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Thread: JRiver Question

  1. #1

    JRiver Question

    At the moment I am using iTunes and Foobar2K as my Music Server Software. iTunes for Apple Lossless files and Foobar2k for HiRes FLAC files. This is mainly because I wanted to keep my HiRes files seperate to the rest of my music collection.

    However I am now thinking of moving across to JRiver as the main and one and only software package.

    Am I correct in thinking that I can set seperate libraries up in JRiver i.e one for Apples Lossless and one for HiRes files?

    Also at the moment I control my existing packages via relevant remote control apps on my iPad (MonkeyMote for Foobar and Apple Remote for itunes). Can anybody recommend a good remote control app for Jriver that will work across my home wireless network, obviously it goes without saying that this app would also need the function to change between libraries using my iPad.

    Cheers guys

  2. #2

    It is not clear to me.

    What you are going to run JRiver on. Bear in mind that it is Windows only, it will not run on an Apple OS.

    But JRemote is an iPod/Ipad app that will allow you to control JRiver (running on its Windows machine) from the Ipod or Ipad.

  3. #3
    Lost in lossless rmva's Avatar
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    I think this might be useful

    http://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Library_Manager

    cheers,
    Ruud.
    Ruud d'Alost

  4. #4

    Sorry

    I meant to say that currently the machine is an Asus Netbook running Windows XP. I may be looking into building a dedicated Music Server in the future but that will still be a Windows based machine...probably running Windows 7.

    Are there any Plugins that I need to download for Jriver when using Windows XP to bypass the internal soundcards?

    Currently I'm using a NuForce Icon uDAC2 but again will be chainging this in due course, more than likely to the JKDAC32.


  5. #5

    The rightmost big black

    The rightmost big black button with the Windows and JRiver logos on it at the top of this site will tell you most of what you need to know.

  6. #6

    Cheers Mark,Not Sure how I

    Cheers Mark,

    Not Sure how I managed to miss that....Doh!!

  7. #7

    I missed at first too

    Not knowing that it was the JRiver logo. Current level is 17, the guide it about 14, but it is much the same. Don't be put off by its apparent complication, it is much easier to do that to read.

  8. #8

    I Think I Realise

    I think I realise now why I have not used Jriver before, it seems so difficult to use and not a very good layout :-(

    I have downloaded the programme and imported my standard Apple Lossless files into JRiver...however it hasn't carried over half of my album art and I also keep getting an error message popping up, predominantly:

    "Media Center encountered errors while tagging and moving files. Check that the files exist, are not read-only, and are not in use by other programmes"

    They do exist....aren't read-only and not in use by another programme (I deleted iTunes from my netbook asmitbseemed to be conflicting with JRiver)

    Somebody Please help :-(

  9. #9

    I love it.

    Particularly in it's '3D' mode. Never had a problem, my stuff was all Windows Media Player. But then I would not touch iTunes (or anything Apple) with a bargepole.

  10. #10

    > Am I correct in thinking

    > Am I correct in thinking that I can set seperate libraries up
    > in JRiver i.e one for Apples Lossless and one for HiRes files?

    Yes. You can define a new library in File/Library/Library Manager.

    Of course, you can use tags or file folder names to separate them.

    For example, you could use the "sample rate" and "bit depth" tags to define a view that included only the 16/44.1 music files. A different view could include only the files with bit depth > 16 or sample rate > 44.1. I believe that MC has a standard view names file type. Right click on the view name and choose "Customize view" to see how it works. Look at "set rules for file display" to see how files are included or excluded from a view.

    Libraries are a one-at-a-time choice in MC. Moving between 16/44.1 files and high res. files would be much more easier if you use tags to distinguish files in a single library.

    Many ways to skin a cat in MC.

    Ask for help on the JRiver forum for the details of creating a new view.

    Bill



  11. #11

    To be honest I don't really

    To be honest I don't really care how good something is...if its not easy to use and set up...which in my mind something like this needs to be...it's not much use.

    From what I have seen so far.....JRiver is far from easy to use and setup. Looks like it may be back to iTunes and Foobar2k for me.

  12. #12

    Maybe the ALAC files are the

    Maybe the ALAC files are the cause of the problem you're having with J River. I had lots of problems with missing cover art with AAC files purchased via ITunes when I moved them between PCs (both FooBar and J River had this problem).

    I have had no problems with missing cover art etc with files in the open FLAC format, even when moving them between PCs. The proprietary formats Apple use work fine with iTunes but may give library type problems in other media players (and then you may be missing the decoders needed for playback . . .)

    I mostly like J River's way of doing things, even though other more minimalist players may sound better. I have no plans to go back to iTunes.

  13. #13
    Sophomore Member EuroChamp's Avatar
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    hi!1. iTunes does not save

    hi!

