Rhino Records Downloads

We're getting there. The more sites I see springing up offering lossless downloads, the more I realise my musical preferences are not within the mainstream. Regardless, Rhino's offerings seem to be heading in a very positive direction. Finally someone out there offering something other than the same regurgitated 'audiophile' artists bundle! Though not to my tastes, I have to admit I'm thrilled to see some mainstream/poopular artists being represented in lossless formats. Shouldn't be too many years before I can buy my fill of 'post-everything, drone, sludge, melodic genre crushing atmospheric' garbage... Can't wait!

Until then I'll have to keep stealing music, avoiding iTunes, and buying tickets ;)

... but yet another site that pretty much all of us outside North America cannot enjoy!

What I don't understand is how sites like Linn in the UK can and do allow downloads to everyone. There has got to be a solution for sites like Rhino and HDTracks...

Mani.

is the digital release a remaster? and why should you pay more for download then psysical cd? this is just ridiculous

We have a winner.......Prince's Sexy M.F. available in hi-def download.

that induces people to steal music, is to restrict selling it. OR is it the financial system in the USA, that shuns foreign credit cards. Most likely distributorships in other countries are restricting downloads to occur.
The Chinese will figure out a way, and best of all it won't cost anything, hence encouraging to steal.

Further to the 'Only in the USA' comments, this is from the Rhino site :

At this time digital downloads are only available to customers using a credit or debit card issued by a U.S bank with a U.S. billing address, or those making the purchase and downloading the file while in the U.S. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.

I wonder why they feel an apology is necessary? It makes it appear as though the decision is out of their control, as though some sort of trade restriction is in place. I've never had any sort of problem at all, purchasing goods from US companies, until it comes to digital downloads of 'most' music. I say 'most' because this restriction certainly doesn't apply to all music download sites.

It feels to me like the sort of business stupidity we have come to expect of the major record labels. I'd love to know the real reason!

Fixed feelings about this one.

Rhino are being proactive in offering lossless downloads which is very welcome but:
- why are the lossless files more expansive than MP3’s?
- 16/44.1k tracks should not be called Hi-Def, very misleading. Rhino have a few DVD-A disks so no reason not to release 24/96 or above, maybe they will, I hope so.
- A shame there's no AIFF option
- as already mentioned why not available to customers worldwide.

One day!

We know what HiRez is; these aren't hirez. Just because they also sell Mp3's doesn't give them the right to confuse an already confused public. Their website does do a certain level of educating, but to lower the bar to say FLAC is HiDef is BS. if you show someone VHS quality, then DVD you still can't now call DVD "BlURay".

Wow, the glass is more than half empty today! You guys are a tough crowd (more than usual).

I am very excited about this and hope others are as well :~)

24/96 to call it Very-High-Def, and 24/192, Super-Very-Hi-Def. ;)
Seriously, your name goes a long way with the industry's move to downloadable content. They should know better than to call redbook HD. Give them two pats on the head for doing this lossless stuff, then a kick in the rear for their misinformation.

Hi Ted - I hear you about calling Redbook high def. I do have a message into Rhino already to chat about some things :~)

Good move in the right direction!

On the subject of why only US, it might be because in the olden days (and maybe still now) companies sometimes used to license rights to music geographically. It obviously a big job to clear up all those copyright issues. Not sure or not if that has something to do with why they are only selling in US.

Hi Guys - I posted this in a previous discussion about international availability of downloads. I'll repost here as well.

Here is part of an email discussion I had with someone very familiar with this topic. I removed the identifying information where appropriate but the main points of the message are really what matters in this discussion. This person wrote the following to me late in 2008:

"The problem with international sales of downloadable music is this:

Recordings are generally speaking a work of art and thus protected under copyright laws. The artitst who originally composed the muisc do have the legal rights to it for 70 years (in the US) or 50 years (in the EU). When these works are sold as a recording there is something called "mechanicals" involed. A part of the product price goes to the author or to the organization representing him. Legally these mechanicals have to be paid in the country of the purchaser as the different countries do have very different calculation approaches and rates. If these mechanical rates are not paid it technically is an illegal download as the author of the music will not participate from the sale

Furthermore there is also the problem of value addet tax (VAT). In the U.S. this does not yet exist on internet purchases but in the EU you do have to pay the VAT for downloads in the country in which the purchaser resides. With different VAT rates in different countries this means different prices for identical products. Again technically speaking a downloader would have to notifiy the local tax office to pay VAT. Obviously that is close to impossible to check and a U.S. company would find it burdensome to pay VAT abroad, especially as this would drive up their prices.

