• Meitner Audio MA-1 DAC Review

    Passionate, intelligent, and humble are words that come to mind when I think about Meitner Audio. Several conversations with the Meitner team gave me a very good feeling inside. It's always nice to talk to people who know their stuff, but don't feel the need to stand on a soapbox and tell it to the world. The Meitner team, lead by Ed Meitner, is passionate about very well engineered products that sound good. At Meitner the engineers have ears. This team with a remarkable history of audio innovation at EMM Labs has created a new brand in its effort to produce high quality components without the prices demanded by the no-holds-barred EMM products. The first product to carry the Meitner Audio name is the $7,000 MA-1 Digital to Analog Converter (DAC). Vivid and very detailed with lush yet tight bass and wonderful transients are the hallmarks of the MA-1. Capable of receiving 24 bit / 192 kHz audio on all six digital inputs, including asynchronous USB, the MA-1 is a must for the audition list of those in the market for a new DAC.




     

    EMM Labs -> Meitner Audio

    Ed Meitner has long been a digital audio pioneer who is well known for his work with SACD and DSD. Mention the name Meitner or EMM Labslink to a Recording or Mastering Engineer and it receives instant recognition. Audiophiles financially fortunate enough to own an EMM Labs DAC have a near unanimous fondness for Ed's components. In fact while texting a record executive and fellow audiophile at Sony Music last week I mentioned the upcoming Meitner MA-1 review. The response I received was, "Can't wait to hear more about it, Ed is a genius." It's clear that Ed Meitner and EMM Labs have transcended the traditional boundaries between professional and consumer audio. Ed's newest endeavor in the consumer world of high end audio is launching the Meitner Audio brand. The brand will offer high quality components at less expensive prices than its parent EMM Labs. The EMM products retain all the bells and whistles while the Meitner Audio products are built with the same engineering prowess but lower cost components. If ever there was a poster child for trickle down technology it's Meitner Audio. The new brand will enable audiophiles with champagne taste and imported beer budgets to experience much of what EMM Labs has been offering for years. The Meitner Audio MA-1 DAC a "first" product that many companies could only dream of matching.


       

     

    Meitner Audio MA-1 DAC

    Maitner-MA-1-DAC-Review-aThe Meitner Audio MA-1 is no run-of-the-mill digital to analog converter. The MA-1 has no off-the-shelf DA converter chips rather it has custom discrete 128fs-DSD balanced DACs. The DAC features custom DSP & jitter management, DC coupled discrete Class A balanced output circuitry, and a high isolation synchronous switching power supply. Switching power supplies can and do offer stellar performance in the hands of a good engineering team. The frequency of this switching power supply is locked to the audio clock in one of Meitner's many fanatical design elements that improve performance. The*digital inputs of*MA-1 actually function more like an oscilloscope probe in some respects, because it "samples" the inputs at a very high speed and then decodes the data with an algorithm. According to Meitner Audio the DAC itself achieves picosecond jitter using a single sub-picosecond nanotechnology-based master clock that switches between the 44.1 kHz (44.1, 88.2, 176.4) and 48 kHz (48, 96, 192) time bases. The two frequencies are never active at the same time, further reducing jitter. Other approaches used by competing manufacturers include dual crystal oscillators each operating at either 44.1k or 48k time bases, or a single crystal oscillator operating at both frequencies combined with a PLL (Phase Lock Loop) to synthesize the correct clock rate based on the incoming data stream. Many readers have strong opinions about these clocking schemes. Some opinions are based on theories of what should work best while others are based on what sounds best in a given component. There's no right or wrong answer, but I highly recommend listening to a DAC rather than ruling it in or out based on a clocking scheme or technology alone.

    The Meitner Audio MA-1 supports sampling rates of 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 176.4 and 192kHz at word lengths up to 24 bits through all 6 digital inputs (AES/EBU, 2 x S/PDIF RCA (electrical), 2 x TosLink (optical), and asynchronous USB. The USB input uses an XMOS 500 MHz receiving chip. The MA-1 complies with the USB Class 2 audio standard, not to be confused with USB 2.0. The major blemish in Meitner's MA-1's USB implementation is a lack of galvanic isolation between the computer and the DAC. Other DACs in this class have used transformer-coupling of the input or high speed optical isolators to achieve complete isolation. This lack of galvanic isolation does have a negative sonic impact that I'll cover later in this review.

