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  1. #1
    Arizona Son mwheelerk's Avatar
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    How Can You Rip SACD Files ?

    There have been threads regarding use of a PS3 player to RIP SACD to file but is there any other method that would allow us to have DSD files to playback from a Mac Mini system?
    Mac Mini OSX 10.10 with (2) Lacie Quadra 2TB HDD > iTunes 12 with Audivrana 2.0 or JRiver Media Center For Mac 20 > Bel Canto C5i > Focal Chorus 714V

    JRemote> Apple Remote app > Screens VNC app

    XLD or dbPoweramp for Mac for ripping

  2. #2
    Senior Member REShaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mwheelerk View Post
    There have been threads regarding use of a PS3 player to RIP SACD to file but is there any other method that would allow us to have DSD files to playback from a Mac Mini system?
    Great question which I have been extremely interested in finding the answer to as I made an error in judgment when I purchased my PS3 back when ignoring the opportunity to buy the SACD playing edition of the PS3. How I regret that decision. My fault. Anyone to the rescue besides buying one on Ebay? Or another methodology? It isn't as if I have waited for mwheelerk to pose the question. I have not been successful in finding/receiving the answer.
    Best,
    Richard
    Software: OS X Yosemite, iTunes, Amarra Symphony & iRC, Audirvana Plus+, BitPerfect & DSD Master, Decibel, Fidelia, Pure Music; Computer: Mac Mini (2011, 2.7 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo i7, 16GB, int. SSD 256GB); Video: 27" Cinema Thunderbolt Display; Storage: Promise Pegasus 12TB R6 Raid 5 & 8TB R4 Raid 5; Digital: Oppo BDP-95; Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2 DSDse & Femto Grade Clock Mod; Atlona AT-HD577; Preamplification: Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE Stage 2; Amplification: W4S SX1000 (x2); Bryston 10B Sub LR 50Hz, 24dB/Octave/2-way active crossover; Speakers: KEF Reference 107; JL Audio F112 x 2 set to mono on Sound Anchor stands; KEF X300A on Sound Anchor stands; Cables: Light Harmonic LightSpeed USB (standard); Synergistic Research: Active SE USB, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference & Precision Reference XLR ICs, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference speaker cables, Tesla LE Subwoofer 2 cables, Tranqility Base, QLS9 & T2 power cable; Black Cat Veloce 75 ohm; DH Lab Silver HDMI 1.4; W4S P1 Ultra Power cables; DH Labs Power Plus AC Cable; Shunyata Venom 3. Pioneer BDR-208.

  3. #3
    Supercilious twit orgel's Avatar
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    At this point, the only (legal) options are to have access to a PS3 with the right firmware version or choose from the rather limited (but high quality, IME) selection of DSD downloads available. I hope this situation changes in the future — I guess it's pretty much up to Sony and/or the record companies.

    Once you have the DSD files, you need either a DSD-capable DAC and software capable of delivering the DSD info to the DAC, or else software (or hardware like this) that can convert DSD to PCM.

    --David
    Listening Room: Mac mini > Audiophilleo2 with PurePower > Mytek Stereo192-DSD > W4S STP-SE > W4S ST-500 > Amphion Argon3 (Details)

    Office: Mac Pro > iFi nano iDSD > JBL LSR305

    Mobile: iPhone 5S > iFi nano iDSD > JH Audio JH5

  4. #4
    Senior Member REShaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by orgel View Post
    At this point, the only (legal) options are to have access to a PS3 with the right firmware version or choose from the rather limited (but high quality, IME) selection of DSD downloads available. I hope this situation changes in the future — I guess it's pretty much up to Sony and/or the record companies.

    Once you have the DSD files, you need either a DSD-capable DAC and software capable of delivering the DSD info to the DAC, or else software (or hardware like this) that can convert DSD to PCM.