Finally many works are protected by distribution agreements only giving local rights of sale as other companies my have legally acquired the rights to these recordings elsewhere.

With all of this you will find that [many companies] don't sell outside the US as the legal implications would be extremely difficult to tackle. Just to give you an idea: i-Tunes in Europe is having different prices for identical downloads depending on the location of the downloader. They have to report to 27 different tax offices and 27 different copyright organizations monthly and use 23 different languages in that and pay accordingly. That is something you will not see many US companies willing to do for a market that has not embraced commercial downloads. To put it in a nutshell: It seems even i-Tunes in the EU (who is the biggest fish in the pool by far) is loosing money to date."

I was stoked to read the post re Rhino but 3 seconds later I was equally as bummed.....
US only. Gosh darn it.

BTW, I can see why Rhino are saying 16bit/44.1 is Hi-Res IF the releases are fully 16bit/44.1.
Many modern CD releases don't get near 16bit....

Thanks Chris - that was much more than I could contribute on the topic of geographical issues!

Well I will be very excited with you Chris. This has been a long time coming. I think this will be a very successful venture for the folks who created Rhino. While a quick scan of the website yielded about a 50% return on my searches, I am sure they will be adding more artists as demand warrants.

It's nice to know that if I can't find that CD I'm looking for at one of the used music stores or online, I can download and enjoy without delay, without worrying about scratches.

I must note that it appears you will only be allowed to download a track or album once after payment, so backup is necessary.

I'll have to register a grievance under NAFTA. So much for the free trade agreement with the U.S. ;)

On a brighter note the Rhino site has great offering of music for U.S. residents. The future is here.

Cheer up, the digital appears to be half price - 75 cents a track at the moment. Good deal.

Hey bottlerocket - I didn't even notice the half price sale going on for digital downloads! I decided to take advantage of it and purchased a ton of material. This is really cool.

Then I found out the Rhino Download Manager doesn't work on a single computer of mine, Windows or OS X. Check the screenshot below. This is what happens when one has to download $123 worth of files manually :~(

Click to enlarge

Well I certainly don't think the "HiDef" moniker is warranted but let's face it, Rhino is marketing to the uneducated masses that see nothing wrong with MP3. For this market segment, Redbook is HiDef.

I for one appreciate Rhino's wide download offering, price notwithstanding. HDTracks is my primary source, but they can't seem to get their catalog expanded very quickly.

I had trouble with the 1st order. I highly recommend downloading the download manager first before the first order (not sure how to do that thought) or make your first order very small. (Talking MAC OSX here) The download works off a download stack that looks like this "RhinoOrder-RH9322xxxxxx.rhdlm". This file went to my download folder. It then automatically opens this file via the Rhino Download Manager and does its thing. On the first order, it did not automatically open so that was very confusing. So if this happens, go find the .rhdlm file and click it and it will invoke the Rhino download manager. Also you need to set your preferences in the download manager to say where to put the files. It did import ALAC automatically into ITunes very well. I then converted to AIFF.

So I finished downloading over 250 tracks last night. The 50% off digital sale is wonderful. However, none of the FLAC files are properly tagged! Take a look at this screenshot. It appears Rhino made an error when tagging all the tracks. None of the information is readable by applications.

Chris
Do you know if downloads restricted to people using a USA physical address or to a USA ISP?
Frank

Just a note to everyone who's having problems, so far it does look like I got the Rhino download manager to work for my first order. The one thing I did was go into the download manager preferences and added my Rhino Username/pass. After that I went back to the page that showed up after placing the order and clicked "Download Your Order Now". Then the .rhdlm file popped up and I told firefox to use Rhino Download Manager to open the file. It seems to be downloading track by track, which is a bit of a pain IMHO, but at least it appears to be working.

This was with OS X.

I had no trouble with the download manager on Windows XP.

The improperly tagged tracks are really a pain though. I downloaded FLAC and used MAX to convert them to AIFF. ITunes picked up the album art, but I had to manually enter title, album, track etc. Until they get this fixed, I'm not going to download from Rhino. . .

I read Chris' article about Rhino with interest. So much interest that I went and downloaded Wrecking Ball. All went smoothly and it was a pleasant surprise to find that all digital downloads are 50% off. Somewhat disturbed by the HI DEF moniker that is actually CD quality but it sounds OK.