    Some pertinent acronyms discussed in the user Manual include MFAST and MDAT. According to Meitner Audio MFAST is an asynchronous technology that stands for Meitner Frequency Acquisition System. MFAST acquires the digital signal from any input and buffers it to reduce jitter. This asynchronously decouples the input from output. MDAT is the Meitner Digital Audio Translator. This is responsible for up sampling the audio to 5.6 MHz / 128fs, double the SACD DSD rate of 2.8 MHz / 64fs.
    **
    The aforementioned MA-1 User Manual is lean, to the point, and accurate. This may sound like a given with all high end audio products, but when it comes to computer based audio all bets are off. For example the Esoteric D-07 DAClink I unfavorably reviewed in October 2010. The D-07 manual was incomplete and directed DAC owners to configure their computers to output un-bit-perfect audio streams. The MA-1 manual explains to readers that Class 2 USB Audio devices are natively supported in Mac OS X 10.5.7 and higher as well as on Linux with ALSA 1.0.23 and higher. It's really nice to see a manufacturer telling users to select the Kernal (sic), ASIO, or WASAPI driver from within their music playback application. The alternative can be using the sonically disastrous Windows DirectSound. Meitner recommends using the ASIO drivers on Windows PCs for lower latency. Discussing the TosLink inputs the manual stresses the importance of a proper digital cable and digital source device when using sample rates of 176.4 and 192. Several Computer Audiophile readers have run into an issue (other DACs) only to find out the TosLink cable can make or break big resolution playback. Seemingly little details like this separate the men from the boys.

    The solidly built 16 lbs. Meitner Audio MA-1 has no volume control, thus requiring a preamp in the audio chain. The included MA-1 remote control is as simple as it gets enabling input selection and nothing more. I'm willing to bet most users have a single digital source in their main system. They will use the remote one time then put it away for safekeeping.
     

    Computer Audiophile Review Configurations

    During the MA-1 review period I used several different music servers in an effort to determine sonic differences, if any, between inputs and sensitivity to the source digital signal. Here are the main systems used in my listening room.


    • C.A.P.S. v2.0 server via USB running Windows 7 64-bit, J River Media Center 16, 64 GB SSD, SOtM SATA power filter, and SOtM tX-USB internal PCI to USB converter.

    • Aurender S10 Music Server via S/PDIF (RCA) & AES/EBU with 64GB SSD cache, OCXO clocking, FPGA re-clocking, linear and switching PSUs.

    • Mac Pro (3,1) server via USB running OS X Lion 10.7.1 (11B26), iTunes 10.4.1 (10) 64-bit, Pure Music 1.82, 10 GB RAM, 2 x 2.8 GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon CPUs, and ATi Radeon HD 2600 video card.

    • MacBook Pro (5,5) via USB running OS X Lion 10.7.1 (11B26), iTunes 10.4.1 (10) 64-bit, Amarra 2.3 (4300) full version, 128 GB SSD, 4 GB RAM, 2.26 GHz Intel Core Duo CPU, and NVIDIA GeForce 9400M video card.

    • C.A.P.S. v1.0 server via AES/EBU running Windows 7 32-bit, 60 GB SSD, 2 GB RAM, Merging Technologies Mykerinos with AES daughter card, Merging Technologies Pyramix 7.0 SP3 and Emotion Media Server 1.0.1 Beta 1.

    • Thecus N5200B Pro and Synology DS411slim NAS drives were used for music storage and playback of 50% of the music. The other 50% was stored on local drives. Music file formats were AIFF, WAV, and uncompressed FLAC.


    Notes:
    1. When I first received the MA-1 I had problems playing 176.4 kHz and 192 kHz content from the Aurender S10link via AES and S/PDIF (RCA) and from my Pyramix machine via AES. I couldn't get the MA-1 to lock in the correct sample rate, experienced near constant dropouts, and heard scratchy noises throughout a track. I sent the MA-1 back to Meitner Audio for an update. Upon the DAC's return I could successfully play 176.4 kHz and 192 kHz content from my Pyramixlink machine via AES, and from the Aurender S10 via S/PDIF (RCA). The issue with 4x sample rates from the Aurender S10 to the MA-1 via AES remains unsolved. Aurender and Meitner engineers are currently discussing possible causes and solutions.

