Vinnie Rossi

Hi sefischer1, Correct, the bank in use (not the one that is charging) is disconnected via the MOSFET switches. The AC leakage current comes from the Y-caps used inside the charging supply. It gets coupled onto the DC output as common mode noise, and a very small amount of it even leaks through the MOSFET switches because a MOSFET is not a perfect switch in that there are still internal capacitances and resistances between its 3 terminals. So instead of getting something like -126dB (or better) across the entire band from 0Hz to > 100kHz, there is the AC leakage that shows at 60Hz (or 50hz, depending on where you live) at around -115dB (which is about 20 microvolt of noise per 12V output. Again, very, very little, but noted), and less of it at harmonics of 50 or 60Hz. So it is a very quiet supply, and other parameters such as output impedance vs. frequency are not affected, (but are also very important, as audio equipment is rarely acts as a constant-current DC load because the DC current drawn can change over time, even very briefly, and the power supply needs to be able to cope with this). Best regards, Vinnie

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Hi sefischer1, I'm not sure if the 12V, 6000mAH Li-ion pack you were using has an output regulator or not? If it was just a battery pack w/o output regulator, be careful because the starting voltage will probably be > 12V and the shut off voltage will probably be < 12V. I'm not sure if the Nagra VPS is ok with this. If the battery pack has an output regulator that follows it, is it a switching regulator or linear regulator? Your VR MINI uses a 12V, linear, Belleson Super-Regulator. See: https://www.belleson.com/store/SPZ-High-Current It not only might be cleaner, but it could have a lower output impedance over a wider frequency range compared to what you were using. As far as timing between bank switching, I would need to time it with a 0.6A load. I would think it would be >10 seconds between switching banks, but would need to verify. Regarding the link that esldude points to: Yes, the AC live goes through the transformer (but the transformer is just in series, just like an inductor), before going to the SMPS charging supply, which then feeds a linear current regulator on the board above it that provides constant current charging to the two ultrcacap banks on that board, which then feed the linear Belleson super-regulator on the output side, and then to the output jacks. Initially, the large transformer inside was to be used as a step-down, but with the first small batch of supplies some customers were finding them to be mechanically loud, in terms of hum/buzz (I didn't have this issue on my bench when we tested them before shipping, so I think they were sensitive to noise/harmonics on the AC line in some homes). So now you can't think of it as a step-down transformer. I am aware of Amir and his post on ASR forum. I've spoken direclty to him about it. Even with the very small amount of AC leakage via the SMPS charger, the DC output is very clean. The worst is -115dB at 60Hz (this is only about 20uV at 60Hz for the 12Vdc output. At higher frequencies, the output is better than -126dB. That's noise... not a measurement of output impedance vs. frequency. There have been articles written about the AC leakage via the small Y-caps in a SMPS. Again, its very low (about 20uV), but it is common-mode and the Belleson will not filter it, and it does creep base the bank switching MOSFETs in the mini. You'll find on the Uptone forum (regarding their LPS-1 and its SMPS charger) a suggestion by John Swenson to Earth Ground the DC output (-) terminal, thus shunting any SMPS leakage to GND. You can also try this with the MINI, but it could cause a ground loop with your other equipment. But can you even notice the 20uV of noise? Not sure what the SNR of your gear is, so I don't want to speculate yes or no. The important thing to note is that the VR MINI's 12Vdc output is very clean over a wide freq. range, as is load regulation and output impedance (specs are on the Belleson website). Glad to hear - it sounds like it is doing what it is meant to do then! Thank you for your post, Vinnie

Hi Steven, The VR MINI has a max continous output current rating of 2.5A. It looks ike your product requires at least 5A, so it will not do the trick. Best regards, Vinnie

@esimms86 @The Computer Audiophile Nice! And extreme nearfield!