    1. iTunes does not save cover art, which is not manually added, in the same folder as the music file. So other software can not find the pictures.
    2. I cannot understand, why J.River is more complex than Foobar2000. I've used both and that is my conclusion. When you are not willed to read the menus at least for one time, it will be hard for us to help you.
    3. I would import all files into one library, then you will find out, that it's easy to show only specific files, e.g. HD files. It is much more work to change the library every time you want to hear a file from the other lib. Time will come that you own hundreds of albums. You forget, if it is a HD or not - and then?
    4. When J.River tells you that files are used by other software, it's true. Try a reboot, is it always the same file?

    Bernhard

  14. #14

    Please don't see me as a JRiver advocate.

    Where I come from.

    I was totally new to this computer audio stuff four months ago. I had not used (or even touched) any kind of computer for ten years. I wanted a flight simulator (for professional reasons). Bought a laptop, sorted out the flight simulator. What else can I use this thing for?

    I've got a lot of CDs, read the occasional hifi magazine. Used Windows Media Player to rip and play CDs, went quite well. Found out about JRiver by accident, then found this site.

    Downloaded/installed JRiver free trial. Took all of ten minutes, maybe less. Pressed the JRiver 'copy library' or whatever button, can't remember. A few minutes later it was done, played a few CDs. Saw the '3D' interface, tried it,liked it. I had not made ANY ajdustments, just let it use the defaults. All worked fine.

    Then I read the 'black button' guide, doing it as I went along. Took about 20 minutes to totally optimise everything, (WASAPI Event Style Play from memory,set Windows Control Panel 'Speaker' to a speed you never use, don't make JRiver the default, all that stuff. Genuinely, 20 minutes, maybe a couple more.

    I have now got the best sound I ever heard, far better than any CD player. And I love the '3D' interface. Doing a few hi res downloads now.

    So that's why I like it!

    PS: you say you don't care how good anything is, as long as it is easy to set up. JRiver is not difficult, as surely you can see from the above. If you don't care and just want it easy, stay as you are. Sorry.

  15. #15
    Mastiff Level Member Paul.Raulerson's Avatar
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    Mark and Apple --- vampire

    Mark and Apple --- vampire and sunlight?

    JRiver is more complex than iTunes, in some cases, not as well designed.
    But load it up, set it into theater view if you have it connected to a monitor, then user JRemote to control the beastie. It sounds pretty good.

    About equal to a Mac with iTunes playing bit perfectly.

    -Paul


    1. Main Music: AIFF Library -> Mac Mini i5 (Late 2012) -> MacOS Mavericks -> JRMC 19 -> Kimber USB -> iFi USB Power -> iFi Gemini -?> iFi DSD Nano -> Kimber PJB -> Parasound 2200 Preamp -> Kimber PJB -> Outlaw Audio M2200 Monoblocks -> Nodost Flatline MKII Speaker cables -> Large Advents
    2. Bedroom -> Macbook Pro -> MacOS Mavericks -> JRMC19 -> Audioquest Cinnamon USB -> Wavelength Proton> NAD BEE326 -> Nordost Flatline MKII -> Baby Advents
    3. Office -> Experimental System, changes when I want it to.



  16. #16

    Right ive decided to

    Right ive decided to persevere and have another go today.......hmmm seem to have hit another problem.....because I deleted my ALAC files out of JRiver yesterday it now just overlooks the files and "says it has ignored them because they were previously deleted"

    It's little things like this that make JRiver annoying to use.....i really want it to work because of the good things I have heard about it.

  17. #17
    Male Member crisnee's Avatar
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    Jason, just take your time

    Jason, just take your time and go through the options menu. There you can set up what JRiver will do with files such as ones once deleted.

    After you've spent a little time browsing the options and reading a little, delete your library (not the actual files) and start over. Ideally before you start over put all your music files in one area or one tree of file folders. Then set it to auto import the root of that tree and everything in that tree will be imported to your library. Whenever you add anything into any of the folders in that tree they will be automatically imported as will any new folders you add into that tree.

    If you delete or move a file from that tree from outside of JRiver, the original file will still be listed in the JRiver library so if you then try to access it, JRiver will tell you to make sure it's not missing etc. You can compensate for this sort of behaviour by setting up particular options, or better yet, just delete/move files from within JRiver.

    If you spend a little time with JRiver you will find it to be quite easy to use--on a basic level. However it is almost limitless in what it can do and look like, but to use it to near its limits will take lots of patience and studying.

    I've explored quite a bit of music software and I find JRiver to be the best designed in terms of all encompassing functions of any player I've tried. It's not perfect and has frustrated me at times. It's main problem is the lack of indepth and organized documentation, which is really too bad and ironic as it has so much that warrants explanation.

    -Chris

  18. #18

    @Paul

    You've got it the wrong way round, I'm the sunlight.

    Apple and Microsoft are bad as each other. Apple tries to lock everyone in by (A) pretty good products, (B) making it all as 'proprietary' as they can. Microsoft see something being good and successful, write something similar, and incorporate it for 'free' in Windows. So no one bothers to load the original one. Where is the Netscape browser and that nice Digital Equipment Corp one now?

    Cheers.

