Building a Mac Mini server w Amarra - getting it right the first time

[Yc]

Hey all.

 

I feel like there's a lot of what they call tacit knowledge knocking around in these forums, and I'd like to tap into it.

 

I'm building a Music Server that will feed via a USB magic box thing (probably the Berkeley Audio Design Alpha) directly into speakers that have a digital input.

 

Here are the priorities:

Sound Quality - Very Important (I am expecting bit-perfect redbook and HD at the speaker input)

Convenience - Very Important (including remote control via iPad)

Cost - Not So Important

Appearance - Important (ie we don't want a bunch of boxes, and we don't want a monitor)

 

My take on things from reading around is that a Mac Mini (configured as per Amarra's instructions) running Amarra and iTunes and not much else is the way to go.

 

My concerns are:

- gapless playback

- 24/96 and 24/192 playback

- remote control

 

I'm looking for convenient, non-enthusiast usability for a widely varied iTunes library, including remote control.

 

What are the things I haven't thought about? What will be the most difficult part of getting things working? I have some history doing computer config, etc., so I'm not overly worried about that part but I'm happy to hear about shortcuts and best practices.

 

Here is the Mac Mini I will spec:

* 2.6GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7

* 8GB 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x4GB

* 256GB Solid State Drive

* Apple USB SuperDrive

* Apple Remote

 

Music library will be stored on a small, external USB 3.0 1 TB drive.

 

Thanks in advance for any help or references to existing sources.

 

Regards,

Chris

Toronto

[REShaman]

Hey all.

 

I feel like there's a lot of what they call tacit knowledge knocking around in these forums, and I'd like to tap into it.

 

I'm building a Music Server that will feed via a USB magic box thing (probably the Berkeley Audio Design Alpha) directly into speakers that have a digital input.

 

Here are the priorities:

Sound Quality - Very Important (I am expecting bit-perfect redbook and HD at the speaker input)

Convenience - Very Important (including remote control via iPad)

Cost - Not So Important

Appearance - Important (ie we don't want a bunch of boxes, and we don't want a monitor)

 

My take on things from reading around is that a Mac Mini (configured as per Amarra's instructions) running Amarra and iTunes and not much else is the way to go.

 

My concerns are:

- gapless playback

- 24/96 and 24/192 playback

- remote control

 

I'm looking for convenient, non-enthusiast usability for a widely varied iTunes library, including remote control.

 

What are the things I haven't thought about? What will be the most difficult part of getting things working? I have some history doing computer config, etc., so I'm not overly worried about that part but I'm happy to hear about shortcuts and best practices.

 

Here is the Mac Mini I will spec:

* 2.6GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7

* 8GB 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x4GB

* 256GB Solid State Drive

* Apple USB SuperDrive

* Apple Remote

 

Music library will be stored on a small, external USB 3.0 1 TB drive.

 

Thanks in advance for any help or references to existing sources.

 

Regards,

Chris

Toronto

 

Chris,

I am extremely pleased with my configuration since I started with computer audio in 2011. While I own all the software players, Amarra Symphony is my primary player. You can read my system in my signature, if you care to.

Amarra Symphony employs gapless playback flawlessly in Amarra mode using preload (a setting within Amarra Preferences with the ability to preselect the number of tracks up to the entire album) and automatically in Playlist mode (up to 99 tracks). All the resolutions. Remote control with Remote App or Rowmote Pro (but not in Playlist mode). As you have taken time to read at Amarra's website; and, if you haven't already, Rob Robinson's Pure Music website is very helpful.

Perhaps, for me, in what I am contributing to your thread, less is more.

Enjoy the music and Amarra.

Best,

Richard

[Yc]

Thanks very much Richard. What you've described is what I'm after. A couple follow-ups:

 

> I notice that you have a number of the other players and add-ins installed -- do you use any of them in addition to Amarra, or were they just experimental purchases?

 

> Can you confirm that all the sample-rate converting, bit-perfect functionality of Amarra works properly when, for instance, new music is queued up using the Apple iOS Remote software?