    2. Windows XP/Vista/7 does not support the USB Class 2 audio standard. A device driver / software was installed on my C.A.P.S. v2.0link server to support both the 176.4 kHz and 192 kHz sample rates via USB. The software used was version 1.29.0 of the Thesycon USB Audio Class 2.0 driver for Windows. This driver performed flawlessly throughout the review period. After the Thesycon software is installed the USB Audio Class Driver Control Panel is placed in the Windows system tray and set to automatically launch at startup. This 32-bit control panel app consumes between 1.5 MB and 6.5 MB and is unnecessary for audio playback. Simply deleting the shortcut from the Windows startup folder will stop the app from automatically starting when Windows starts.

     

    For Your Listening Pleasure …

    Maitner-MA-1-DAC-Review-bThe Meitner MA-1 DAC was unequivocally the most enjoyable DAC I've had the opportunity to review in recent memory. This DAC simply sucked me in for more and longer listening sessions than most components I've had in my system. In fact I took a break from writing this review to listen to Boz Scaggs' Speak Lowlink album via USB from the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server. Honestly, I had the urge to listen to more music while I still have the MA-1 in my system. Speak Low contains wonderful bass lines throughout most tracks. Played through the MA-1this album sounds vivacious and vivid. The tracks She Was Too Good To Me and Save Your Love For Me offer stellar examples of rich tight bass that is appropriately prominent in the soundstage. The MA-1 reproduces Boz's voice as a wonderfully realistic illusion, an instrument all by itself hanging perfectly between my TAD CR1 Compact Reference loudspeakers. Moving on to Boz's Fade Into Light album and the lead track Lowdown as also pure listening pleasure. This unplugged version of Boz's hit Lowdown has a slow tempo, the usual terrific backing vocals of Lisa Frazier and Kathy Merrick, and the great sax of Norbert Stachel (Aerosmith, Tower of Power, Roger Waters). Lowdown Unplugged has exquisite detail with vibrance in the sax and bass that's do die for through the Meitner Audio MA-1.

    Switching gears to my favorite symphonic piece of music, I had a blast listening to Britten's Orchestra performed by the Kansas City Symphony. I used the Reference Recording's HRx 24/176.4 versionlink of this album to test high resolution audio over USB and the MA-1's transient response. Track 6 Passacaglia caused a 30 minute non-musical detour while I attempted to track down the reason I heard several music dropouts during playback. The answer fortunately had nothing to do with the MA-1 and everything to do with a J River Media Center feature. Passacaglia has a dynamic range score of 19link according to the Pleasurize Music Foundation'slink TT Dynamic Range Meter. This track's incredible dynamic range (large dB disparity between the quiet and loud parts of the track) fools JRMC into thinking there is no music during certain parts of the track. When the JRMC option Do not play silence (leading and trailing) is enabled JRMC skips the first 30 seconds of the track and skips intermittent segments of the track when the music is very quiet. Once I figured this little issue out I was back in my listening chair with what felt like the entire Kansas City Orchestra in my lap. The beginning of Passacaglia was intricately detailed when played through the MA-1 even at very low volume. Between the five and six minute mark of Passacaglia are some awesome musical peaks that enabled the MA-1 to prove it has the right transient chops to compete with other DACs such as the Weiss DAC202, Berkeley Audio Design Alpha DAC, and even the dCS Debussy. In fact the Meitner Audio MA-1 sounds closer to the Debussy than any DAC I've previously heard. I suspect this has something to do with both DACs up sampling techniques that process audio in MHz instead of the typical kHz range of frequencies. The endless but very controlled and rich deep bass is eternally exciting. Nearly six minutes into Passacaglia I felt as if my woofers could end up in my lap any second. Certainly that statement was in jest but what an enjoyable experience listening to such dynamic music through the MA-1.

    At the 2011 California Audio Show I finally remembered to pick up some Bravura Recordslink demonstration tracks from Bill Schnee. These tracks are recorded live to two track at 24/192 and are frequently featured in the TAD suite at RMAF and CES. One track in particular features a drum solo on a small jazz drum kit. I believe the drummer is Simon Philips. A man with a sick amount of musical talent. This four minute clip of music is truly astounding when played through a highly capable audio system. The Meitner MA-1 did not disappoint in any respect. The drums came through as good as I've ever heard them in my room. I would use the terms incredibly accurate but as I wasn't present during the recording session it would be purely conjecture.