    --David
    Thank you,
    Richard
    Software: OS X Yosemite, iTunes, Amarra Symphony & iRC, Audirvana Plus+, BitPerfect & DSD Master, Decibel, Fidelia, Pure Music; Computer: Mac Mini (2011, 2.7 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo i7, 16GB, int. SSD 256GB); Video: 27" Cinema Thunderbolt Display; Storage: Promise Pegasus 12TB R6 Raid 5 & 8TB R4 Raid 5; Digital: Oppo BDP-95; Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2 DSDse & Femto Grade Clock Mod; Atlona AT-HD577; Preamplification: Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE Stage 2; Amplification: W4S SX1000 (x2); Bryston 10B Sub LR 50Hz, 24dB/Octave/2-way active crossover; Speakers: KEF Reference 107; JL Audio F112 x 2 set to mono on Sound Anchor stands; KEF X300A on Sound Anchor stands; Cables: Light Harmonic LightSpeed USB (standard); Synergistic Research: Active SE USB, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference & Precision Reference XLR ICs, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference speaker cables, Tesla LE Subwoofer 2 cables, Tranqility Base, QLS9 & T2 power cable; Black Cat Veloce 75 ohm; DH Lab Silver HDMI 1.4; W4S P1 Ultra Power cables; DH Labs Power Plus AC Cable; Shunyata Venom 3. Pioneer BDR-208.

  5. #5
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Orgel summarized beautifully. As I've posted numerous times, feel free to PM me for my PDF guide.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.

  6. #6
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    How Can You Rip SACD Files ?

    I've only known about the Playstation method as well then I read an article about Audirvana Plus in the Sept issue of Absolute Sound: "For audiophiles with large SACD collections Audirvana Plus also offers an easy way to play them through your computer audio system. Merely rip them into your computer (you will need a third-party blu-ray drive as Apple doesn't officially support blu-ray hardware) and then add them to the Audirvana Plus playlist and push "play". I use Audirvana and this has to be incorrect info...???

  7. #7
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djvitamind View Post
    I've only known about the Playstation method as well then I read an article about Audirvana Plus in the Sept issue of Absolute Sound: "For audiophiles with large SACD collections Audirvana Plus also offers an easy way to play them through your computer audio system. Merely rip them into your computer (you will need a third-party blu-ray drive as Apple doesn't officially support blu-ray hardware) and then add them to the Audirvana Plus playlist and push "play". I use Audirvana and this has to be incorrect info...???
    That is blatantly incorrect info. The only way (other than ripping DSD via hacked PS3 as I and others have described in detail) is professionally via Sonoma workstation, or a fairly techy DIY modification approach where you'd need to go in and grab DSD off the SACD player chip before the PCM conversion, and then send it to your DSD-capable DAC, via, say SDIF or I2S....not worth talking about in this general thread (folks have DIY'd it for their Twisted Pear DACS, etc). Net/net, no "merely rip them into your computer" solution at all!! What the computer and BluRay disc would see is 16/44 redbook layer.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.

  8. #8
    Love CA Jay192's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ted_b View Post
    Orgel summarized beautifully. As I've posted numerous times, feel free to PM me for my PDF guide.
    Hi Ted, a slightly different question, but around the time the PS3 SACD ripper came out wasn't there some discussion happening about using HDMI splitters to utilise that hires feed? I guess that didn't go anywhere post PS3?

  9. #9
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay192 View Post
    Hi Ted, a slightly different question, but around the time the PS3 SACD ripper came out wasn't there some discussion happening about using HDMI splitters to utilise that hires feed? I guess that didn't go anywhere post PS3?
    Jay192,
    I've written about HDMI de-embedders ever since I reviewed the original Atlona box 2 years ago on Audio Circle. There are several folks still using that inexpensive approach, but it is not DSD. It requires the SACD player to be set to downrez to PCM (usually 24/88, sometimes higher) then send PCM across HDMI and have the de-embedder grab it and send it via coax or toslink (to your DAC), while passing the HDMI along to a handshake end device (like a receiver or pre/pro). It's still a perfectly good way to listen to 24/192 2 channel BluRay on your DAC, and if you do not have a DSD-capable DAC it's quite good for the above-PCM solution. Monoprice makes a box for like $50.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.

