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  1. #51
    Orange is the new Putin wgscott's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_bat View Post
    I thought it was from Bob Dylan.
    It used to me this:

    “The music business is a cruel and shallow money
    trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and
    pimps run free, and good men die like dogs.
    There's also a negative side.”
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    Gone are the days we stopped to decide
    Where we should go. We just ride.

  2. #52
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    Sorry for being a tad descriptive here, but I'd prefer to bob for apples in a truck stop toilet than hang out at Hydrogen Audio. I'm sorry you had to find out the hard way, Scott.

    My sincerest apologies to truck stops everywhere.
    Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not." — Nelson Pass

  3. #53
    Señor Member Jud's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoundQcar View Post
    Sorry for being a tad descriptive here, but I'd prefer to bob for apples in a truck stop toilet than hang out at Hydrogen Audio. I'm sorry you had to find out the hard way, Scott.

    My sincerest apologies to truck stops everywhere.
    But who's Scott?

    (Those are initials followed by the last name.)


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    The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein
    One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

    MacBook Pro, A+ -> 2 Mapleshade Clearlink USB Plus flanking Regen (powered by LPS-1) -> iFi micro-iDSD -> Spectral DMC-12 & DMA-150 -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

  4. #54
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    Makes me curious what words would they use to describe my player...
    Signalyst - http://www.signalyst.com
    Developer of HQPlayer

  5. #55
    I had the same sort of experience over at Steve Hoffman. I made a comment about a number of posts being off topic, a couple of people were having a private conversation that had nothing to do with the discussion.

    Next thing I know, I get a private message explaining that it was against the rules to ever criticize a moderator, that's just not on old boy.

    Turns out one of the boys was a moderator. I explained that they didn't need to worry about my future behavior, I wouldn't be participating any longer. I did ask for my account to be deleted, only to be told "We don't delete accounts".

    I think some of these sites sometimes take on the trappings of a private club of like-minded people. Anyone attempting to participate that may have a different mindset is less than welcome.

  6. #56
    Senior Member gmgraves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wgscott View Post
    I thought this was fairly innocuous. I imagine I will have been banned before I finish typing this.

    I didn't even post a poll (push or otherwise). I simply answered it. As simply and objectively as I could.

    2012 Unix Audio Player Usage Poll - Hydrogenaudio Forums

    Then I got this from the moderator:

    Attachment 2151

    So a humble request for our own Dear Moderator: If I should accidentally (or otherwise) manage to piss you off, please don't tell me to go to hydrogen audio. "Go to hell" at least would involve a more pleasant destination for that journey.

    My experience with moderated groups (I spent many years corresponding on alt.audio.high-end among others). In my opinion, they are all moderated by "little Napoleons". I.E. you give these moderators a modicum of power and it goes right to their heads. No moderator on any group that I have ever encountered is even-handed in his application of the posting rules. Each moderator has his clique of favorites and lets them get away with posting things that others would never be allowed to post. If you bring this inequity to their attention, they will often respond by banning you. They can do that BECAUSE THEY HAVE THAT POWER and are the final arbiter. We are very lucky here at CA in that Chris doesn't do this. He rarely moderates, and when he does, he applies his moderation with an even hand. Many moderated groups require that all posts go through the moderator before the post shows-up on the forum and what one gets is is an email telling one to rewrite their post and re-submit it. Yes, it stops most people from personally attacking others with ad hominem attacks, but "favorites" are often immune from such censorship. HydrogenAudio seems no different in that respect. I rarely post there, but I do read them from time to time.
    George

  7. #57
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    My first thought was, "Huh?"
    So I reviewed the thread. My second thought was, "Huh?"
    rgtb (a newbie) was impolite and was rightly called on it by mudlord.
    I've certainly seen worse here. I don't know what the HA moderator said in their original message, but I suspect there's a little more to the story than you showed.
    I agree they tend to the hard-core objectivist over there, but a forum where it is mooted that copying a WAV file from one media to another changes its sound isn't the world's most balanced place either.

  8. #58
    Masters Level Member sandyk's Avatar
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    I agree they tend to the hard-core objectivist over there, but a forum where it is mooted that copying a WAV file from one media to another changes its sound isn't the world's most balanced place either
    According to members like jriver, playing a track from System Memory shouldn't result in any audible SQ improvement either, yet many members here, and in other forums, will tell you that it does.

