the subject in his own chain ? Your comments ? Many thanks in advance, Massimo Well I had the opportunity to listen to the Analog vs. my EMMDAC2x, the former having the standard power brick and I liked the Analog better. However, there is a caveat. You have to accept that the Analog is not Balanced and is meant to be used single ended and that every option is a significant $$ increase. If your intention is to use it strictly as a USB DAC, without adding all the potential upgrades (which can bring the price to 13K), IMO, it is as good as it gets in the 7K category of DACS. Link to comment
mvilla Posted April 21, 2013 Author Share Posted April 21, 2013 Many thanks for your note. Yes, basically my idea is to use it as a USB DAC, as I'm ripping all my CDs right now. I would like to have 1 s/pdif input module as well, that means to add almost 1000 $. If you say the standard power brick was good enough, I would avoid the upgraded supply (3000 $). You're right: it is easy to increase the price !!! About the Maitner MA-1, my concern is related to what read in Chris' review in CA about the lack of galvanic isolation on the USB port ... I wonder if they are working on it. Does anybody have any news ? Massimo Link to comment
ted_b Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Meitner MA-1 works wonderfully via USB. It's not an issue. To get even better USB noise floor, use a $199 iFi USB power supply. However, if you can beat its bigger brother for $7-8K it might be worth it. "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T. My JRIver tutorial videos Actual JRIver tutorial MP4 video links My eleven yr old SACD Ripping Guide for PS3 (needs updating but still works) US Technical Advisor, NativeDSD.com Link to comment
mvilla Posted April 21, 2013 Author Share Posted April 21, 2013 Meitner MA-1 works wonderfully via USB. It's not an issue My PC is a Mac Mini, latest model. Dobyou have experience with it and Meitner MA-1 ? Link to comment
ted_b Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 My PC is a Mac Mini, latest model. Dobyou have experience with it and Meitner MA-1 ? Yes, although I've moved onto a Windows 8 CAPS server I have hundreds of posts in the PM and A+ threads about my Meitner on a Mac Mini. Works great. "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T. My JRIver tutorial videos Actual JRIver tutorial MP4 video links My eleven yr old SACD Ripping Guide for PS3 (needs updating but still works) US Technical Advisor, NativeDSD.com Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 My PC is a Mac Mini, latest model. Dobyou have experience with it and Meitner MA-1 ? I am with Ted on this. No matter which DAC you decide on, I would really urge you to try a CAPS solution. IMO, CAPS 2 and CAPS 3 was one of the biggest bang for buck upgrade I have ever experienced. I have tried just about every Mac player and still try them as they are upgraded, but still find my CAPS a better alternative. If you want to see the differences without too much fuss, just use your MacMini with Bootcamp. Also, I have had no issues with the Meitner via USB. Link to comment
SoundQcar Posted April 22, 2013 Share Posted April 22, 2013 Also no issues whatsoever with the MA-1 via USB here. Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not." — Nelson Pass Link to comment
mvilla Posted April 22, 2013 Author Share Posted April 22, 2013 If you want to see the differences without too much fuss, just use your MacMini with Bootcamp. Not sure I've got your point. You said to use my Mac under Windows 7 as this is better than OS X ? Which players are you using ? Massimo Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 22, 2013 Share Posted April 22, 2013 Not sure I've got your point. You said to use my Mac under Windows 7 as this is better than OS X ?Which players are you using ? Massimo Name the Mac player. I have tried just about everyone and find CAPS significantly better. I continue to try the updates as well to be fair. My only point was to use your Mac as a windows machine with JRiver when you decide on your DAC to give it a whirl. If you find it better then invest in a CAPS or CAPS derivative. Link to comment
Audio_ELF Posted April 22, 2013 Share Posted April 22, 2013 Isn't the big difference the hardware rather than the OS though? Is J.River (for Windows) on Apple hardware superior? Eloise Name the Mac player. I have tried just about everyone and find CAPS significantly better. I continue to try the updates as well to be fair. My only point was to use your Mac as a windows machine with JRiver when you decide on your DAC to give it a whirl. If you find it better then invest in a CAPS or CAPS derivative. Eloise --- ...in my opinion / experience... While I agree "Everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a trickier thing. And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you - trust them with a bit of skepticism. keep your mind open... But mind your brain doesn't fall out. Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Isn't the big difference the hardware rather than the OS though? Is J.River (for Windows) on Apple hardware superior? Eloise The short answer is yes and no. The OS makes a difference and Mac makes a good Windows machine but CAPS is obviously better. I just make the recommendation to use it as a cheap experiment to compare in case the OP likes what he hears. What I found in my initial foray into testing was I didn't want to leave Apple. My DAC8 was lacking and I was ready to go the converter route when I read Chris's Aurender review where reading between the lines he like his CAPS best. So I went the bootcamp route first, still pretty decent "hardware" but found JRiver with windows OS superior to Mac OS. So I went the CAPS route never looked back but still have my Mac and whenever an update arrives I still try it. I still haven't found a Mac player I like better. Link to comment