Today I went back and found 2 Allen Toussaint albums that I wanted. So I purchased them and the download manager kicked in. Out of 59 songs it could only get 20 songs. All of the rest came up with "ERROR: FILE NOT FOUND". AFter trying several methods of downloading 01) from the confirmation email, 02) manually, and 03) automaticaly from the download manger I caled the help line at 1-877-744-6651. I got a human on the first ring and, yes, he sounded like he was in a call center in India. He agreed that Rhino is having a lot of start up problems and could do no more than to forward my problem to management. I asked for a refund and he said he could not do that but I will hear back in 24 to 48 hours as to whether I get a refund or not. This has been my experience with Rhino. I think I will wait a while before ordering any more from Rhino. Give them some time to work the bugs out.

Chuck

Just an addendum.... I have received a call back from 'John' who has said that management will be calling me to help get the files I paid for and could not download. He also said they are going to refund the money I paid and still let me have the files. We shall see how it goes.

Well, I'd started my downloads last night before going to sleep. Woke up this morning to find 75% of them had timed out, and there wasn't any way to re-start them. Tried closing and re-opening the download manager and it started from the beginning, downloading the successful files all over again...

I chose FLAC, so all my metadata is trashed too. I'm surprised Dbpoweramp is at least showing as much as is in the screenshot - I've tried several apps on the Mac and they don't even show that level of detail - my comment fields appear to be empty from those apps. Will try dbpoweramp in a VM. It really doesn't help that the default Rhino names only include the track number & title, and then mix all the tracks together in one folder, otherwise you could tag based off of some of that info.

Chris - noted the authorship of a dCS review progresses...

Rather curious what you think of the Paganini DAC.

Do we have an ETA?

"Rather curious what you think of the Paganini DAC."

It's wonderful.

"Do we have an ETA?"

In the next few days.

I don't know how long the half off sale will last, but while it does I picked up the complete Ellington Reprise studio recordings for a ridiculous $30.

This was a Mosaic Records box set a few years back, and now goes for fairly large money as an OOP item.

Very, very nice.

Scott A.

Has anyone tried downloading ALAC or WMA to see if their tags are also screwed up? Was thinking about choosing ALAC for the next order.

Not yet, but I suppose it may be worth the $0.75 during the half price sale to test one track in these formats.

Apparently the 50% off sale just ended. I should have clicked the purchase button on the last few albums I'd been thinking of getting - it was still going when I was browsing this afternoon. At $7.50-$10 an album the pricing was about right for digital. At 20-50% more than the physical CDs I can't get too excited about Rhino...

I haven't done any rigorous testing - and it may very well just be me - but the flacs of the MJQ that I downloaded just don't sound that good.

Anyone else have an opinion on sound quality based on what they've bought?

Scott A.

I purchased Natalie Merchant's Motherland. . .sounds fine to me.

I sent a follow-up e-mail to Rhino customer service commenting on their sales-prevention pricing model for downloads. I'll post their reply (assuming I get one).

I'm jealous that album (Natalie Merchant's Motherland) is on my wanted list. Sadly living in the UK will mean I wouldn't be able to download it :-(

Anyone compared a Rhino download to a CD rip of the same album?

Being the kind who prefers holding the media in my hand, so i can listen or manipulate, i noticed there were some albums, like the doors' strange days for sale at 9.99 on one page, but 24.99 on a second page. i sent them an email; don't expect to hear back.

I compared a couple tracks for fun and heard no differences. Since I am a newbie, here's my rig so you can judge whether my opinion is worth considering!

iTunes (iMac)/CDs --> (sources) Apogee Duet /NAD C541i --> (amplification) Audio Outlaw RR2150/Headroom Micro --> (speakers/headphones) Paradigm Monitor 7 v.3, Paradigm PDR-10 v.3/AKG K701

Cables: (Interconnects) Straightwire Musicable, Kimber Heros; (Speaker) DiMarzio M-path, Blue Jeans Cable subwoofer cable

So far, I like the Rhino site, but don't love it. Browsing by artist is a bit cumbersome and the site layout is not as intuitive as some sites I've seen (I prefer HD Tracks' layout), but the downloads were quick (through Verizon FiOS) and they integrated into iTunes as advertised. Had no issues there.

It is very cool to make each album available for download in a variety of lossless formats (just FLAC would have been enough to make me happy). I do have issues with calling Redbook "Hi Def" -- although it is true that compared with an MP3, Redbook IS high def. Just another indication as to how all things audio revolve around that horrible lossy format. I guess I should start calling my old standard def DVDs "high def" since they are higher def than my even older VHS tapes. It is odd that the video world continues to go for more resolution while audio is sliding backwards. Perhaps this Rhino site signals a trend the other way? I sure hope so....