Hi firedog, Sure... One of the chips that I evaluated was the ESS9038 PRO. I ended up preferring the sound signature of the AKM4497 and its filters, and the AK4497's 1Bit DSD bypass mode (for using Roon or HQPlayer upsampling engine - sounds remarkably good!), as well as its PCM non-oversampling, digital filterless mode. In general, I found the AKM4497 to simply sound more natural and enjoyable with long listening sessions. ESS9038PRO has some nice built-in features to clean up jitter, but we decided to do our own external (external to the d/a chips) XILINX FPGA buffer / reclock circuit in front of the AK4497 chips, so I was less interested in the 9038 for this aspect. As you all probably know, YMMV and there are many things that to into a dac design that contribute to its overall sound signature. I know there are many companies going with the ESS9038PRO and getting excellent results. I just personally prefer the AKM4497... for me, it is closer to the NOS, R-2R signature that I have deeply enjoyed over the years (with PCM and DSD), but with heightened resolution! Also, the timing of the release of the AKM4497 was a little off (I'm pretty sure ESS9038PRO beat them to the market, especially in terms of having availability), but I'm glad I waited for it! :-) Vinnie

One more post for now... 1) New LIOs will automatically have the new firmware, and I have just finished updating our website so LIO DAC 2.0 appears as an option for all the LIO product configurations (as well as "custom configure LIO"). If you guys find any typos, bugs, etc., please email me directly and I'll get them taken care of ASAP. 2) I just added some info about using the LIO DAC 2.0 with Roon upsampling (my 2nd post in this thread, above) and HQPlayer. 3) When your LIO DAC 2.0 ships, we will email you tracking info and a link to the Windows driver (Thesycon driver). As mentioned above, no driver is needed if you are using Mac OSX or Sonore products like the microRendu. 4) I have not tested with SOTM SMS-200, but their website says "PCM 32bit/768KHz max, DSDx512 max" so I *assume* it will work fine and in a similar fashion to Sonore. Orders are coming in quickly - thank you, everyone! (the hard part is the waiting, but the summer will be over before you know it!) Vinnie

About using Roon's upsampling with LIO DAC 2.0 Native DSD512 will work with the Sonore microRendu, ultraRendu, and Sonic Orbiter SE. This evening I tested it with my 2015 MacBook Air running Roon 1.3 via its Sample Rate Conversion (in the DSP Engine settings) to DSD512. But first, you need to properly set it up, as follows: 1) In Sonore's SonicOrbiter setup (www.sonicorbiter.com), you need to enable the Roon Ready app and then go to: 2) Settings > Roon Ready > DSD Support - you must select Native DSD (not DoP, or else Roon will not allow for a sample rate conversion higher than DSD256). 3) In Roon, you need to go to: DSP Engine (enable it) > Sample Rate Conversion (enable it) > Sample Rate Conversion drop down (select DSD) > DSD Sample Rate (select DSD512) > Enable Native DSD Processing (select Yes) Some things note: - Make sure you have a computer that has sufficient resources to do the sample rate conversion to DSD512, and for sustained listening sessions. This will be the signal path in Roon: - I will post more later about how the Roon upsampling to DSD512 sounds with LIO DAC 2.0 vs using the NOS filter mode. Simply put - it sounds awesome (but they have a different flavor) Upsampling via Roon to DSD256 (quad-DSD) also sounds nearly as good, and uses less processing power. - I also confirmed HQPlayer (integrated into Roon) filtering of native DSD512 works. If you are integrating HQPlayer into Roon, you should see the signal path look something like this: - I found that running HQPlayer filters with Roon conversion to DSD512 really taxed my CPU. I am far from an HQPlayer whiz and receive setup help from mirekti. I just wanted to post this to show that it works, and mention again that you should make sure you have enough processing power if you want to try this. Vinnie