  10. #10
    Senior Member REShaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ted_b View Post
    Jay192,
    I've written about HDMI de-embedders ever since I reviewed the original Atlona box 2 years ago on Audio Circle. There are several folks still using that inexpensive approach, but it is not DSD. It requires the SACD player to be set to downrez to PCM (usually 24/88, sometimes higher) then send PCM across HDMI and have the de-embedder grab it and send it via coax or toslink (to your DAC), while passing the HDMI along to a handshake end device (like a receiver or pre/pro). It's still a perfectly good way to listen to 24/192 2 channel BluRay on your DAC, and if you do not have a DSD-capable DAC it's quite good for the above-PCM solution. Monoprice makes a box for like $50.
    Yes, thanks to Ted, for some time, now, I have used the Atlona AT HD577 from Oppo BDP-95 (HDMI audio out) to HD577 via S/DIF/coax BNC to W4S Dac2 & via XLR to preamp (not receiver or prepro). It's not what I prefer, but, I believe Ted said in this way the arrangement by-passes the Oppo's Dac(s) which are the same Dacs (9018 Sabre) as the Dac2 (but implemented differently - read better output - according to EJ at Wyred). I do not know what the other method sounds like, but what I am able to produce gets high praise from other listeners (I am already there).
    Best,
    Richard
    Software: OS X Yosemite, iTunes, Amarra Symphony & iRC, Audirvana Plus+, BitPerfect & DSD Master, Decibel, Fidelia, Pure Music; Computer: Mac Mini (2011, 2.7 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo i7, 16GB, int. SSD 256GB); Video: 27" Cinema Thunderbolt Display; Storage: Promise Pegasus 12TB R6 Raid 5 & 8TB R4 Raid 5; Digital: Oppo BDP-95; Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2 DSDse & Femto Grade Clock Mod; Atlona AT-HD577; Preamplification: Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE Stage 2; Amplification: W4S SX1000 (x2); Bryston 10B Sub LR 50Hz, 24dB/Octave/2-way active crossover; Speakers: KEF Reference 107; JL Audio F112 x 2 set to mono on Sound Anchor stands; KEF X300A on Sound Anchor stands; Cables: Light Harmonic LightSpeed USB (standard); Synergistic Research: Active SE USB, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference & Precision Reference XLR ICs, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference speaker cables, Tesla LE Subwoofer 2 cables, Tranqility Base, QLS9 & T2 power cable; Black Cat Veloce 75 ohm; DH Lab Silver HDMI 1.4; W4S P1 Ultra Power cables; DH Labs Power Plus AC Cable; Shunyata Venom 3. Pioneer BDR-208.

  11. #11
    Love CA Jay192's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by REShaman View Post
    Yes, thanks to Ted, for some time, now, I have used the Atlona AT HD577 from Oppo BDP-95 (HDMI audio out) to HD577 via S/DIF/coax BNC to W4S Dac2 & via XLR to preamp (not receiver or prepro). It's not what I prefer, but, I believe Ted said in this way the arrangement by-passes the Oppo's Dac(s) which are the same Dacs (9018 Sabre) as the Dac2 (but implemented differently - read better output - according to EJ at Wyred). I do not know what the other method sounds like, but what I am able to produce gets high praise from other listeners (I am already there).
    Best,
    Richard
    Quote Originally Posted by ted_b View Post
    Jay192,
    I've written about HDMI de-embedders ever since I reviewed the original Atlona box 2 years ago on Audio Circle. There are several folks still using that inexpensive approach, but it is not DSD. It requires the SACD player to be set to downrez to PCM (usually 24/88, sometimes higher) then send PCM across HDMI and have the de-embedder grab it and send it via coax or toslink (to your DAC), while passing the HDMI along to a handshake end device (like a receiver or pre/pro). It's still a perfectly good way to listen to 24/192 2 channel BluRay on your DAC, and if you do not have a DSD-capable DAC it's quite good for the above-PCM solution. Monoprice makes a box for like $50.
    Thanks guys. I'm a 'TV-hater' so have that 'hidden' in another room, and in the main living room where the main audio system lives I'm wanting to have a projector / pull down screen setup and have the BluRay with 24/88+ audio integrated with that. I'm just thinking of the best way to handle the cabling (projector to screen is 5m horizontal, and screen will be ~above amps and DAC (have no pre-amp) ...also got to think of the carpentry involved! I know we're not a hi-res Home Theatre forum here but I'll do some homework (also on good / bluray players that will spit out 24bit and not 16), perhaps ask you both some more questions if it's ok (may be a new thread with correct topic too). ... that'll be as soon as I start / finish my PS3 downgrade experiment (to 3.55) using the E3 Flasher ...