    One of my favorite new purchases is Jack Johnson's album Brushfire Fairytales remastered in 2011 and available for downloadlink at 16 bit / 48 kHz. Listening to tracks such as The News, Inaudible Melodies, and Middle Man via the Meitner MA-1's AES interface and the Aurender S10 server I was positive I new the shape, color, and type of wood used for Jack Johnson's guitar. The vibrant illusion created by this DAC was almost palpable. This was also the case listening to Ray LaMontagne's Are We Really Through and This Love Is Over from the God Willin' and the Creek Don't Rise album. Vivid and detailed is the best way to describe this experience. When the lights are off it's easy to slip into the illusion of sitting in Ray's home in Massachusetts where the Grammy nominated (Best Engineering Non-classical) album was recorded. The vocals are so textured and relay so much emotion through the MA-1 that listening with repeat enabled was a common occurrence during the review period.

    Early on in the review period, before I inquired about the intricate technical details of the MA-1, I used my Mac Pro workstation for playback through its USB interface. Immediately I notice something wrong with the sound. Every track, well recorded or not, sounded dull and the higher frequencies seemed completely cut off. The music was unappealing and could not hold my attention long enough to finish an entire track. I switched between all sample rates, playback applications, USB ports and USB cables in an unsuccessful effort to determine the cause of this subpar sound. I new what the MA-1 was capable of as I'd been listening through the Aurender S10 server via AES and S/PDIF (RCA) for weeks. I'd been thrilled with the sound up to this point. After too much dissatisfaction with the sound quality I switched to my C.A.P.S. v2.0 server with an SOtM tX-USB internal PCI to USB converter and SOtM SATA filter. The SOtM SATA filter has individual 12v, 5v, and 3,3v RF noise filters in addition to ripple noise filters. The SOtM tX-USB PCI to USB card in the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server has its own power line noise filter, individual ultra low noise regulators to power up to two attached USB devices, onboard ultra low jitter clock, onboard PCI host controller, and separate power connector. The tX-USB has an easily accessed manual switch that enables/disables sending power over the USB cable to the DAC. The MA-1 does require USB bus power for the USB input to function. As quickly as I noticed something wrong with the previous configuration I noticed how right this setup sounded with incredible details and no digital edge. Running the Meitner Audio MA-1 via USB from the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server was every bit as good as the Aurender S10 via AES if not slightly better in the bass regions. Attack and transients were simply stunning using the Meitner recommend ASIO driver and J River Media Center. Comparing this async USB setup to the Aurender's S/PDIF (RCA) output was no contest as the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server surpassed it in sound quality. Lacking a BNC output may be an Achilles heel for the Aurender S10 if an electrical S/PDIF connection is required. Switching to the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server provided a solution, but I was not entirely sure I new the cause of the problem. I had a hunch it was due to lack of galvanic isolation on the USB input. A lack of such isolation would provide the USB connected computer a direct electrical connection to the DAC's sensitive internal components. I didn't truly know if Meitner had isolated the USB input as I hadn't asked about all the technical details at this point. I followed up with the Meitner Audio team. I was told the MA-1 USB input is not isolated and this was very likely the cause of the sound quality issue I heard when using my Mac Pro workstation with its noisy power supply, spinning drives, video card, and generally noisy internal environment. The Meitner team is very learned in computer technology. We discussed the Mac Pro and how much better many of the newer computers may be when paired with the MA-1. This is because many companies are using laptop type motherboards and power supplies whether the computer is a laptop or desktop. in fact the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server is much closer to a laptop than desktop when considering the internal components. My subsequent results when using a MacBook Pro laptop fit snugly with this explanation. Using a MacBook Pro with Amarra 2.3 and iTunes the sound quality was pretty close to the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server and Aurender S10.

    Recapping my experience with the Meitner Audio MA-1, I preferred the sound quality with the C.A.P.S. v2.0 server via asynchronous USB slightly better than through the Aurender S10 via AES. However I could easily live with the sonics delivered by either source through the MA-1. Without both C.A.P.S. v2.0 and Aurender S10 sources in one's home for extended periods of time the sonic differences may not even be noticeable on many systems. Comparing the Meitner Audio MA-1 to DACs such as the Weiss DAC202, Berkeley Audio Design Alpha DAC, and dCS Debussy reveals what will be a less than a satisfactory answer for readers seeking what Regis Philbin called THE final answer. The DAC202 and Alpha are in one camp while the MA-1 and Debussy are in another camp. Neither twosome is unequivocally the winner of any DAC shootout. Chances are good that listeners will like one camp better than the other. Compared to the MA-1 and Debussy the DAC202 and Alpha sound pretty laid back with a touch more transparency and a skosh less dynamics and vivid bass slam.
     