Thanks, Chris! This will be the official LIO DAC 2.0 information and discussion thread here on CA. LIO DAC 2.0 webpage: http://www.vinnierossi.com/modules/dac2/ Description LIO DAC 2.0 is our new, statement-level LIO d/a converter module. It distinctly combines highly resolving, spacious and dynamic sound with a natural and emotionally engaging presentation. Music flows in an effortless manner that mirrors true analog playback with its seductive midrange and organic tonality. All inputs feature isolation from the digital source, advanced FPGA buffering/re-clocking using premium “femto-clock” oscillators and ultra low-noise voltage regulation stages throughout. Pristine data feeds a dual-mono d/a implementation with independent, flagship AKM AK4497EQ converters per channel, each followed by a discrete Class-A output stage and positioned on dedicated circuit boards (a vertical stack of three separate boards minimizes both signal and power trace lengths). LIO DAC 2.0 allows you to take full advantage of all your high resolution PCM (up to 32-bit / 768kHz) and DSD (up to native DSD512) music files, and also allows redbook CD files to sound rich and non-fatiguing with its NOS (non-oversampling), digital filterless playback mode. Add icing to the cake by combining LIO DAC 2.0 module with our optional tube output stages (including DHT PRE) to provide an even greater level of midrange richness and realism rarely found with digital playback. Features & Specifications - Bit-perfect playback at sampling rates up to 768kHz (16, 24, or 32 bit compatible), as well up to DSD512. Sample rates are viewable from front panel display (see note below) - Dual-mono design, with one flagship AKM AK44497EQ d/a chip per channel - Fully discrete, pure Class-A JFET analog outputs stage design with cascode constant-current source biasing (no opamps) - On-board FPGA buffer and femto-reclocking circuitry negates effects of jitter. Isolated input stages. - ‘NOS’ (non-oversampling) filter mode with digital filter bypass, as well as a Minimal Phase digital filter mode (selected via the “FILTER” button on the LIO Remote) - Absolute polarity ‘normal’ / Absolute polarity ‘inverted’ (selected via the “PHASE” button on the LIO Remote) - Numerous ultra-low noise, linear voltage regulators used throughout (for both digital and analog sections) - “Silent” mute relays (*barely* an audible click from the board when changing tracks of a different sample rate) - Inputs: 1 USB, 1 Coax (75-ohm BNC, with included RCA adapter) and 1 TOSLINK (optical). Connect up to three devices and switch between them via LIO front panel or the remote handset - Output voltage: 2Vrms - Output impedance: < 100 ohms * Please note: If you already own LIO, in order to correctly display the following sample rates, it must be sent in for a free firmware update: PCM 705 and 768kHz, DSD256 and DSD512. LIO DAC 2.0 will work perfectly fine w/o the firmware update, but the sample rates listed above will not show correctly on LIO’s front panel display. Supported bit/sampling rates - Mac OSX (no drivers needed): PCM: 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 176.4, 192, 352, 384, 705, and 768kHz (16, 24, and 32-bit) DSD: DSD64, DSD128, DSD256 (DoP) - Windows PC (with included driver): PCM: 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 176.4, 192, 352, 384, 705, and 768kHz (16, 24, and 32-bit) DSD: DSD64, DSD128, DSD256, DSD512 (Native, or DoP) - Using Sonore microRendu, ultraRendu, or SonicOrbiter SE: PCM: 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 176.4, 192, 352, 384, 705, and 768kHz (16, 24, and 32-bit) DSD: DSD64, DSD128, DSD256, DSD512 (Native, or DoP) About LIO DAC 2.0’s USB isolation, buffer, and reclock circuit The LIO DAC 2.0 USB input first goes through a galvanic isolation stage, and the USB 5V bus is only used as a 'signal' (not as a power source) to turn ON our "LIO power" to power the USB input section. The entire LIO DAC 2.0 is powered from a main linear regulated feed from LIO's internal ultracapacitor power, and then there are numerous linear voltage regulators used for each of the three PCBs. After the isolation, the digital data is fed into to our FPGA buffer and reclock circuitry (using a XILINX FPGA implementation and femto-clocks, which are also powered by their own dedicated super regulators for this section). The reclocked digital output feeds the dual d/a chips (separate boards for L and R channels, which get their own linear regulators for the digital and analog sides of d/a chips and for their Class A analog output stages). There is a lot going on in this design, and it has been in the works for well over a year now (and has taken up a ton of time and $$$). LIO DAC 2.0 does not have any design elements in common with the first “LIO DSD/PCM DAC” (except for the fact that it still has USB, coax, and optical inputs). LIO DAC 2.0 is a "statement level" design for the LIO, where I am confident that many will find it holds its own against dacs into the $10K range, and far beyond if you are using a DHT PRE after it! Pricing, availability, and trade-in of LIO DSD/PCM dac Please visit: http://www.vinnierossi.com/modules/dac2/ LIO DAC 2.0 is entering production and right now is the time to pre-order and save $300! - The pre-order price for the LIO DAC 2.0 module is $2995. After July 31, 2017, the regular price will be $3295. - LIO DAC 2.0 pre-orders are estimated to ship end of August / early September. - Trade-in of your LIO DSD/PCM DAC module for a 100% trade-in credit of $895. ...