 

> I am planning to use the Mac Mini with no screen attached. I notice that you are using the (very lovely) 27" cinema display. Would you be able to operate your configuration effectively without it? ie, with the iPad as the primary interface. [i will use a monitor for setup but only VNC for ongoing tasks such as ripping/downloading, library maintenance, etc.]

 

> I'm not familiar with the differences between Amarra Symphony and the other versions, but I will look that up. Were there particular features that led you to that version?

 

> Do you have any experience that would lead you to recommend 16 GB over 8 GB of RAM?

 

 

I agree with 'less is more' whole-heartedly. To that end the system will be:

 

 

Mac Mini >usb> Berkeley Audio Alpha USB Interface >spdif> B&O BeoLab 5 (24/96 input)

 

 

Thanks again for your prompt and focused response..

 

Cheers,

Chris

[REShaman]

Thanks very much Richard. What you've described is what I'm after. A couple follow-ups:

 

> I notice that you have a number of the other players and add-ins installed -- do you use any of them in addition to Amarra, or were they just experimental purchases?

 

> Can you confirm that all the sample-rate converting, bit-perfect functionality of Amarra works properly when, for instance, new music is queued up using the Apple iOS Remote software?

 

> I am planning to use the Mac Mini with no screen attached. I notice that you are using the (very lovely) 27" cinema display. Would you be able to operate your configuration effectively without it? ie, with the iPad as the primary interface. [i will use a monitor for setup but only VNC for ongoing tasks such as ripping/downloading, library maintenance, etc.]

 

> I'm not familiar with the differences between Amarra Symphony and the other versions, but I will look that up. Were there particular features that led you to that version?

 

> Do you have any experience that would lead you to recommend 16 GB over 8 GB of RAM?

 

 

I agree with 'less is more' whole-heartedly. To that end the system will be:

 

 

Mac Mini >usb> Berkeley Audio Alpha USB Interface >spdif> B&O BeoLab 5 (24/96 input)

 

 

Thanks again for your prompt and focused response..

 

Cheers,

Chris

 

Chris,

 

When I first started in with computer audio in February 2011, having visited first Pure Music and read everything there. Then Amarra and read everything there and several other sights, I realized that to take advantage of the two week trials being offered to promote each software player, I would never truly being able to compare if I had to rely on memory as good as my memory is. So I bought them all, at considerable expense for Amarra Full as it was called back then had been reduced from $1000 to $695. Eventually with all the software players available to me without the pressure of two week trials, I set about listening carefully and making my way. BitPerfect arrived on the scene and Audirvana was just Audirvana while Damien was developing Audirvana Plus. Fidelia developed their advanced program in addition to their standard program. Rob Robinson of Pure Music actually spent his own time on the phone with me helping me set up Pure Music which was the first program I started with.

 

And yes, from time to time, I use Audirvana Plus, BitPerfect and the others to keep my ears tuned to each program as it evolves. For a time I was a beta tester for BitPerfect. I have been a beta tester for Amarra from the beginning after I realized that was my "go to" principal player since 2011. In some respects, like Crosby Stills and Nash sing: "...When you're not with the one you love, love the one you're with..." But I am listening with Amarra 99% of my time and beta testing all the betas since 2011.

 

Yes, I can confirm src all the time but I do not measure specifically to determine bitperfect. With Apple's Remote App in Amarra mode with Preload active (I keep tracks set to "album" and cache set to 4GB and Shaped and 24Bit. I do not comment on beta builds leaving that to Sonic Studio to publish what they choose. Amarra Symphony in Amarra mode (as distinguished from Playlist mode) with Preload active and with the new iTunes 11's idiosyncrasies with play next etc. is a work in progress. Before, iTunes 11 started changing things Amarra mode with Remote was working with easy track changes up or down the track list or from or to different albums. Shuffle was confusing Preload. With Preload unchecked, track changes/album changes are flawless and shuffle is consistent. But iTunes 11 is still troublesome in my experience. As you know Remote App does not function in Playlist mode. Without disclosing anything beyond being artfully vague, I believe there is a future for Playlist mode functioning with a "remote application" or something like that or...what was I writing?