baddog Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Well I had the opportunity to listen to the Analog vs. my EMMDAC2x, the former having the standard power brick and I liked the Analog better. However, there is a caveat. You have to accept that the Analog is not Balanced and is meant to be used single ended and that every option is a significant $$ increase. If your intention is to use it strictly as a USB DAC, without adding all the potential upgrades (which can bring the price to 13K), IMO, it is as good as it gets in the 7K category of DACS. Thanks for your thoughts on the topic. Given I have a single ended tube pre amp and single ended tube amps, and I have no need for any inputs other than USB, nor the need for volume control, it does make the Analog DAC a very compelling choice at this price point. Silver Circle Audio | Roon | Devialet | Synology | Vivid Audio | Stillpoint Aperture | Auralic | DH Labs Link to comment
baddog Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Well too late to edit my message - I am considering the Analog DAC versus the next step on the ladder, the Platinum DAC IV..can't move up any higher than that at this time... Silver Circle Audio | Roon | Devialet | Synology | Vivid Audio | Stillpoint Aperture | Auralic | DH Labs Link to comment
ted_b Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Well too late to edit my message - I am considering the Analog DAC versus the next step on the ladder, the Platinum DAC IV..can't move up any higher than that at this time... Barr, only thing is, you gotta let me break the Analog DAC in for you "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T. My JRIver tutorial videos Actual JRIver tutorial MP4 video links My eleven yr old SACD Ripping Guide for PS3 (needs updating but still works) US Technical Advisor, NativeDSD.com Link to comment
baddog Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Ted - all things being all things, if I end up in MSB land, I think something can be arranged, after all in some ways you got me into this sorry mess (the pursuit of better sound) ... Barr Silver Circle Audio | Roon | Devialet | Synology | Vivid Audio | Stillpoint Aperture | Auralic | DH Labs Link to comment
mvilla Posted April 23, 2013 Author Share Posted April 23, 2013 So I went the bootcamp route first, still pretty decent "hardware" but found JRiver with windows OS superior to Mac OS. So I went the CAPS route never looked back but still have my Mac and whenever an update arrives I still try it. I still haven't found a Mac player I like better. Hi Priaptor, do you know that JRiver is going to release a version for Mac ? It is still in alphatest but step by step they are fixing all the issues. I'm also part of the "alphatesters" ? Do you want to try and give your opinion ? Massimo Link to comment
ted_b Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 I will not speak for Priaptor (although I can cuz we are of the same mind) that yes, it is well known, as JRiver users, that the beta of JRiver for Mac is out (since feb 15th, they are on build 169 now). In my mind, as a long time MAC user and PM and A+ beta tester (I helped both get/test DSD to the market and stabilized) the differences aren't as much the players per se, but the whole hardware/software synergy. Once I moved to a CAPS V3 and Windows 8 (with Jriver and now Jriver/Jplay) there is no turning back. No need to. Sonically the best, with full tagging, convenience (jremote) and sample rate support.....this platform combo has it all IMHO. The hardware (SOtM card, minimalist design, etc) is tuned for the audio lover, the Windows 8 audio handling is superb, and the maturity of Jriver is without peer. My Meitner never sounded so good. "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T. My JRIver tutorial videos Actual JRIver tutorial MP4 video links My eleven yr old SACD Ripping Guide for PS3 (needs updating but still works) US Technical Advisor, NativeDSD.com Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 I will not speak for Priaptor (although I can cuz we are of the same mind) that yes, it is well known, as JRiver users, that the beta of JRiver for Mac is out (since feb 15th, they are on build 169 now). In my mind, as a long time MAC user and PM and A+ beta tester (I helped both get/test DSD to the market and stabilized) the differences aren't as much the players per se, but the whole hardware/software synergy. Once I moved to a CAPS V3 and Windows 8 (with Jriver and now Jriver/Jplay) there is no turning back. No need to. Sonically the best, with full tagging, convenience (jremote) and sample rate support.....this platform combo has it all IMHO. The hardware (SOtM card, minimalist design, etc) is tuned for the audio lover, the Windows 8 audio handling is superb, and the maturity of Jriver is without peer. My Meitner never sounded so good. Ted does indeed speak for me I have tried almost every Mac player and their updates never thought of giving up my beloved Mac but here I am a year later and second everything Ted says. While I have given up my Meitner for an MSB DAC I am pissed that they have yet to release workable Win 8 drivers for the Diamond but have created a second drive Win 7 64 bit Caps 3 variant and still like it significantly more than any Mac player. Link to comment
