HamDog

It's been six months and I'll post an update. I am now using Jriver. The transition from Foobar to Jriver took some time as I was reluctant to learn new software. Moving my playlists was utterly difficult and time consuming. Although Jriver has a tool for converting playlists from Foobar, it does not work for individual tracks in SACD ISO files, so all those tracks had to be re-created in Jriver. But since I have started to solely use Jriver, my system has worked flawlessly. I am very happy again! The Exasound e-38 has been solid. The only reboots required are for Windows updates. And Jriver has some very nice features that weren't available with Foobar. I much prefer using USB over HDMI. HDMI can sometimes have handshake issues which require reboots. This does not happen with USB. However, as I discovered, USB does require drivers which limit ones ability to use playback software. I still refuse to try Roon because it can't handle SACD ISO files. I refuse to extract all my files to DSF. Also, I'm not keen on paying a monthly fee since I'm playing my own files.

ted_b, when you click on one of your albums in Jriver, the bottom portion of your screen changes and shows you the track listing for that album. How did you get it to do that??? When I single click on an album, nothing happens. If I double click, then it starts playing from the first track. It doesn't give me a track listing. I've been pulling out my hair trying to figure this out since last night and can't get it! I know it's probably something simple. But I'm just an idiot! Thanks for any help.

I used to use HDMI to connect my PC to my Oppo's input. HDMI had it's issues with the computer (I attributed most of the problems to the HDMI handshake). This is why I wanted to try a USB DAC. And playing files through a computer is a whole different beast than playing a disc through a dedicated disc player. Having been around the block for a long time, I've seen lots of errors in conversions get discovered and patched over time. I don't want to convert my ISO to DSF and then find a report that no one had noticed the first .4 seconds of every 3rd track had an error in timing (hypothetically speaking)! I've seen stranger things in the past. Then you have to go back and reconvert again with the new patched up software. And that's IF you kept your ISO files! These are huge files and I don't want to have two copies. I don't see any reason why Roon can't make ISO files readable like Jriver and Foobar. And I'm not sure I need all those other capabilities by Roon. I have actually played every single track on all my albums (not in it's entirety) to create my own playlists. This took YEARS for a 10TB library! I want to preserve this as I cherish it. I don't need a piece of software randomly playing tracks. I do listen to Internet Radio to discover new materials as background music. However, I do understand that Roon's feature can be very valuable to others. We all have our preferences and get used to our own methods. Change is hard! :-) And I truly appreciate your offer of telephone support. I may take you up on that soon! I know that I just need to spend time and tinker around Jriver. Ted, I'm watching your videos now. Thanks for the links! The first part has already answered some of my questions. I still need to spend a significant amount of time fine-tuning Jriver to display things the way I want. I'm getting a good understanding of the big picture, but having problems with the small details.

Hi Frans, I don't have Facebook either, so I can't view it. Personally, I would never consider Roon since it doesn't support SACD ISO files. Also, I'm meticulous about tagging my own music files, so I really don't need Roon. Not sure how you use both Roon and Jriver together and/or it's benefits. Would love to see your article. I've been using Foobar for decades. I have almost stopped using my system as my transition to Jriver has been pathetic. I just don't have the time or inclination to learn this very un-intuitive piece of software. Their library system is just confusing, and bringing over my playlists (which took years to build) from Foobar to Jriver have not been successful. I just need to set aside a few days and dedicate to learning this new software. Not from the standpoint of a newbie (which there's a lot of help), but from the standpoint of migrating from Foobar (which there isn't a lot of help). With all the resources of the Internet, research to find the right answer can be excruciatingly slow. I have about 10TB of files, but most of my music is now played through a simple Internet radio (Squeezebox) just due to it's simplicity! I'd actually be willing to pay a Jriver expert to come over and help me set things up and answer my questions (I'm in the W. Los Angeles area if anyone is listening!).

Thank you! That fixed the problem! Before, most files played fine using "Source Number of Channels". It was some of the quad files that had the problem. As Dirk had suggested, I then set it to 4 channels. That didn't fix the problem either. But setting it to 5.1 did the trick! I actually have 5 floor standing speakers without a sub, so I'm running 5.0. Just moved into a condo where less bass is better due to neighbors. I may be losing part of the music in the .1 sub, but I'm fine with that. I'm now in the process of importing my library in Jriver and learning the software. Thanks again!

Hi Dirk, Most of my multichannel audio files play perfectly, it's just a few where channel assignments are incorrect in Jriver, so I'm assuming it's set-up correctly. Chicago Quadio is 4.0, not 4.1. My current setting is "Source Number of Channels" in Jriver Audio settings, but I just tried 4.0 and got the same results (rear channels routed to center/sub). I didn't do any channel mapping in Jriver, this was only necessary in Foobar to set-up the e-38. And Oppo's HDMI input doesn't handle DSD. PCM only. Ethernet handles DSD. USB input also handles DSD. Asynch USB handles DSD, but only stereo. That's HDMI output. We're talking about the HDMI input on the Oppo.

Are you using HDMI or USB? What kind of DAC? Do you create playlists with a mixture of FLAC/DSD and stereo/multichannel or do you listen to albums? Please elaborate. Thanks!