  19. #19

    Thanks Chris,This is what I

    Thanks Chris,

    This is what I am beginning to realise, and maybe trying to look at this at 10.00pm after a day at work was not the best idea :-)

    I have come back to it this morning and I am beginning to understand it a lot more. I have realised when I was trying to reimport my files I had the box ticked that said "Ignore previously deleted files". After correcting that it has now imported the files again.

    JRiver has downloaded some art work and not others for my ALAC files. Does this mean that I am going to have to click on each album and manually download the art work from the internet?

    Also I haven't yet imported my HiRes files into JRiver....when I do what is the easiest way to be able to search for each of these seperatly....i.e. distinguish between 16/44.1 files and then all my Higher Res Files?

    I have heard that JRiver is pretty powerfull and a good Music Server Software, I know I just need to persevere and play around with it....I am jsu used to itunes which takes no setting up :-)

  20. #20

    "Ignores them because they were previously deleted"

    You did delete them. What else do you expect it to do? At least it told you.

    There are some library options somewhere, can't remember them offhand exactly. But another button press will put the files back.

    You will get there. My transfer from WMP to JRiver had a few screw ups. Mainly with the 'metadata'. But WAV files, which I use exclusively, can be a touch bloody-minded about metadata. But I sorted them

    PS: Chris is absolutely right about JRiver needing a little perseverance. But the end result is superb, so it pays off.



  21. #21
    Trouble maker... Audio_ELF's Avatar
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    Where are they now...

    Where is the Netscape browser and that nice Digital Equipment Corp one now?
    Well Netscape (who "copied" most of the design from Mosaic) became FireFox.

    Digital Equipment Corp was bought by Compaq (with parts sold to Intel) and so in turn became part of HP.

    Eloise
    ...in my opinion / experience...
    While I agree "everything may matter" working out what actually affects the sound is a tricker thing.
    And I agree "Trust your ears" but equally don't allow them to fool you so trust them with a bit of skepticism.

  22. #22

    OK....I'm getting there

    OK....I'm getting there slowly :-)

    I have now sussed out how to download the album art and it is slowly working through the albums as we speak. I have also been playing around with the tabs and having a look at different views etc and its beginning to become a bit more logical and understandable.

    Unfortunately patience wasn't something I was endowed with and I just tend to want everything to happen now. This is not the case with MC17 and it obviously takes time to understand it and set it up correctly.

    So that is my Lossless music sorted....now I need to import my HiRes FLAC files and then set up a view option to allow me just to view FLAC (this is OK as its only HiRes stuff thats in FLAC).

    I then need to have a look at and understand how to set up MC17 or music playback and optimising the settings for use with my DAC (Nuforce Icon uDac2) and system.

    Thanks for all the help and advice so far :-)

  23. #23

    Jason36, I think you should

    Jason36, I think you should go back to a CD player. No menus to read there or instructions.

  24. #24
    Mastiff Level Member Paul.Raulerson's Avatar
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    Check out Scary Gary...

    Scary Gary!

    It reminds me of you a tiny bit. A retired vampire who no longer sucks blood living in the suburbs with his henchcritter....

    And I did mean it with good humor.

    1. Main Music: AIFF Library -> Mac Mini i5 (Late 2012) -> MacOS Mavericks -> JRMC 19 -> Kimber USB -> iFi USB Power -> iFi Gemini -?> iFi DSD Nano -> Kimber PJB -> Parasound 2200 Preamp -> Kimber PJB -> Outlaw Audio M2200 Monoblocks -> Nodost Flatline MKII Speaker cables -> Large Advents
    2. Bedroom -> Macbook Pro -> MacOS Mavericks -> JRMC19 -> Audioquest Cinnamon USB -> Wavelength Proton> NAD BEE326 -> Nordost Flatline MKII -> Baby Advents
    3. Office -> Experimental System, changes when I want it to.



  25. #25

    > I then need to have a look

    > I then need to have a look at and understand how to set up MC17
    > or music playback and optimising the settings for use with my DAC
    > (Nuforce Icon uDac2) and system.

    Start with direct sound as the output mode. In the Player/DSP Studio dialog, uncheck "output format" (and the other checkboxes on the left.)

    Once you get things working with DirectSound, you can experiment with WASAPI (event style).

    > Unfortunately patience wasn't something I was endowed with and I
    > just tend to want everything to happen now.

    You also blamed the JRiver software for something your own lack of knowledge caused. You won't find that to be a productive mindset for computer audio.

    > This is not the case with MC17 and it obviously takes time
    > to understand it and set it up correctly.

    iTunes does some things differently than JRiver does. When you moved from one program to the other, understanding those differences became important.

    You said that you removed iTunes. You may have removed the data files containing cover art images that iTunes created. You could have located those images, copied them to the folders containing your music files and renamed them as folder.jpg. (JRiver can locate cover art in each music file, it can use a file named folder.jpg as the album art for every file in that folder or it can store album art separately.)

    The more you know, the fewer problems you will have. The more you know, the more easily you can diagnose problems and fix them.

    Bill




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