 

Ah, sans monitor. I use my iPad 2, iPod Touch 4th generation and iPod Touch easily and remotely even in different rooms (in a sense sans monitor). In my main listening room (library) where my system and monitor are, I rely upon my monitor during ripping. I do not use VNC. I realize many prefer headless. I do not feel competent or experienced to comment as I am setup as you imagined with no experience beyond managing listening sessions with Remote App or RowMote Pro in or out of the room with iPad2 etc. Tried Splash but I do not like the interface. Hopefully someone who employs Amarra with Mac Mini headless can offer you a reliable assessment (sorry).

 

Chris, when I started computer audio in 2011, I bought the best edition of each player program. Amarra's flagship program back then was called Amarra Full (as in, I guess, all the features including "meters". There were Amarra Mini, Amarra (as in an intermediate level without meters and some other features, perhaps EQ extent) and Amarra Full -- the works. Today there Amarra Hifi, Amarra and Amarra Symphony. And as you expressed, going to Amarra's website provides you with a comparison of the three editions of Amarra. I prefer all the bells and whistles, and then choose what configuration delivers the best SQ/rendition of music. I prefer Amarra Symphony even though I rarely, if ever, used the meters.

 

Yes, I have upgraded memory from 8GB to 16GB and yes I have the experience. Note: Amarra recommends 4GB for their cache. I have used 8GB but discern no improvement. And although I increased memory to 16GB overall, I do not discern a difference between 8 and 16. If in the distant future, player software becomes holographic and demands greater than 4GB...honestly, I haven't a clue. I have added 99 tracks in Playlist mode with 4GB and with 8GB and did notice a difference. I use my Mac Mini 99.9% of the time to render music. I turn off Finder when in Amarra (File>Extras> ) and stop Time Machine for critical listening. Perhaps as Amarra, iTunes, JRiver Media Center for Mac 18 etc. requires more memory/headroom the memory may come in handy. But 4GB seems to be quite sufficient. That number has been personally recommended by Jon Reichbach of Sonic Studio.

 

Your system appears to be a lovely one intended to deliver high quality rendition of music. I believe in less is more and you've chosen high quality components with a discernment, as with Amarra, that should deliver your highly-desired outcome of high quality listening experience. If I have missed something, please do not hesitate to let me or anyone else who would care to respond to you. As for the content of this response, perhaps less is more was not my outcome, though I attempted to be comprehensive. In the areas where my experience is not adequate, I prefer not to mislead or presume. Perhaps, Sonic Studio can fill in the missing information that would address your concerns when I have not.

 

Enjoyed the chat.

 

Enjoy the music,

Richard

 

[Yc]

Richard,

 

Thanks for another very thoughtful response. As I'm sure you're aware, 'less is more' is a great guiding principle for design, but less so for planning. I appreciate all the detail. I am ordering the Mac Mini and hope to assemble things in March.

 

Regards,

Chris

[REShaman]

Richard,

 

Thanks for another very thoughtful response. As I'm sure you're aware, 'less is more' is a great guiding principle for design, but less so for planning. I appreciate all the detail. I am ordering the Mac Mini and hope to assemble things in March.

 

Regards,

Chris

 

Good fortune with your design. I believe good planning leads to the start of a good design that can be a work in progress in the same way that Change is in the service of Truth which changes as one learns, makes connections, and follows the path using highly-desired criteria.

 

I imagine the connections you have already made and the ones leading to more information so you can arrive at less in the pursuit of excellence is already in progress. If you care to, let us know how you are doing.

 

Best,

Richard

[REShaman]

PS

There was a typo (sorry). I meant to write that after loading 99 tracks in Playlist mode with either 4GB or 8GB the increase in memory was not significant or discernible. It did not make a difference as far as I was able to discern. My typo omitted "not" as regards making a difference. Still I have 16GB installed. So much for less is more.