"I haven't done any rigorous testing - and it may very well just be me - but the flacs of the MJQ that I downloaded just don't sound that good.
Anyone else have an opinion on sound quality based on what they've bought?"

Hi Scott - After reading your post I did some testing myself. I downloaded track one from Emmylou Harris' Wrecking Ball album. I compared it to my CD ripped copy in FLAC. The two files sound different. My CD rip is much better. In fact the CD rip I have illuminates the HDCD indicator on my Alpha DAC but the downloaded version does not. There are a couple reasons why this could be.

1. The download may not be bit perfect.
2. The download is from a different master that was not done using a Pacific Microsonics Model Two. (I really doubt it)

I don't want to jump to conclusions yet, but it does not look good. I'm trying to get in contact with someone at Rhino about this.

Upon further review, some of the tracks I downloaded sound good -- others, not so much.... I sure hope they didn't transcode some of these "lossless" files from MP3s they had lying around.

Somehow this looks suspicious to me right from the start. A feeling added with some "logic". Look :

What they do all the time (it is their life) is remastering and reissueing. This means that the FIRST they would have done is provide all in hires. However, they do not. Now what could be the reason ?

I assume all the labels they issue are from Warner (meaning : all is legal).
It MUST be so that it is forbidden to remaster this and sell over the Internet, or otherwise they had done it.
So, what I would do, as the person who received the assignment to make something of Internet selling ... I'd grab EAC, take a normal CD and make it ready for sale/download.
Or something like that.

The way they do it makes no sense.

Now start speculating ...

"The download may not be bit perfect."

My son used some Linux program to check for missing data in some of the downloads I purchased which sounded a bit thin. Are there Mac and Windows equivalents? In my case, it turned out it was my OS that needed reinstalling not the Hi Def site.

The 50% off downloads sale must be a "Working Out The Bugs Sale". (Although they do ask for feedback on bugs...)

Hi James - It's impossible to check these files because we don't know the source of the original data. If Rhino says the source of the Emmylou Harris download is the actual CD or same master as the CD then we'll know something is up because the files are not the same.

What Linux program did your son use? If I know which one it was or what it does I'll be able to direct you to a Mac or PC equivalent.

I shouldn't say this - and Chris, if you think this goes too far into the realm of speculation please delete - but my first reaction Sunday was that I was hearing an mp3 file.

I don't think that's possible, but I do wonder if, as another poster suggests, someone is using EAC or the like to simply rip from cds. Truth to tell though, EAC rips sound better.

s.

edit - I really hope this is nothing, because the posted jazz catalog is fabulous: many, many albums that are hard to come by or easily missed. As I note elsewhere, I could easily spend money there for a long time to come.

“It is odd that the video world continues to go for more resolution while audio is sliding backwards”

Totally agree, its madness. The music industry seems to be happy to self destruct. When tapes came out they were worried that copying would destroy the music industry. When CD’s came out they thought the same but quite the opposite happened. Now there afraid to release true Hi-Def music because its easy to copy. The truth is doing nothing has led to pirating and the downfall of sales.

Apple at least gave them a life line but they still cant see the way forward when its so obvious. It wouldn’t be difficult for all record labels to offer 24/96 or above material. Sell them for a small premium over CD’s or even better the same price of CD’s then I’m sure sales would increase and pirating would decline not increase.

Surely Rhino aren’t using EAC or any other general ripping program and taking copies from the CD’s. They have access to the original masters.

You would hope the lossless files would be better than the CD or at worst equal. If they are indeed worse than the CD then it’s quite outrageous to be calling them Hi-Def.

Sorry if someone noted this already...like so many others I eagerly started tearing through the site drooling at the prospect of hearing so much good music in hi def. Issues related to the fact the music isn't really hi def aside, almost all of what was most desirable to me is only available in physical format. I really thought the recording industry was starting to get it. Oh well.

Chris, et al.,

Help me out here. Yes, I have heard of Rhino. However, they are not members of, or accredited with the Better Business Bureau and furthermore, their “Secure Network Solutions” logo on their site is not validated (when you click on the logo you get a popup that states that the site is not validated and that their status is “invalid”). Now, if they accepted PayPal, there would be no concerns.

I was very unhappy to see that they do not accept PayPal. They require you to provide your credit card information directly. Considering the lack of accreditation (that I could find) I am a bit leery of completing my original order. Can any of you help to ease my skepticism?