  12. #12
    Senior Member REShaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay192 View Post
    Thanks guys. I'm a 'TV-hater' so have that 'hidden' in another room, and in the main living room where the main audio system lives I'm wanting to have a projector / pull down screen setup and have the BluRay with 24/88+ audio integrated with that. I'm just thinking of the best way to handle the cabling (projector to screen is 5m horizontal, and screen will be ~above amps and DAC (have no pre-amp) ...also got to think of the carpentry involved! I know we're not a hi-res Home Theatre forum here but I'll do some homework (also on good / bluray players that will spit out 24bit and not 16), perhaps ask you both some more questions if it's ok (may be a new thread with correct topic too). ... that'll be as soon as I start / finish my PS3 downgrade experiment (to 3.55) using the E3 Flasher ...
    Sorry Jay192. Do not feel I have the experience to respond in a useful way. Acknowledging this rather than remain silent or ignore your further questions. I am confident that other posters with the requisite experience and technical expertise will fill the nano-second vacuum my absence might cause. Hope you find answers to questions yet to be posed.
    Best,
    Richard
    Software: OS X Yosemite, iTunes, Amarra Symphony & iRC, Audirvana Plus+, BitPerfect & DSD Master, Decibel, Fidelia, Pure Music; Computer: Mac Mini (2011, 2.7 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo i7, 16GB, int. SSD 256GB); Video: 27" Cinema Thunderbolt Display; Storage: Promise Pegasus 12TB R6 Raid 5 & 8TB R4 Raid 5; Digital: Oppo BDP-95; Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2 DSDse & Femto Grade Clock Mod; Atlona AT-HD577; Preamplification: Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE Stage 2; Amplification: W4S SX1000 (x2); Bryston 10B Sub LR 50Hz, 24dB/Octave/2-way active crossover; Speakers: KEF Reference 107; JL Audio F112 x 2 set to mono on Sound Anchor stands; KEF X300A on Sound Anchor stands; Cables: Light Harmonic LightSpeed USB (standard); Synergistic Research: Active SE USB, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference & Precision Reference XLR ICs, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference speaker cables, Tesla LE Subwoofer 2 cables, Tranqility Base, QLS9 & T2 power cable; Black Cat Veloce 75 ohm; DH Lab Silver HDMI 1.4; W4S P1 Ultra Power cables; DH Labs Power Plus AC Cable; Shunyata Venom 3. Pioneer BDR-208.

  13. #13
    Senior Member REShaman's Avatar
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    jay192, as far as your request for a blu-ray player, my history with OPPO includes BDP-83SE, 93 and 95 which I use in my 2ch system (main). Superb performance, support. Highly recommended.
    I am comfortable responding to your last post with my present comments.
    Good fortune,
    Richard
    Software: OS X Yosemite, iTunes, Amarra Symphony & iRC, Audirvana Plus+, BitPerfect & DSD Master, Decibel, Fidelia, Pure Music; Computer: Mac Mini (2011, 2.7 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo i7, 16GB, int. SSD 256GB); Video: 27" Cinema Thunderbolt Display; Storage: Promise Pegasus 12TB R6 Raid 5 & 8TB R4 Raid 5; Digital: Oppo BDP-95; Wyred 4 Sound DAC-2 DSDse & Femto Grade Clock Mod; Atlona AT-HD577; Preamplification: Wyred 4 Sound STP-SE Stage 2; Amplification: W4S SX1000 (x2); Bryston 10B Sub LR 50Hz, 24dB/Octave/2-way active crossover; Speakers: KEF Reference 107; JL Audio F112 x 2 set to mono on Sound Anchor stands; KEF X300A on Sound Anchor stands; Cables: Light Harmonic LightSpeed USB (standard); Synergistic Research: Active SE USB, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference & Precision Reference XLR ICs, Tesla LE Acoustic Reference speaker cables, Tesla LE Subwoofer 2 cables, Tranqility Base, QLS9 & T2 power cable; Black Cat Veloce 75 ohm; DH Lab Silver HDMI 1.4; W4S P1 Ultra Power cables; DH Labs Power Plus AC Cable; Shunyata Venom 3. Pioneer BDR-208.