Best,

Richard

[Germanboxers]

 

Here is the Mac Mini I will spec:

* 2.6GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7

* 8GB 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x4GB

* 256GB Solid State Drive

* Apple USB SuperDrive

* Apple Remote

 

 

 

Regards,

Chris

Toronto

 

Chris, if you don't already have the MM spec'd above, I have the exact same build with 16GB that I'd be willing to sell (Going to build a C.A.P.S). I bought it from Apple in Jan,13 and don't have a need for it now.

[maelob]

Chris, I saw this company Mojo audio that do Mac mini upgrades if you want to go the extra mile. http://www.mojo-audio.com/mac-mini-media-server/

However it will cost

[Pedro Dixon]

If it was me i'd look to use a non-USB HDD given you're using a USB DAC.

[REShaman]

If it was me i'd look to use a non-USB HDD given you're using a USB DAC.

 

Good hint! Always best to connect devices to an input that is different from the kind of input one's Dac uses as in Pedro's example.

Best,

Richard

[JensPH]

Maybe I am a bit slow :-) but I do not quite get what makes you prefer Amarra over Pure Music.

I am somewhat impressed by the comparison scheme here CHANNEL D - Pure Music

Not least the "Native FLAC File Format Support" and absence of "Ghost Play" is preferable to Amarra.

 

Coming from Foobar2000 and Windows my Mac experience is limited but plan to "all in" on Mac Mini controlled via iPad and with a Lacie Thunderbolt drive for the library. Only problem seems to be deciding on the player and how to handle my substantial amount of music in DTS 24/96 format wrapped in Wav and then FLAC'ed.

 

Any thoughts are welcome :-)

 

Br JPH

[REShaman]

Maybe I am a bit slow :-) but I do not quite get what makes you prefer Amarra over Pure Music. JensPH

 

Who "you"? Me?

 

I never argue with perception. Pure Music is a fine program. The first one I purchased back in 2011. Bought them all. Settled on Amarra Symphony (back then called Amarra Full). If you are in fact referring to me as the "you" feel free to look up over 2 years of posts from me about Amarra Symphony.

 

Enjoy the music,

Richard

[LBob]

Thanks very much Richard. What you've described is what I'm after. A couple follow-ups:

 

> I notice that you have a number of the other players and add-ins installed -- do you use any of them in addition to Amarra, or were they just experimental purchases?

 

> Can you confirm that all the sample-rate converting, bit-perfect functionality of Amarra works properly when, for instance, new music is queued up using the Apple iOS Remote software?

 

> I am planning to use the Mac Mini with no screen attached. I notice that you are using the (very lovely) 27" cinema display. Would you be able to operate your configuration effectively without it? ie, with the iPad as the primary interface. [i will use a monitor for setup but only VNC for ongoing tasks such as ripping/downloading, library maintenance, etc.]

 

> I'm not familiar with the differences between Amarra Symphony and the other versions, but I will look that up. Were there particular features that led you to that version?

 

> Do you have any experience that would lead you to recommend 16 GB over 8 GB of RAM?

 

 

I agree with 'less is more' whole-heartedly. To that end the system will be:

 

 

Mac Mini >usb> Berkeley Audio Alpha USB Interface >spdif> B&O BeoLab 5 (24/96 input)

 

 

Thanks again for your prompt and focused response..

 

Cheers,

Chris

 

Chris,

 

I am running a system very similar to what you are thinking about (headless mac-mini, Amarra 2.6, 8 GB ram) and it functions flawlessly. iPad remote control (with Apple remote) is no problem; however, you won't be able to use playlist mode easily. I use Jump as opposed to VNC as it's a bit more convenient, but I also have a MacAir which is much easier to use for major operations such as ripping CD. Easier for me to rip on one system and then transfer to mac mini via screen share or USB drive.

 

Do note that if you run a mac mini headless, you might want to consider getting an HDMI detective (Geffen) as you sometimes have problems running without a display. The HDMI Detective essentially fools the mac into thinking a monitor is connected.