Hi Kin, Brian from Belleson has tested the custom Belleson super-regulator that we use for the output of the VR MINI, and confirmed that when a switch (or variable resistor) is used to allow for voltage adjustment, the is always a noise penalty associated with it. I decided that added noise penalty would take away from the VR MINI's competitive advantage over all other power supplies in its voltage/power range, so I will not be offering it. Thank you for your understanding, Vinnie

Thanks for sharing this, sphinxsix. Looking forward to listening to this later this evening...

Thanks, Guys! Here is some more coverage from LAAS 2017! From Jana Dagdagan of Stereophile: https://www.stereophile.com/content/jana-wraps-her-laas-coverage Photo Credit: Jana Dagdagan, Stereophile Quote from: Jana Dagdagan / Stereophile The last room on my list: Vinnie Rossi, Spatial Audio, and Anticables. Thanks for visiting, Jana! ----- The Audio Beatnik has just awarded Clayton's Spatial X1's Loudspeakers Best of Show (under $20K): http://theaudiobeatnik.com/index.php/2017/06/10/la-audio-show-part-3-best-speaker-20000/ Quote from: Jack Roberts / The Audio Beatnik A most impressive debut of the X1's! Congratulations, Clayton! And many thanks to Jack Roberts of The Audio Beatnik for listening to our room at LAAS! Vinnie

All, I'm finally back home from the LAAS2017! I have to catch up on many emails and phone calls this week, so thank you for your patience during this busy time for me. We were very pleased with how everything turned out for this show, and especially invoking this kind of emotion that that av_passion stated above: Quote from: av_passion That's really what it is all about! --- LAAS2017 ALFIE AWARD On Saturday night, there was an LAAS2017 audiophile products award ceremony ("ALFIE Award"), and I was deeply honored that the LIO received it! I am very humbled by the panel of judges from the LAAS & LA/OC Audio Society for taking the time to visit and learn about what LIO is all about, and for presenting this award. The only thing that could have make this award even sweeter for me is if it encompassed our entire room and included Clayton Shaw's Spatial Audio X1 Loudspeakers and Paul and Judy Speltz's ANTICABLES speaker cables and USB cable. It was with Clayton, Paul and Judy's creations and passion in achieving such a high level of sonic performance that made our room as good as it did! Our team: Another nice surprise was that a local show attendee that visited our exhibit room multiple times during the show ended up purchasing the entire room of gear that we presented (LIO, X1s, and cables) - and since he was local, we were able to deliver it to his home and set it up on Sunday evening! He was very serious about wanting to recreate the exact sound that he heard in our exhibit room at the show, so it ended up working out perfectly for all of us! --- As for PRESS COVERAGE, here is one from today by Brian Hunter of Audio-Head.com: http://audio-head.com/vinnie-rossi-and-spatial-audio/ Quote from: Brian Hunter / Audio-Head.com Vinnie Rossi always has a smooth selection of sonic treats to sample from and he always seems to know the right tune to play for any audience – with deep tracks and clever covers. He was also generous enough to let me sit in the sweet spot and bear witness to the quick, but clear rock track Madness from Muse for a taste of the weekend’s auditory cocktail. Upward extension was spot on, the system’s response to the rapid fire vocal samples and distorted instruments was controlled and tidy. Photo Credit: Brian Hunter / www.audio-head.com Thank you for visiting, Brian! More soon... Vinnie

Mirrored coverage on the Vinnie Rossi Audiocircle forum: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=150692.0 From AV_Passion: From targa02:

From LAAS2017, Suite 476: Vinnie Rossi LIO DHT Integrated Amp (with custom Spatial Audio X1 amp module), Spatial Audio X1's and Paul Speltz's ANTICABLES: FINALLY - I have a spacious exhibit room (I jumped in early on reserving a full-sized sweet), and the LIO DHT Integrated (with X1 Amp module) + Spatial Audio X1's + Paul Speltz's ANTICABLES are sounding incredibly good together! They really can DO IT ALL! Hopefully some CA members who had the opportunity to listen will post their impressions soon enough, and I'll be sure to update this thread with show coverage as it becomes available! Vinnie