    (Foregone) Conclusion

    CASH-ListBy now it's a foregone conclusion that the Meitner Audio MA-1 has easily made the Computer Audiophile Suggested Hardware List (C.A.S.H. List)link. Ed Meitner's new Meitner Audio brand is off to a great start with its MA-1 Digital to Analog Converter (DAC). Trickle down technology has enabled Meitner Audio to offer excellent performance at lower prices than the flagship EMM Labs components. The MA-1 with its host of 24/192 capable digital inputs including asynchronous USB is an incredibly enjoyable DAC. Encompassing custom discrete 128fs-DSD balanced DACs, a single non-crystal master clock with sub-picosecond jitter, and Meitner's MFAST and MDAT technologies the nano-tech based MA-1 is not simply assembled by Meitner Audio. Rather the MA-1 was designed from the ground up using technologies that don't come standard with off-the-shelf DACs. The result is a texture rich, exquisitely detailed DAC with wonderfully controlled bass. Despite its unisolated USB input the MA-1 DAC is still on the top of the digital hill with products from Weiss, Berkeley Audio Design, and dCS. I would happily live with the Meitner Audio MA-1 DAC in my system. In fact I have for a couple months. The MA-1 was one of the most enjoyable products I've reviewed in recent memory.

     

     



     

     




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    Comments 113 Comments
    1. The Computer Audiophile's Avatar
      The Computer Audiophile -
      Hi Kevin - This is what I do for a living all day every day. When I have enough first-hand information or personally experienced data points to render an opinion I'm satisfied with, I have no problems expressing that opinion. <br />
      <br />
      By the way are you affiliated with Playback or anyone involved in Playback? Is AK Designs in your signature in anyway related to Andreas K.?<br />
    1. elcorso's Avatar
      elcorso -
      I think Mr. Connaker yours was a very rude response (the first one to @Kevin_O), which is very unusual (on you). This can change the image of what the concept Computer Audiophile is (at least to my eyes).<br />
      <br />
      I can understand you have to protect Computer Audiophile's current and future advertisers, but even John Atkinson's Stereophile was a lot more 'diplomatic' after a very enthusiastic review from Michael Fremer on a Playback Designs unit, since PD did not advertise in his magazine.<br />
      <br />
      I do not see the point of sinking another product in order to appreciate the one <b>you</b> feel is better.<br />
      <br />
      By the way, I don't have any affiliation with Playback Designs, but a very satisfied user. You should listen to PD playing now DSD and DXD!<br />
      <br />
      Best,<br />
      <br />
      Roch<br />
    1. The Computer Audiophile's Avatar
      The Computer Audiophile -
      Hi Roch - Thanks for your valued input. <br />
      <br />
      There is much more going on here than meets the eye. I will not go into detail.<br />
      <br />
      I've never protected current or potential future advertisers. Suggesting this is really taking a shot at the CA readership by inferring they can't see through something like this. If I ever favored current or potential future advertisers CA readers would be all over me would never come back to the site. If you have one ounce of evidence of this favoritism please come forward with it and air it publicly for the world to see. Otherwise I think unfounded inferences or blatant statements to this effect are harmful to all involved.<br />
      <br />
      I don't believe I sunk another product by providing my opinion of the very product mentioned by the person posting. I simply gave reasons why I would not select the product over the MA-1. If I wouldn't have given reasons you may have written to me as well.<br />
      <br />
      I have heard the PD playing 2.8224 MHz DSD (64fs) and 5.6448 MHz DSD (128fs). That's one reason I felt comfortable leaving such a comment. <br />
      <br />
    1. elcorso's Avatar
      elcorso -
      Hi Chris, thanks for your answer!<br />
      <br />
      I understand an audio reviewer, a forum manager or owner, can have a passion after listening some gear, music, et al. It is part of our humanity be enthusiastic in our passions, and definitively you are a music lover. Since I'm in the same passion, you are welcome!<br />
      <br />
      There are few ways to listen to Playback Designs under <b>native</b> DSD, and also few music on this format. I have the chance and privilege to do it (by the USB-X interface) with some experimental software, but I can not talk about this right now. I guess you, and all with computer music playback, will have the chance in a short time and listen and think different about DSD on PD.<br />
      <br />