  9. #59
    Orange is the new Putin wgscott's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Hills View Post
    My first thought was, "Huh?"
    So I reviewed the thread. My second thought was, "Huh?"
    rgtb (a newbie) was impolite and was rightly called on it by mudlord.
    I've certainly seen worse here. I don't know what the HA moderator said in their original message, but I suspect there's a little more to the story than you showed.
    I agree they tend to the hard-core objectivist over there, but a forum where it is mooted that copying a WAV file from one media to another changes its sound isn't the world's most balanced place either.
    Almost everything has been deleted. I just re-read it and didn't even recognize it.
    ------------------------------------------------------------
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    Where we should go. We just ride.

  10. #60
    Señor Member Jud's Avatar
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    OK, I tried hydrogen audio. It didn't go too well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Hills View Post
    My first thought was, "Huh?"
    So I reviewed the thread. My second thought was, "Huh?"
    rgtb (a newbie) was impolite and was rightly called on it by mudlord.
    I've certainly seen worse here. I don't know what the HA moderator said in their original message, but I suspect there's a little more to the story than you showed.
    I agree they tend to the hard-core objectivist over there, but a forum where it is mooted that copying a WAV file from one media to another changes its sound isn't the world's most balanced place either.
    Don, I'm a little surprised you didn't catch what occurred.

    Bill Scott, no raving subjectivist he, responded to a poll on HA asking what players people used. He was immediately jumped on by other members for using one of those players everyone knows is "voodoo." Some of this jumping-on remains in the thread.

    Bill then responded (from his posts here at CA it is safe to assume he did not claim Audirvana sounded like flights of angels compared to all other players); whereupon a moderator told him we only hold with scientifically demonstrated claims here; whereupon Bill said, well, being a scientist I know something about that (this correspondence is reproduced at the beginning of this thread); whereupon Bill was banned. Edit: As is common practice at many forums, statements by the banned individual were later removed from the thread.

    Thus: It is fine at HA to make *criticisms* of feelthy voodoo subjectivist software and hardware; but it is not fine to make factual statements in response to such criticism. This is "objectivism" as ideology, not objectivity as a practice.


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    The fairest thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science. - Einstein
    One never knows, do one? - Fats Waller

    MacBook Pro, A+ -> 2 Mapleshade Clearlink USB Plus flanking Regen (powered by LPS-1) -> iFi micro-iDSD -> Spectral DMC-12 & DMA-150 -> Vandersteen 3A Signature.

  11. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by sandyk View Post
    According to members like jriver, playing a track from System Memory shouldn't result in any audible SQ improvement either, yet many members here, and in other forums, will tell you that it does.
    Where does he say this? It seems a bit strange as their software provides the ability to do this.
    Tom

    "There are two kinds of music. Good music, and the other kind."

    - Duke Ellington

  12. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by sandyk View Post
    shouldn't result in any audible SQ improvement either, yet many members here, and in other forums, will tell you that it does.
    What's your point?

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandyk View Post
    According to members like jriver, playing a track from System Memory shouldn't result in any audible SQ improvement either, yet many members here, and in other forums, will tell you that it does.
    I rest my case, M'Lud.

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by wgscott View Post
    Almost everything has been deleted. I just re-read it and didn't even recognize it.
    I did wonder about that. In my opinion, it's the biggest shortcoming of modern forums. I grew up with Usenet, where it was practically impossible to delete something you'd posted.

  15. #65
    Masters Level Member sandyk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kumakuma View Post
    Where does he say this? It seems a bit strange as their software provides the ability to do this.
    Tom

    See posts 8 and 9. Perhaps he wilted under pressure due to numerous reports from those who also use jPlay in conjunction with his program and is having an each way bet ?

    Alex
    Windows Update, Defender, Internet Access etc.

  16. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by sandyk View Post
    Tom

    See posts 8 and 9. Perhaps he wilted under pressure due to numerous reports from those who also use jPlay in conjunction with his program and is having an each way bet ?

    Alex
    Windows Update, Defender, Internet Access etc.
    Thanks, Alex.

    It looks like the feature was added based on user requests:

    NEW: Improved memory playback
    Tom

    "There are two kinds of music. Good music, and the other kind."