  14. #14
    Love CA Jay192's Avatar
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    Thanks Richard

  15. #15
    Rip SACD files; Do you mean from your player or that you already have a SACD iso. Because that is the first
    step if you have a player is to rip the iso file. After
    that, you can extract the .dff files with scarletbook and convert to 24/96 PCM with audiogate (free.)

    Not all SACD iso files can be ripped this way. I downloaded some from Mojave productions that
    scarletbook wouldn't process.

    I had to use foobar. Many people here have access to outragous equipment and softwares costing thousands
    of dollars. It's just a guess but I would assume that
    these people are professionals that have access to
    their companies' equipment.

    --TomS
    Last edited by tomstatham; 08-22-2012 at 10:10 AM. Reason: readable

  16. #16
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomstatham View Post
    Rip SACD files; Do you mean from your player or that you already have a SACD iso. Because that is the first
    step if you have a player is to rip the iso file. After
    that, you can extract the .dff files with scarletbook and convert to 24/96 PCM with audiogate (free.)

    Not all SACD iso files can be ripped this way. I downloaded some from Mojave productions that
    scarletbook wouldn't process.

    I had to use foobar. Many people here have access to outragous equipment and softwares costing thousands
    of dollars. It's just a guess but I would assume that
    these people are professionals that have access to
    their companies' equipment.

    --TomS
    Mojave Productions SACD.iso's are not scarletbook AFAIK...they look to be homemade authored ISO's that usually house DVD-A material for SACD players. And yes, they can't be extracted for those reasons. Ripped SACD's via PS3 (not expensive company-owned equipment) will extract just fine.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.

  17. #17
    What I find really strange is that some record companies ask more $ for DSD downloads than for the physical SACD containing the same files. See for instance Dijkstra's nice DSD-recorded Bach motets: Channel Classics sells the SACD for €17 and the DSD files for €30 even though manufacturing a SACD, printing the liner notes etc. has to be more expensive than putting up DSD files for download.

  18. #18
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris75 View Post
    What I find really strange is that some record companies ask more $ for DSD downloads than for the physical SACD containing the same files. See for instance Dijkstra's nice DSD-recorded Bach motets: Channel Classics sells the SACD for €17 and the DSD files for €30 even though manufacturing a SACD, printing the liner notes etc. has to be more expensive than putting up DSD files for download.
    Yes, as we've discussed a few times already, Jared Sacks of Channel Classics explains that these are the master tapes, the family jewels...unlike the SACD discs. And yes, people can now rip SACD so if you want to go that route then buy the SACD for less money and do the DIY work yourself.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by ted_b View Post
    Yes, as we've discussed a few times already, Jared Sacks of Channel Classics explains that these are the master tapes, the family jewels...unlike the SACD discs. And yes, people can now rip SACD so if you want to go that route then buy the SACD for less money and do the DIY work yourself.
    By following this logic, record labels in my view are pushing SACDs to go the same way as DRM'd downloads -- down the drain.

  20. #20
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris75 View Post
    By following this logic, record labels in my view are pushing SACDs to go the same way as DRM'd downloads -- down the drain.
    Not sure I follow. SACDs have not been flying off any shelves...ever! The latest reports say that there has been a small but positive spike in SACD sales, maybe related to the new interest in DSD. But to predict SACDs are on their death bed is to preach news that's 10 years old.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.

  21. #21
    I think that if the DSD layer of SACDs was as easy to rip as the redbook layer, SACDs would find interest among the growing number of people who want to play high-resolution music files. But I guess that it is too late to make SACDs easy to rip. I do regret this because high-resolution music is a big improvement over redbook CDs, and SACDs could have been a very nice bridge from redbook CDs to high-res downloads, if not for their built-in DRMs.

  22. #22
    Masters Level Member ted_b's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris75 View Post
    I think that if the DSD layer of SACDs was as easy to rip as the redbook layer, SACDs would find interest among the growing number of people who want to play high-resolution music files. But I guess that it is too late to make SACDs easy to rip. I do regret this because high-resolution music is a big improvement over redbook CDs, and SACDs could have been a very nice bridge from redbook CDs to high-res downloads, if not for their built-in DRMs.
    It ain't difficult. I've ripped 600 of them, all with my trusty PS3.
    "We're all bozos on this bus"....F.T.