      I do apologize with you for my (also) passionate reply.<br />
      <br />
      Roch
    1. Brian A's Avatar
      Brian A -
      Quoting uvrmd on Tue, 09/20/2011 - 13:46:<br />
      <br />
      “… I had a long conversation with Greg at EMM Labs this morning … the Toslink input, surprisingly, Greg recommended this input as the best sounding…”<br />
      <br />
      Scandal! This goes against all common wisdom on this website.<br />
    1. uvrmd's Avatar
      uvrmd -
      If you think that that's scandalous, consider his assertion that a cheap plastic toslink from Monoprice is as good or better than name brand versions! My unit is on order and I'm going to connect it via a Cardas Clear USB cable. The only toslink output on my iMac is the headphone output, so I'm pretty sure it will be inferior, but I will buy a toslink interconnect and compare.<br />
      <br />
      -Uday
    1. Ghasley's Avatar
      Ghasley -
      Hey, cut Chris a break! <br />
      <br />
      He was only stating what he heard regarding the Playback Designs unit at that time. While I believe the MPD-3 is a phenominal sounding DAC in my system, it is brand new and he probably hasn't heard it. <br />
      <br />
      We can all admit that the USB implementation prior to the introduction of the external box was likely less than optimal on the MPS-5 SACD player/DAC. I chose the MPD-3 because it seemed to me to be a clean sheet, computer audio optimized DAC. The USB implementation is fantastic.<br />
      <br />
      Other DACs I have owned, in order of most recent:<br />
      Berekley Alpha DAC<br />
      Audio Research DAC8<br />
      NAIM<br />
      Wadia 581i<br />
      Mcintosh MDA1000<br />
      CARY 306SACD<br />
      Benchmark<br />
      <br />
      In my system, the Playback Designs MPD-3 is the best digital I have heard (analog like in its delivery) but I am also positive the Meitner is a fantastic DAC as well. Horses for courses as they say.<br />
      <br />
      I will again reiterate that we are ALL very fortunate that even marginal products these days are terrific! Sound quality in the sub-$1,000 DAC arena rivals ANYTHING you could purchase 10 years ago.<br />
      <br />
      Keep up the great work Chris!
    1. dapost's Avatar
      dapost -
      Hi Tarik, all,<br />
      <br />
      I have been listening to the Weiss DAC202 for the last year and I agree that its 2.12Vrms output setting sounds more punchy / dynamic but less natural. Hence, I use the 1.06Vrms setting. <br />
      <br />
      Great review, by the way!
    1. pawel8's Avatar
      pawel8 -
      I agree with your evaluation of previous USB implementations.<br />
      Also we all should appreciate Chris for his work and this website.<br />
      For past 6 months I have been searching for perfect DAC and I was unsuccessful.<br />
      I have tried Debussy,DAC 8,simaudio dac100d,Primare I 22,Hegel H10 and H20 and Berkeley Alpha.<br />
      Only twice I was smiling to MacMini ripped CDs:Alpha DAC and Audio Research DAC 8.<br />
      I returned both to the dealer for 2 reasons:<br />
      Berkeley is coming with series II and Audio Research with DSPre(preamp with built in DAC 8.<br />
      What would be your ranking in order of best sounding DAC?<br />
      Currently I am using Mcintosh C50(no high resolution)
    1. Priaptor's Avatar
      Priaptor -
      I have heard and owned a lot of equipment. I thought the DAC 8 was very good, started realizing the synergy with the system compared to others. Their combo Pre/DAC is interesting and appears to be price competitive.<br />
      <br />
      As a standalone, the DAC 8 is 5K + price of preamp. So I think evaluating the DAC 8 as a standalone needs to be put in this price context. I use a REF 5 and DAC 8, which together is more than most of the "top tier" price wise, if you are going to use the DAC without a preamp. Their new unit will obviously be much cheaper.<br />
      <br />
      The point I make and I can't stress enough is how much synergy makes a difference. By no means do I think I have the "best" system but have come to appreciate that when buying from a company like Audio Research there is a synergy among their components much greater than the sum of their parts. I have recently taken delivery of their new REF 250 monoblock amps (to replace my very good McIntosh MC2301 monoblocks and the 250s now replace their prior REF 210) and can say, IMHO, I have yet to hear any system anywhere matching what I am now achieving through my Nola Baby Grands.<br />
      <br />
      Lastly, while waiting for REF 250s, I did send back the DAC 8 in order for AR to rebuild the USB circuit (replace the power board and USB board and connectors) as I was having "intermittent" issues through the USB connector. They now solder all components and it is hard for me to tell if sonically there is a difference because the addition of the REF 250 happened at the same time. All I can say is that the synergy of DAC 8, REF 5 and REF 250 is like nothing I have ever heard, including the some very fine gear such as DCS. <br />