    - Duke Ellington

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jud View Post
    Don, I'm a little surprised you didn't catch what occurred. ...
    Stranger things have happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jud View Post
    ... Bill said, well, being a scientist I know something about that (this correspondence is reproduced at the beginning of this thread); whereupon Bill was banned. Edit: As is common practice at many forums, statements by the banned individual were later removed from the thread. ...
    Some of the correspondence was reproduced. (I'm not saying Bill should post any more, just saying there wasn't enough to make me confident that I was seeing the full story.) Bill might have been banned at the time, I can't tell, but he isn't now. As for the deletions, at least some of it is in the Recycle Bin section. Was there more?

  18. #68
    Masters Level Member sandyk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Hills View Post
    I rest my case, M'Lud.
    What case ? A basket case ? (smile)
    On this occasion, there are huge numbers of supportive threads and posts as to why playing from System Memory or a more electrically quiet storage medium does matter. I guess that Superdad and John Swenson were wasting their time developing and supplying the JS2 Linear PSU for the Mac Mini,. as well as a Linear Fan PSU PCB too ?

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandyk View Post
    What case ? A basket case ? (smile)
    On this occasion, there are huge numbers of supportive threads and posts as to why playing from System Memory or a more electrically quiet storage medium does matter. I guess that Superdad and John Swenson were wasting their time developing and supplying the JS2 Linear PSU for the Mac Mini,. as well as a Linear Fan PSU PCB too ?
    Some time ago I came to the conclusion that any DAC that is audibly affected by upstream or external perturbations is defective. All the evidence I have seen, such as that which you just gave, supports this. I have a choice between buying a DAC which is unaffected, or trying to fix all the external influences. I enjoy tinkering and tweaking as much as anyone, but my primary goal is to listen to music.

  20. #70
    vinyl nerd spdif-usb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmgraves2@comcast.net View Post
    In my opinion, they are all moderated by "little Napoleons". I.E. you give these moderators a modicum of power and it goes right to their heads.
    You mean... like most of the people who love Apple products? :grin:
    If you had the memory of a goldfish, maybe it would work.

  21. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by wgscott View Post
    I thought this was fairly innocuous. I imagine I will have been banned before I finish typing this.

    I didn't even post a poll (push or otherwise). I simply answered it. As simply and objectively as I could.

    2012 Unix Audio Player Usage Poll - Hydrogenaudio Forums

    Then I got this from the moderator:

    Attachment 2151

    So a humble request for our own Dear Moderator: If I should accidentally (or otherwise) manage to piss you off, please don't tell me to go to hydrogen audio. "Go to hell" at least would involve a more pleasant destination for that journey.
    Hehe bad luck there mate. Sorry for my amusement. You have taken a look at HA forum threads right?:

    1. Mp3 bitrate blind test discussion.
    2. Mp3 vs OGG blind test discussion.
    3. Mp3 vs FLAC blind test discussion.
    4. DAC vs carrot blind test discussion.

    No further threads :P Maybe the same subject but with RMAA instead of blind test, I lie.
    Last edited by drez; 09-10-2014 at 08:39 PM. Reason: embelish

  22. #72
    Masters Level Member sandyk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Hills View Post
    Some time ago I came to the conclusion that any DAC that is audibly affected by upstream or external perturbations is defective. All the evidence I have seen, such as that which you just gave, supports this. I have a choice between buying a DAC which is unaffected, or trying to fix all the external influences. I enjoy tinkering and tweaking as much as anyone, but my primary goal is to listen to music.
    And the name of your "Perfect" DAC is ?

    Perhaps you are also a Muso who can enjoy even low bit rate .mp3 because your brain works overtime to output what you wish to take from the performance , instead of the reality ?

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandyk View Post
    And the name of your "Perfect" DAC is ?

    Perhaps you are also a Muso who can enjoy even low bit rate .mp3 because your brain works overtime to output what you wish to take from the performance , instead of the reality ?
    What perfect DAC? there's no such thing, nor did I say that there was.

    I'm no muso, and I do notice artifacts in low bit rate mp3. But I'd rather listen to a poor recording of a performance than none at all, or a poor recording of a great performance than a great recording of a poor performance.

  24. #74
    Orange is the new Putin wgscott's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_bat View Post
    I thought it was from Bob Dylan.
    What's with the necro-post?
    ------------------------------------------------------------
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    Where we should go. We just ride.

  25. #75
    I think it's immature to complain about one forum on another forum.

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