Their reputation is very strong as a supporter of classic rock music restoration, etc. However, they've clearly (IMO) stumbled here with their not-yet-ready-for-primetime download capability, HiDef mismarketing, and questionable ripping quality. It's for those reasons that I'd be hesitant, not their viability as a legitimate business (BBB or Secure Net capability).

No physical media, no booklet, no notes, no extras...for $4.00 more than buying the corresponding CD version from the site. Thanks, but no thanks.

This could be "exhibit A" of the music industry Not Getting It.

They’re really heading in the right direction though. If they can work out the bugs, then this will be a great service. I went ahead and downloaded some "nuggets" from days-gone-by (Commander Cody & His Lost Planet Airmen, Henry Paul - Grey Ghost, some early Seals & Crofts and even Purple Rain). I can't say that these sounded that great (to me, they actually sounded compressed - even though I downloaded the "high def" versions in Flack). It very well could be that the "compressed" sound I thought I heard is due to the actual recordings rather than being a result of the file formats – although I have ripped many CDs from that era and genre that sound so much better. All in all, it's nice to be able to go to a website and instantly download some old favorite’s right from the comfort of your home. Once they start to include true high def files and tune up their website (i.e.: fix their download manager, and work on getting the meta data right) then they will truly have something special.

I hope this post continues with current updates. I would like to know more about the files that are being sold as 16/44 lossless. Has anyone yet determined that these files are anything other than 16/44? The description of said files in one of the aforementioned posts as being "thin" is exactly how I would describe what I am hearing in the (few) files that I have downloaded. Has anyone compared any of these lossless downloads with any other lossy files??

Chris - did I miss something or is their 'hidef' file just lossless Redbook (16/44.1)? Seems kind of foolish to pony up $1.50 per track when you can jut buy the CD for $10 and rip it yourself?

Thanks for clarifying
bernard

Hi breagan - The HiDef files are 16/44.1. Your comments about price are not apples to apples.

It's $1.49 per track, but the complete album is cheaper than the sum of all tracks. For example the Emmylou Harris Wrecking Ball album in FLAC is $14.99 for twelve tracks. The Amazon price for the album is $10.99 with the cheapest shipping cost of $2.98 for a total of $13.97. The Rhino download here is $1.02 more expensive in quantitative terms. But factor in the drive to the store (time and transportation expense) v. getting it immediately, and not having to rip the CD thus saving a small bit of time, and I willing to go for the download every time.

That's just me of course. Thanks for your post breagan. I'm sure many more readers are thinking the same thing as you but they just don't post it :~)

I still have not received a call back on some tracks not received due to a File Not Found error. I've called their help desk twice. Both times the rep could not correct my problem, would not credit my purchase and said I'd receive a call back after speaking with management. No calls, no follow up. Pricing issues, download issues, bad service: who needs it.

I left a voicemail at Rhino two weeks ago and no call back yet either. Time for more calls to different people.

How about we all give them a call to voice out concerns and encourage them to improve things a bit. I'd love to help Rhino improve things so I can download much more content. Here is the regular Customer Service number with regular business hours (888) 440-4232. Maybe we can get through :~)

It's a sham(e) they do that. And Chris, since when do you have to drive somewhere to get Amazon deliveries? :)

Rhino needs to step it up; the " you never get a second chance to make a first impression" adage is so relevant in retail, especially in this getting-competitive techy niche (downloads). I guess, though, it;s not yet competitive enough. :(

"And Chris, since when do you have to drive somewhere to get Amazon deliveries? :)"

I love it! I was totally multi-tasking and side tracked thus the major screw-up :~)

I really don't think the slight additional cost for the 16/44 downloads has anything to do with the other more relevant issues at hand. If you're not willing to pony up for the additional cost to get immediate access to new music, then you can always order through Amazon and wait four days....The whole point of downloading is the convenience - the immediacy of the transaction. You’d have to pay a substantial increase to have Amazon overnight your order and even then, you’d still have to wait a day. I'm surprised the downloads don’t cost more…

more, but of questionable ripping quality, without any metadata (a FLAC benefit, typically) and use a troublesome download manager?? Hardly worth the convenience. And this coming from someone who has 1.5+TB of FLAC, etc . I'm not against it, but I'm beginning to think that many in the industry don't understand what the FLAC-savvy customer is used to. Some get it (Linn, Naim, HDTracks) but charge a premium too.