      <br />
      Once upon a time I was an audio dealer, sold and had access to a ton of equipment and must admit I was NOT an Audio Research fan. Their new gear is truly unique and while the benefits of each component can and does stand on its own merit, their synergy when combined as a "system" is truly unique. <br />
      <br />
      Happy hunting.<br />
      <br />
    1. barrows's Avatar
      barrows -
      I have to applaud Chris for this review, and his honest and straightforward approach of stating his preferences amongst the DACs mentioned.<br />
      Funny, that those who seem to take issue with Chris' comments re the Playback Designs DACs have not even heard the Meitner! You guys might actually want to listen to the DAC under review before questioning Chris' opinion. Additionally, remember, that this is only one person's opinion, and you might not agree-Chris did not say the Playback Designs sounded "bad", just that he feels the Meitner is better.<br />
      Interestingly, many here seem to criticize the reviews of the mainstream publications in the high end, specifically for not comparing components against each other-kudos to Chris for doing so.<br />
      On toslink: if the Meitner does incorporate a truly asynchronous buffer for de-jittering SPDIF inputs, providing complete re-clocking with a very accurate clock, the optical connection should indeed be able to perform at a very high level. A true asynchronous buffer is a very unusual feature, and is expensive and difficult to implement.<br />
      USB isolation: I am beginning to wonder how advantageous this can be. After investigating the options what I have found is that USB 2 HS cannot be isolated with presently available affordable technology, as the isolators do not have enough bandwidth. The common approach is then to provide isolation at the I2S output of the USB receiver: unfortunately, the devies used to provide this isolation add jitter (the best isolators appear to add ~100 pS jitter or so). Right now, I am using a non-isolated asynchronous USB-I2S receiver in my DAC. With a laptop this approach is providing excellent performance, better than I had with the Wavelink-SPDIF (powered by an external supply) which is isolated by a transformer on the SPDIF output. It may be, that with proper attention to playback details, a non-isolated USB interface can actually outperform an isolated one. Note that my interfcae runs on an internal, isolated, power supply, not the USB bus power.
    1. 4est's Avatar
      4est -
      "Funny, that those who seem to take issue with Chris' comments re the Playback Designs DACs have not even heard the Meitner! You guys might actually want to listen to the DAC under review before questioning Chris' opinion. Additionally, remember, that this is only one person's opinion, and you might not agree-Chris did not say the Playback Designs sounded "bad", just that he feels the Meitner is better."<br />
      <br />
      I applaud Chris' stating his preferences clearly. I do not always agree with him, but I find comfort in his not hiding those preferences.
    1. gcorley's Avatar
      gcorley -
      I can actually count on one hand the number of audio reviewers who state opinions clearly enough to be of any practical use and who actually compare competing products using controversial and dangerous language like "better"!<br />
      <br />
      We obviously don't all have to agree with Chris' opinion, but I sure appreciate his directness.<br />
      <br />
      Bravo and keep up the good work!
    1. Priaptor's Avatar
      Priaptor -
      Compared to most other reviewers, I find Chris' reviews some of the most informative. Regardless of whether I am buying based on his recommendations, when I have been in the market for a change, I can always count on his unbiased reviews for guidance.<br />
      <br />
      Several months ago, in my quest to review DACs, I found Chris's comments on the Debussy and Meitner most helpful. The only issue I found, as I have stated in my prior posts, was system dependency, something I think and not a criticism of Chris or his reviews, we all must take into account when determining what is "best" for respective purposes. <br />
    1. tmokbel's Avatar
      tmokbel -
      Hi dapost,<br />
      It's nice to see I'm not alone in my observations and from the sounds of it, you've found a good match you like with the Weiss DAC202, it's outputs and the rest of your system.<br />