 

Also note that other players such as Audirvana + might be appealing to you. Different players have different sound. I have both and use both.

[tranz]

Hi Chris,

 

Naturally everyone's experience and requirements are different, but I had a hard time getting the MacMini not to sound fatiguing.

 

The only reason I have not moved to a CAPS is Amarra, which is Mac only, even with its frustrating quirks. Below is the thread where I listed all the tweaks done so far.

 

Since I have dropped the lot in a closet, I am not too concerned about the look, so some tweaks might not be for you. Although I do recommend putting distance between the Mac and the DAC, and the listener for a variety of reasons.

 

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/mac-mini-version-caps-music-server-step-step-17666/

 

Cheers

[Forehaven]

Richard I hope you don't mind that I restarted this thread. Early, you said: As you know Remote App does not function in Playlist mode. Without disclosing anything beyond being artfully vague, I believe there is a future for Playlist mode functioning with a "remote application" or something like that or...what was I writing?

 

Boy. Coming up on two years, is this a hopeless wish at this point? I love playlist w cache, but hate having to get up to change a track.

Thx

Chris

[REShaman]

U

Richard I hope you don't mind that I restarted this thread. Early, you said: As you know Remote App does not function in Playlist mode. Without disclosing anything beyond being artfully vague, I believe there is a future for Playlist mode functioning with a "remote application" or something like that or...what was I writing?

 

Boy. Coming up on two years, is this a hopeless wish at this point? I love playlist w cache, but hate having to get up to change a track.

Thx

Chris

 

Hello Chris,

 

I subscribe to the Presupposition, "The Universe is programmed to assist you." Hopeless wish? No such thing. You know the saying, "If wishes were horses then beggars would ride." There is a timing for manifesting a highly desirable outcome. Keep wishing, if you care to. Leave the hopeless in suspension. In my various relationships, I sometimes answer to a higher authority, hence the need to be artfully vague less I betray a trust. Of course, no guarantees were ever provided.

 

I, too, prefer Playlist mode and have since I purchased Amarra Full back in 2011. One of my highly-valued criteria is to enjoy the music. Understand accessing one's music library remotely is a convenience. But that is not possible for the present to enjoy Playlist mode. Or when necessary to regulate the Filter Gain value for iRC. At least I can regulate the volume with the remote for my preamp. For that I am grateful.

 

Keep the faith and enjoy the music. Exercise has merit. Dreams and wishes have currency. Sincerity is measured by time.

 

Best,

Richard

[Forehaven]

Now that's funny!! And boy, you ARE an eternal optimist!! lol I'll keep my fingers crossed but won't hold my breath Oh, and I too am grateful I can at least control vol. thru my dac.

 

Thx

Chris

[Paul R]

Have either of you guys tried running iTunes or JRMC using Amarra sQ2 as the output device?

 

It sounds extraordinary to my ears, but it is limited to PCM so far as I can tell. Not even sure if it can handle 24/192, though I plan to play with it more this weekend.

 

Anyway, it might give you the remote interface you want and still give you at least some of the sound of Amarra. Not a perfect solution by any stretch of the imagination though!

 

-Paul

[tranz]

Have either of you guys tried running iTunes or JRMC using Amarra sQ2 as the output device?

 

It sounds extraordinary to my ears, but it is limited to PCM so far as I can tell. Not even sure if it can handle 24/192, though I plan to play with it more this weekend.

 

Anyway, it might give you the remote interface you want and still give you at least some of the sound of Amarra. Not a perfect solution by any stretch of the imagination though!

 

-Paul

 

Intriguing. Using JRMC as the library and Amarra as the sound engine. But shhhh don't tell JRiver Bonaparte.

[bobbmd]

Paul. I did that also and thought sound was fantastic-but when I changed to either 2 channel-32,24,16/192000 on Audio MIDI setup/devices just got terrible distortion in both sonic and schiit gungnir outs so either amarra sQ can't handle 192 or schiit gungnir can't or neither can - I am happy with pcm and the sound separation clarity etc with SQver2