I started the questions about the quality of the flac files, but haven't followed up with any rigorous testing - not that I'm really capable of doing it anyway.

I can tell you this: the Ellington set sounds much better than the MJQ set, which is what made me question the quality of what I was hearing in the first place.

I still think there's something amiss, or at least there was in the case of the MJQ download and what Chris reported on a test track shortly thereafter. But based on the Ellington, I'm wondering if we're gonna find out the downloads aren't all bad, or all good, but spotty, which would be terrible news.

Scott A.

Exactly....those are the "more relevant issues at hand" that I was referring too. These are the issues that need to be resolved.

In most cases (at least for commercial muzak like these), I buy used CD's from Amazon for $5-$9. Arrives within a day or two (if you pick the shipping from a seller in your state), do your own ripping/format and keep the physical disc. Cheaper and longer lasting than a 16/44 d/load. Exceptions are 24/96 (or higher) or hard to find material.

I recently downloaded 'His Band and the Street Choir' by Van Morrison. Two tracks are less than 10 seconds long. After being on hold for over 30 minutes, a very friendly Indian gentleman answered. He put me on hold two times (making the call over an hour long) then told me I'd receive a call from Rhino customer service. This has yet to happen. I clicked 'email customer service' on the confirmation email only to have it returned as undeliverable. Rhino's supplied email address lacks a correct suffix - .co as opposed to .com After correcting their mistake I still have not received a response. I'm getting the distinct impression that Rhino will not help out after they have received payment - which showed up on my credit card within hours of the partial download. This is a great disappointment - I've got stacks of Rhino CDs and have always been impressed with the quality of the sound.

So - buyers beware. If you encounter any problems with your download you'll be out of luck. And money.

Quote: Kevin O'Toole...
So - buyers beware. If you encounter any problems with your download you'll be out of luck. And money.

My experience with Rhino is similar to Kevin's except that I gt my money back. I tried to download 2 Alen Toussaint albums and only got 1 album and 4 songs from the 2nd album. "File not found" was the error message I received. I also tried to email Rhino and my email bounced too. But I called and got hold of 'John' an Indian sounding accented man. He said he would have to talk to upper management and like Kevin they would contact me later. I was contacted on Monday after the Saturday that this happened and my credit card was charged back from Rhino for the full amount that both albums would have cost me. They really need to do some serious upgrading to their system or hire a consultant that knows something about online buyers, online websites, online sales, etc. They look bad coming out of the chute. Hope they get better.

Chuck

With all the above issues I don't know why anyone would buy anything from them. Incorrect advertising, poor quality tracks, poor customer service, expensive, download problems, incorrect tagging, etc etc. Especially when you can buy a CD, have the artwork etc and a hard copy for much less.

Hi Dan - Sadly I agree with you. After numerous attempts to contact Rhino at all different levels and offering to help any way I can I've received no acknowledgment of from anyone there. I will update the main article, as soon as I have a moment, to warn potential customers.

For what it's worth, I haven't had any problems with the downloads that I've purchased from the site. However, I do the downloads manually since the site's download manager seems to have glitches. My biggest concern was having to provide my credit card number rather than utilize a secure protocol - such as PayPal.

I still think the site has some real potential. It's a shame that no one at Rhino seems to care....This however, can't be the case. Somewhere within that organization, there must be a person who is concerned about consumer relations, public relations, marketing, etc. That person(s) would likely be very upset to discover that others within the organization are thumbing their noses at the company’s image and reputation by neglecting their responsibilities.

I might suggest that the “right” person has not been made aware of the situation. Those on the receiving end of Rhino’s posted email and telephone contact numbers are a proverbial conduit to the management that is concerned with image and negative PR. Sounds like someone is acting as the gatekeeper of the conduit. Perhaps they should be fired….Try contacting upper management.

It's not scientific - and I don't know what I'm doing - but FWIW I purchased a copy of Ellington's 1960s Reprise Recordings box set expressly for the purpose of comparing them to the flac files I downloaded.

(Thus turning, btw, my 'savings' buying the flac files to a net loss of...oh, never mind.)

Anyway, I'm going to carefully compare an extended portion of the flacs with the cds, and will let y'all know which sounds better on my modest little system.

Best,

Scott A.

http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?p...

The above link is a short list of Rhino's corporate executives.... Perhaps Rhino's Mark Pinkus (Strategic Marketing) might be interested in this matter....

(Thus turning, btw, my 'savings' buying the flac files to a net loss of...oh, never mind.)

LOL!!!! I love it.

Olive