edorr Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 Ted does indeed speak for me I have tried almost every Mac player and their updates never thought of giving up my beloved Mac but here I am a year later and second everything Ted says. While I have given up my Meitner for an MSB DAC I am pissed that they have yet to release workable Win 8 drivers for the Diamond but have created a second drive Win 7 64 bit Caps 3 variant and still like it significantly more than any Mac player. Here is the latest update (from yesterday) from MSB on the Win8 driver ......"Still working on W8. no completion estimate yet. It is more complex for W8 with 384 kHz which we must have for DSD 128X......it could be a two months or more...." Very annoying indeed, since I am waiting for this driver before upgrading my CAPS 2.0 to 3.0 Carbon with Red Wine powersupply. Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 Here is the latest update (from yesterday) from MSB on the Win8 driver ......"Still working on W8. no completion estimate yet. It is more complex for W8 with 384 kHz which we must have for DSD 128X......it could be a two months or more...." Very annoying indeed, since I am waiting for this driver before upgrading my CAPS 2.0 to 3.0 Carbon with Red Wine powersupply. I can tell you what I did. I just bought a second SSD, the same one in the CAPS, just unplugged one and plugged in the new, installed Win7 Ultimate 64bit from my CAPS2, optimized for audio as per Chris and everything works like a charm. The issues Chris had early on with the ts-USBexp card with Win 7 have been fixed in their new driver. When Vince says "two or more months" I am not counting on it so I don't want to deny myself the benefits of the CAPS 3 architecture waiting for MSB at this point. It may not be as good as Win 8, but it is definitely better than CAPS 2. Link to comment
edorr Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 I can tell you what I did. I just bought a second SSD, the same one in the CAPS, just unplugged one and plugged in the new, installed Win7 Ultimate 64bit from my CAPS2, optimized for audio as per Chris and everything works like a charm. The issues Chris had early on with the ts-USBexp card with Win 7 have been fixed in their new driver. When Vince says "two or more months" I am not counting on it so I don't want to deny myself the benefits of the CAPS 3 architecture waiting for MSB at this point. It may not be as good as Win 8, but it is definitely better than CAPS 2. I agree a soft commitment to "two months" can easily become half a year or longer. May be I'll go the same win 7 on CAPS 3.0 route. I'll check with smallgreencomputer what my options are. Link to comment
edorr Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 I believe the easiest option would be to create a Win7 and Win8 partition on a single drive and create a dual boot option. You temporarily boot with Win7, and when the Win8 driver comes out you boot with Win8. Just need tpo make sure this can all be done with the stipped down Win7 and Win8 versions of the caps, but I think this should not be a problem. How to dual-boot Windows 7 with Windows 8 | How To - CNET Link to comment
Priaptor Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 I believe the easiest option would be to create a Win7 and Win8 partition on a single drive and create a dual boot option. You temporarily boot with Win7, and when the Win8 driver comes out you boot with Win8. Just need tpo make sure this can all be done with the stipped down Win7 and Win8 versions of the caps, but I think this should not be a problem. How to dual-boot Windows 7 with Windows 8 | How To - CNET I chose not to do a dual boot option and opted for a second drive for a multitude of reasons, but sure a dual boot option is no different. I certainly wouldn't deny myself the capabilities of a CAPS 3 based on MSB's "when we get around to it approach". By the way, rumor has it that the Analog now has Win 8 drivers. Link to comment
edorr Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 I chose not to do a dual boot option and opted for a second drive for a multitude of reasons, but sure a dual boot option is no different. I certainly wouldn't deny myself the capabilities of a CAPS 3 based on MSB's "when we get around to it approach". By the way, rumor has it that the Analog now has Win 8 drivers. Just inquired with smallgreen if they can set this up with a dual boot drive. We'll see what they come back with. I prefer not to mess with swapping out drives and installing stuff myself. Link to comment
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