      I agree, great review from Chris on the Meitner and his reply to my question was more or less right in that how dac's sound and the synergy found is system dependent. My power amps input sensitivity is 0.8v/30db and only requires around 1Vrms from a source to make it come alive. Many power amps have input sensitivities requiring higher voltage than that to make them sing so the standard 2Vrms or more would be a better match.
    1. AudioCynic's Avatar
      AudioCynic -
      The usual response to the mention of toslink to audiophiles is at best derision. Yet Meitner says its their BEST performing interface. How can that be?
    1. budt's Avatar
      budt -
      Hi Chris<br />
      I have been hanging around here for about a year now and finally decided to register..Great review by the way !!! As far as the PD owner crying foul, well I think we all have a good idea who that is.<br />
      I was wondering if you have had a chance to hear the new Invicta dac? ANy comments good or bad would be appreciated..<br />
    1. Erwin S's Avatar
      Erwin S -
      Maybe this review on 6 moons helps also.<br />
      <br />
      http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/resonessence/1.html
    1. catastrofe's Avatar
      catastrofe -
      especially the comment about the bass.<br />
      <br />
      I've had the following DACs in my system for demo over the past 4 months: Meitner MA-1, Playback Designs MPS-5 (not a true DAC, but DAC capability nonetheless), Weiss DAC202, and MSB Platinum DAC IV. My reference DAC at the time was a PS Audio Perfectwave.<br />
      <br />
      Each of these units provides different levels of functionality, and they have their own tonal signature.<br />
      <br />
      The Meitner has excellent balance as Chris mentioned. I immediately noticed the bass performance. . .it was not subtle. I referenced this in a previous post about my MA-1 experience. The general improvement over the PWD was very clear. Unfortunately, the Meitner lacks some "creature comforts" that I wanted.<br />
      <br />
      The Weiss was an all-around performer, and connection via Firewire sounded great. It was a little "lighter" sounding (going from memory as I didn't have the MA-1 on hand) than the Meitner, but slightly more coherent and solid than the PWD. Not significant, but definitely noticeable.<br />
      <br />
      The MPS-5 sounded terrible in my system, connected via USB. To be fair, the unit was limited to 16/48 using this type of connection. I removed it from my system after about 30 minutes. . .it sounded lean and recessed. Unlistenable to my ears.<br />
      <br />
      The Platinum DAC IV was the best performer in my system. It had the features I was looking for and provides for future upgrades. The sound is balanced and detailed, with nothing lacking or exaggerated. I ended up purchasing the Signature version of this unit. <br />
      <br />
      If I were to rank these DACs in descending order it would be:<br />
      <br />
      MSB Platinum DAC IV<br />
      Meitner MA-1<br />
      Weiss DAC202<br />
      PS Audio PWD<br />
      Playback Designs MPS-5<br />
      <br />
      The ususal caveat applies. . .this was in my system with my ears. YMMV.<br />
      <br />
      Bob<br />
    1. uvrmd's Avatar
      uvrmd -
      Just received my MA-1* via FedEx today. I'll let it burn in for a few days, then will let you all know how it sounds in my system:<br />
      <br />
      Jeff Rowland Concentra (series 1)<br />
      Wilson Audio Sophia Loudspeakers (series 1)<br />
      Cardas Neutral Reference interconnects and speaker cables<br />
      Cardas Clear USB cable<br />
      Cardas Twinlink and Cardas Cross power cords<br />
      <br />
      *replaces a Logitech Transporter with Halide Design S/PDIF bridge, which will remain in the system for internet radio.<br />
      <br />
      Update:<br />
      <br />
      With great anticipation, I hooked up the MA-1 and loaded an album into Amarra 2.3 running on my iMac. Nothing! Hmmm. I checked AudioMidi and lo and behold, it was not recognizing the DAC. I tried several times and managed to acquire the DAC a few times, but the sound was overlaid with pops and crackles, as if I was listening to a dirty LP. I dashed off an email to Meitner and got an immediate reply. Assuming something was wrong with the cable, I was asked to replace the Cardas Clear USB cable with a generic USB cable, which I pilfered from my printer. Immediately the DAC was recognized. I then loaded in the 24/96 version from HDtracks of Claudio Abbado conducting Beethoven's 9th. I've had this recording on CD since its release in 2000 and in 24/96 since its release on HDtracks and I have always felt that the sound quality was not up to the performance. No longer. Wow, what a difference. I was up way past midnight listening to one album after another, in varying resolutions from 16/44.1 all the way up to 24/192, and every recording was like a new revelation. All this, using a cheap USB cable and it's not even burned in yet...