I love multi-channel audio and my files come from ripping DVD-A, SACD, Blu-Ray, and digital downloads. My SACD files are mainly ISO, although some are DSF. While there are lots of different 2-channel DAC's, the choices are very limited for the multi-channel fan. Here is my experience and frustration with trying both HDMI and USB DACs: HDMI - I have used the Oppo BDP 95 and 105 in the past. Computer's HDMI output to the Oppo's HDMI input. Then the analog outputs of the Oppo directly into a multichannel amp. I strictly use Foobar as my main music software (WASAPI). I'm very happy with the sound quality. And most of the time, everything works fine. But there were some bugs and limitations to this set-up using HDMI. First, the Oppo doesn't handle DSD through HDMI. My computer has to convert DSD to FLAC. While it bugs me, I can live with that. But I just couldn't take this next bug: Once in a while, mainly when listening to self-created playlists which combine FLAC/DSD along with stereo/multichannel audio, the audio would get choppy and the computer would slow down to almost a halt which required a reboot. I tried three different computers and got the same results. Sought help and tried many different things, but nothing helped. There were also HDMI handshake issues which sometimes resulted in the rebooting of the computer, the Oppo, or both. So I finally purchased the eXasound E38. I thought USB would solve all my problems. Although I'm extremely happy with the sound quality, I'm still frustrated by some other issues: USB - Making Foobar work with the eXasound was quite a challenge. I would never have accomplished this without George's tremendous help at eXasound. The problem is that the latest versions of Foobar and it's related DSD plug-in's have bugs and don't work well with the eXasound drivers. You have to use specific older versions to make it work. Still the set-up can be a bit complex having to do channel mapping, etc. Later I found a problem is that these older versions didn't support DSD tagging (SACD ISO tags written to a separate .xml file). Later versions of the plug-ins which don't work with Exasound supported this. All the time I had spent in properly tagging my files in the past are now wasted. Not a deal breaker, but a bummer! Next issue is that I sometimes hear what sounds like white noise at the end and beginning of some tracks. Only a couple of seconds. No idea what's causing this. Doesn't happen all the time and when it does, it disappears once the music starts playing. My last problem is the biggie: Channel assignments in some albums are wrong. For example, while Foobar is showing audio is present in 4-channels, only two channels output from the DAC. The other two are lost somewhere. This only happens to a few albums (e.g. Chicago's Quadio - then entire collection). The vast majority of multi-channel albums play fine and without any issues. It's only a very few that are giving me this trouble. Maybe this is just a Foobar thing. I hate to learn new software, but I do have Jriver installed, so I tried to play Chicago's Quadio and the two rear channels come out in the center and sub channel! Arrgghh! I'm just really frustrated. What do other multi-channel audio fans do? What combination of products do you use and what are your headaches? Does everything work ok for you? Does anyone recognize an easy fix for any of the above symptoms I've posted? Any feedback/advice is appreciated.

#1 on my list: Multichannel capable via USB interface.

Thanks for the response. I'd love to learn more about this "extension channel". I used MakeMKV to extract the MKV and Jriver shows it as a DTS 24x96, but when I try to extract it to FLAC, it's only recognized at 16x48. I've tried several methods that have worked flawlessly on DVD-A, DVD, and Blu-Ray discs in the past, but this one has me stomped. I cannot get any 24x96 FLAC files! I've never seen this type of disc before. Still not sure if this is considered lossy since its DTS or lossless??? Can't find any info on the web. How is this better/worse than MLP 5.1 24x96?

I recently came across Monster Music's George Benson "Songs And Stories" CD/DVD combo. Here is a picture of the back cover: http://i.imgur.com/2b33NT9.jpg It has high resolution stereo and surround on the DVD. However, for the surround, they use DTS 24bit 96Khz. This is not the DTS-MA for Blu-Ray, so I'm presuming this is lossy DTS. So why in 24x96 format? Does lossy DTS sound better in 24x96 than in 16x48??? I don't see how or why. Hoping someone with a better understanding can help explain.

Yes, that's the problem. DVDAE can only decode the DTS-core when both core and HD are present. This is a copy/paste from their FAQ: [h=4]My disc comes with a 96kHz DTS stream, but the extracted result shows as 48kHz. Why?[/h]This is a known limit. For DTS-ES and DTS-HD MA streams which come with a core stream and one or more extended streams, only the core stream (48kHz) is currently decoded by DVD Audio Extractor. And this limit only exists on DTS format. For all other formats like MLP, TrueHD, LPCM, etc, all sample rates are supported. We do look forward to adding full DTS support in the future. ------------------------------------------------------------------- I have now learned to use MakeMKV's "FLAC profile" feature to convert to .mka file and then open with Foobar and extract to FLAC in 24x96. Wondering what other methods were being used. But I'm guessing not too many people are ripping music from Blu-Ray discs from lack of response. And which stream do others prefer - DTS-MA or Tru-HD to convert to FLAC?

Some audio only Blu-Rays use DTS-MA for multichannel audio (24 bit 96khz). I want to rip these files to FLAC for my NAS. In the past, I had used DVD Audio Extractor. If the disc was copy protected, I'd use makeMKV to back-up the disc and remove the copy protection, then use DVD Audio Extractor to obtain the FLAC files. Recently, I discovered that DVD Audio Extractor can only output up to a 24 bit 48khz when the disc is encoded with DTS-MA (even when the source is 24x96). What's the simplest way to extract the 24x96 DTS-MA to 24x96 FLAC? What program(s) do you use? My OS is Windows 7.

Could you explain "convolving"? Thanks!

At $13K each, the MPD-5 for multichannel will cost $39K!!!! The Primare only has USB inputs for external devices, not a computer. I'm confused over the NADAC 8 - the pictures don't show any USB inputs at all. But the description states ASIO compatibility with Windows PC. Need a special card for the computer to use aes/ebu? I don't believe multichannel can be achieved using coaxial or optical (I could be wrong). Wasn't aware of the U-DAC8. Clever little device at an outstanding price point. Not sure why they're not giving a Dirac option on it (like the DDRC88 - which only as analog inputs). Currently Foobar converts my DSD to PCM since it sends it over to my Oppo via HDMI. I wouldn't hesitate replacing my Oppo with a U-DAC8 since I never use physical media anymore. But wondering if the DAC is as good as the Oppo.